NF - Sump pump nightmare

[atvaholic]

Hey, reaching out to you all to see if anyone might have a solution to this nightmare...

 

Bought a new house about 10 years ago. All was well for the first 3 years, in the spring we had our sump pump give out and it flooded the basement a little. I thought 3 years was a little low, I thought the pump was under powered, so I upgraded from 1/3 to 1/2 horsepower - and not one of the cheapest pumps either.

 

I replaced it myself and thought we were good to go for years to come. Around 2.5 - 3 years years, and I had the same problem, another spring flood in the basement. This time, I noticed there was some oil in the sump pit, likely from the pump.

 

I called someone to assist with this as I thought these pumps should last longer, and maybe there was something I was missing. He came and suggested we clean all the muck and debris out of the pit, and get something to lift the pump off the bottom to keep it a little cleaner, should make it last a long time. Wrong. With the rain last week it flooded yet again. I was smart enough to install a sump alarm this time, but unlucky enough not to be home when it went off..

 

So this time the sump was full to the top. I tried to manipulate the float to see if it was stuck. Pump would not turn on. Plugged it in directly and it worked, Tried to plug it through the valve and now that worked, sucked all the water out. Watched it for a couple of days and it worked flawlessly.

 

Yesterday alarm went off again.Sump was almost full. Pump wasn't working at all. I tried another outlet thinking the outlet is bad, no go. Pump is pretty much dead. Sometimes it turns on, sometimes it doesn't. Looks like i'll be replacing it yet again.

 

Wondering if anyone has had any experience like this, or any idea whats going on? Doesn't sound normal to me. Asked the neighbors and they have yet to replace their sump pumps.

 

 

[wkrp]

Replace the pump. Looks like you have a bad one.

[wallyboss]

Get a bucket and drill a bunch of holes in it from about 3-4" from the bottom up to the top and set you pump in it. That should stop any dirt or muck to get into the pump and burn it out.

[Cast-Away]

Another suggestion is to have a backup pump in the hole with the float set at a higher level. It will only come on when the other pump fails.

[Dutch]

You need a battery back up.

[aplumma]

I install Zoeller M53 pumps with great success they carry a 3 year warranty. Your sump pit must be the correct size for pumps to live a healthy life. It is the starting process that hurts the most on electric motors. Your pit should be a standard size pit if it is not a black pit with a lid then you will need to install the correct one.

it should be about 36 inches around and 3ft deep. A sump pump is not designed to remove debris it is a semi clear dewatering pump if your house has the correct dewatering barrier around the house you should be getting minimal amount of trash and debris. Installing a bucket with holes drilled in it will make the pump short cycle and will lead to early failure. Putting it on bricks means the pump will also cycle more often so it is not advised. Battery back up pumps are only if the electricity goes out. Most of the battery pumps are very under powered and people neglect the batteries and usually the run time of the set up is to short to be of any value. This means a poor battery will not run the pump at 100 percent if the battery is lower than that and as it losses power so does the efficiency of the pump. Oil on the water means the pump overheated meaning usually the float hung up and it ran without water around it to cool it off. A pump that has a separate float rather than one that has a float on a SHORT carriage is more likely to malfunction.

 

Art

[DanD]

Another suggestion is to have a backup pump in the hole with the float set at a higher level. It will only come on when the other pump fails.

 

That's a great idea and what my son has in his sump.

Just make sure you water test both pumps, at least a couple times a year. Why I say water test it, is that my son's back up pump would turn on electrically; but the seals in that pump were shot and couldn't pump any water.

We were able to find a seal kit, that came with a tube of silicone grease to lube the seals and vane tips.

 

Dan.

[OhioFisherman]

https://www.amazon.com/Hydromatic-W-A1-Cast-Iron-Sump/dp/B0054K35BW

 

I have 3 of these for my home, one in a crock in my basement, one in an outside footer drain crock, and one in my septic tank.

 

My home is now 27 years old and no problems with the pumps themselves, a couple of float switches have gone bad, but the piggyback style of float switch makes them easy to replace and to keep a spare float switch on hand.

 

I replaced all of them about 5 years ago, same brand, Hydromatic, and same style, my old ones all still work, look kind of roady now, but good enough for emergency spares.

 

Where does your crock drain to? Do you have sidewalks? any of them sinking? Ice or leaves down your gutters?

[atvaholic]

 

I replaced all of them about 5 years ago, same brand, Hydromatic, and same style, my old ones all still work, look kind of roady now, but good enough for emergency spares.

 

Where does your crock drain to? Do you have sidewalks? any of them sinking? Ice or leaves down your gutters?

 

You mean the pump? It shoots it outside via a pipe, and drains into another pipe. Not sure where it goes from there. No sidewalks, no problem with ice in the gutters.

