Your thoughts in PFD enforcement.

[lew]

Hi guys, I was up at a Nippissing lodge the last 2 weeks and a couple incidents with some other guests and the OPP marine unit had me wondering if they could have been handled differently.

 

1st was a man and his mother out for a boat ride.

 

They had all the required safety gear and both were wearing life jackets and had another 2 spare jackets in the boat.

 

The OPP stopped them for the usual check and everything in the boat was OK except the life jacket the man was wearing had a tear in the back. The cop told him that was illegal and gave him a ticket for $240.

 

The jacket the mother was wearing was OK as were the 2 spares but the cop didn't care and told him he could fight it in Sudbury court if he wanted.

 

2nd incident involved another family and the same cop a couple days later.

 

A family of 5 from Pittsburg was out for a boat ride and all were wearing life jackets when they were stopped. Again everything in the boat was good except for the life jacket one child was wearing. It was rated for 50-90 pounds and the cop said the child looked lighter than 50 and gave them a $240 ticket and again said they could travel back to Canada to fight it.

 

The child had a medical check-up the previous week and weighted 48 pounds but they didn't tell the cop as they just wanted to get away from him.

 

In my opinion, $240 is alot of money considering everybody was wearing life jackets in both boats and everything else was perfect and I think a warning would have been sufficient in both cases and just tell them to both correct the problem before coming out in the boat again.

 

Am I right or wrong with my thinking ??

[Joeytier]

Oh boy, that's brutal!!

[davey buoy]

I agree Lew,look like he was splitting hairs.Most likely trying to reach his quota?

[Fisherman]

Some are real nit pickers and some are real nitwits. A warning would have sufficed at the very most.

[misfish]

Seems like a jack to me Lew. Then again,maybe he,s been involved in some bad mishaps and takes the law to the serious point. PFD,s save lives.

 

As for the torn jacket,he is right, BUT, come on..They had extras. Then again,then had extras and should of known better?

[bigugli]

Right now, just about every ministry in Ontario is on a ticket blitz. Must be trying to find additional funds for the Wynne Wishlist, or the $20 billion transit plan. There have been 4 different provincial agencies blitzing the St Jakobs market this past month.

[leaf4]

what a d!ck! that's seriously messed up. how can you issue a ticket on a child because he doesn't look 50lbs I would understand if it was clearly 20lbs or in that area but come on, and against tourists to boot, way to ruin their vaca and good luck having them come back and spend more tourist dollars here.

[outllaw]

lew. the opp used there gestapo procedures here in l.s.clair. they made the news weekly. even the Windsor star ran an article. as cops say ..same m.o. .

down here we swear they take folks to anal school train them that way. sorry if this offends folks but I have seen lots on the water,some of it pretty sketchy. those tourist have been slammed. . if the moderaters delete this I understand,but from the perspective you get more flies with honey not vinegar.

[kickingfrog]

On the face of it, it sure sounds like they are giving tickets and not expecting someone to come back and fight it.

 

 

In the first case if either of the other 2 lifejackets were "legal"then the ticket is completely bogus.

 

In the second case I guess the ticket is technically legit but without a scale how does the officer know that the kids is 48lb instead of 50?

 

 

It's one thing if people are legitimately putting themselves or others in danger, or are egregiously contrary to the law, but this sure sounds like someone emptying a ticket book.

[grt1]

I heard a news item the other day on the radio where a group of 4 were charged by the officers on a fly in lake because they weren't wearing their pfds. I asked the officers in our detachment and they told me the life jackets had to be in the boat but it didn't matter if they were worn or not. the only exception to this is if they are the inflatable then they have to be worn at all times. now I see there was an ad on tv sponsored by the opp where they say the law has changed and the inflatable must be within an arms length of the person who is supposed to be wearing it.

 

this all sounds kind of like the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing.

[Salmonidstalker]

If the OPP deems the life jacket unsafe even if you're wearing one then you can be charged. Could it be handled differently, absolutely no question. I'm guessing bad weather this summer meant less boating, which means less income from fines on the water. OR, the officer probably found other things wrong and let them off with a smaller fine.

 

I also agree with the law with respect to whether or not the officer deems the life jacket is safe to use. I like to see enforcement, it means people are out making sure others are being protected. The word gets out fast with fines and with death on the water. People should put safety as a top priority, not fun.

Edited August 25, 2014 by VXP

[kickingfrog]

So I can have 2 legal lifejackets stowed on the boat and wear nothing which is perfectly legal.

 

But if I have the same 2 lifejackets stowed and I'm wearing another that has a tear that gets me a ticket?

[Salmonidstalker]

So I can have 2 legal lifejackets stowed on the boat and wear nothing which is perfectly legal.

 

But if I have the same 2 lifejackets stowed and I'm wearing another that has a tear that gets me a ticket?

My guess is the stowed away life jackets weren't proper fitting.

Edited August 26, 2014 by VXP

[Spanky80]

The local OPP detachment in Petawawa has a sign out in front of their building where they put words of wisdom...early summer that had something along the lines of "The only useful PFD is the one that is on you". I contacted the detachment and reminded them what the law was, and to please stick to enforcing the laws we already have, there are many of them for you to choose from.

 

It is sad what we have allowed as acceptable in this nanny province. The level of enforcement on the waterways would NEVER be acceptable on the roads.

[LostAnotherOne]

Totally agree with you. $240 is almost the same amount as if you are caught texting while driving which is $280. Both in my opinion aren't even close, but the OPP has to keep people in check cause it does save lives. I also think they ran into the wrong OPP officer.

[Bernie]

I agree with your thinking Lew.
In most cases if they suggested putting on a different life jacket and trashing the old one would have been sufficient.
They certainly are not making themselves look good in the eyes of the public. No wonder I and others take a different route when they are spotted in the area.

[Sinker]

The last time I was stopped by OPP they ran into my boat so hard that they almost capsized me. Water came over the opposite gunnel, it tipped me so much. I can walk the gunnels on my boat, its that stable.

 

They stopped us for a routine check while we were duck hunting, and tried to give my dad and I the gears for wearing camo mustang survival suits(we had other PFDs on board), then tried to give us a hard time about my 10 million candle spotlight not being able to float and wasnt water proof (I had the useless little light that comes in the kit as well....and it worked). My old man lost it on these clowns, and asked them to go pick on the next boat that had 4 guys with no lifejackets on. This was in December on the bay of quinte, and it was a nasty day!

 

They left. Didnt even ask for our hunting or firearms license....nothing. No appology for ramming us though. Jerks!

 

S.

[OhioFisherman]

I would imagine it's a lot easier to write tickets on people less likely to travel a long distance to fight them? How many people will travel a long distance and spend more money on it than the cost of the ticket? They may just decide not to come back? That would be just great for the tourism industry?

[NANUK]

So much for promoting tourism,

[bigbuck]

Reminds me of Roscoe P Coltrane sheriff of Hazard County. People need to tAke the time to fight these types of nonsense tickets. Judges do not look kindly to police officers who issue them. I got a Bull ticket last year just south of Bala. I got pulled over, the officer told me I was speeeding (I was 5k over the limit) and proceeds to give me a ticket for failure to obey sign, looking in my rearview, I did not even see a radar gun on the dash. He didnt know how fast I was going and when he ran my plate and saw I was from out of town, he pulled me over and gave me a vague ticket. I took the time to go to court, the officer was shockeed to see me there, as soon as my name was called, the crown stood and asked to have it dismissed because of a lack of evidence. On my way out I said to the officer ' have a great day Roscoe'. He knew exactly what I meant and his face turned red. Great way to promote tourism.

[OhioFisherman]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/wearing-life-jackets-should-be-mandatory-opp-1.948856

 

Did they actually ever change the law, or are they enforcing non existent ones?

[Joey]

I also agree with you Lew. Sometimes you get the good cop and sometimes you get the bad cop. Certainly not worth driving up to Sudbury court to fight it so they know you have not much choice.

 

 

It's a shame some of them have to act that way, but sometimes they get the "God" complex and are better than everyone. Hope they sleep well at night

[Dara]

My guess is the stowed away life jackets weren't proper fitting.

 

 

What possible reason could you have for GUESSING that

[thegrumpyfisherman]

I got stopped by the MNR in South River in the spring, amazing the different approaches the two take. The fellows who stopped me asked to see my two licenses and that was it. Didn't ask for safety equipment or even to see in my live well. Reminded me of the new Walleye regs and away they went. Have yet to run into cops on the water but I'm sure my time will come. Sounds like I'm better off stowing the life jacket, can't split hairs if its in storage!

[lew]

Thanks for your replies folks and am happy to hear most are in agreement with me that both these incidents could have been handled in a much better fashion.

 

I've always been 100% pro cop and have been stopped many times on the water and have never had a bad experience with any of them, but a couple guys like the ones in my post can sure make the good ones look bad and paint them all with the same brush.