[Old Ironmaker]

I have no experience in sump pumps other than to lend my Jenny to the neighbours when the power goes out. I have experienced shallow well pump wars. I was so sick and tired of changing them every 2 to 3 years I went out and broke the bank on a Grunfos. Stainless steel impellor, body, etc. 5 year warranty and it is still going after 7, paid for itself.

 

I see now that here when they dig a basement along the lake here they run a line with a check valve from the sump directly out and down hill if there is enough elevation. Most of our properties are elevated from the shoreline. No pump, float, power, nada. Nice to let Mom Nature work and she usually does the best job. Price a Grunfos, not cheap but they work like a plow horse and last more than a few years. If I were you I would be making sure that sump pump is working every time it rains. Art any experience with Grunfos (sic) pumps?

 

Art has spoken, listen carefully, there is a pipe bitter that knows of what he speaks.

Edited April 10, 2017 by Old Ironmaker

[Cast-Away]

You might want to read this: http://sumppumpjudge.com/#Our_Top_12_Recommended_Sump_Pump_Comparison_Table

[OhioFisherman]

You mean the pump? It shoots it outside via a pipe, and drains into another pipe. Not sure where it goes from there. No sidewalks, no problem with ice in the gutters.

 

 

Yes, I meant the pump. My first home, which I bought new had a concrete sidewalk from the drive to the front door, after about 5 years a section of the sidewalk started sinking, restricting the water flow from the sump pump pipe, it had to run longer than normal to get the job done.

 

I had a concrete patio put on the back of my garage, near my outside footer drain crock, a fairly good sized diesel bobcat was used for the excavation, and repeatedly ran over the buried pipe outlet for that causing the same problem.

 

What model of pump? Some seem pretty chintzy to me? No power outage problems?

[SirCranksalot]

I have 2 pumps as well, but even then I have had probs. The float switch got stuck on one because it lay idle for a long time and gummed up or rusted a bit. It's hard for me, at least. to test it with water because any water I dump in the sump to try to test it will immediately drain out. I'd have to undo the piping and use a big bucket of water somehow.

 

I put my pump up on a brick and don't see a prob with that. It doesn't necessarily mean it cycles more often. It can mean that it cycles less---it allows me to set the 'on' level to a higher elevation and I can keep the 'off' level to the same elev as it was w/o the brick.

[Big Cliff]

I have a "water detector alarm" that can be set up to dial a phone # if the alarm goes off. I bought it about three years ago from Home Hardware so I would never be caught with my basement flooding (after a water heater burst and flooded the basement LOL.) It's a good one, I paid about $250.00 for it but when we sold our house it wasn't included. If you want it, you can have it free. Won't fix your pump but you'll never be caught with your basement flooded again.

 

PM me if you want it and we'll arrange to get it to you.

[Rizzo]

are you on city water by any chance? If you are I have a great option for you

[ch312]

You should get a sump pump that resists clogs and can pass solids. I bought a Red Lion stainless and cast iron 1/2 hp to replace a pedestal pump and it's awesome. Super quiet, 5 year warranty, high flow, and unlike many pumps it's designed to pump solids up to 3/4" so it greatly reduces the risk of a clog, which would over heat and burn out your pump as the float will keep telling it to pump even though water is not being removed. They depend on water for cooling.

 

Also, your pump should be on it's own breaker with a GFCI receptacle if it isn't already.

 

As for battery backups, you can keep the battery charged and maintained using a battery tender or noco smart charger. The sky is the limit as to how many batteries you install and if your power goes out often it may be wise to buy 4 batteries and use a 4 bank smart charger to keep them charged and maintained. Two battery backups with two batteries each would be a good setup too with the floats set a different heights. Main pump fails, first battery powered unit kicks in, and if that dies or can't keep up the second battery powered unit will start pumping.

 

Wallyboss is correct about the bucket and it will not cause any short cycling as it's nothing more than a barrier between the pump and solids entering the basin. The water will enter and be removed at the same rate as with a basin and no bucket.

 

 

 

If you're on city water, a Sump Buddy uses the pressure from your water supply to create negative pressure which pumps the water from your basin. Sure, your water bill will reflect it's use, but they're great because they don't require electricity and work purely off city water supply.

[ch312]

Almost forgot about the check valve. Make sure you have one installed and it's working properly as they prevent water in the line from falling back into the basin after the pump shuts off. A missing or malfunctioning check valve means the pump cycles more and reduces its life.

[Mister G]

Get rid of the submersible sump pump and now HALF of your problems are gone. Get a pedistal sump pump from Wayne and get their best one. Now it doesn't matter the size of your sump hole and the motor is out of the water where it's protected. I changed mine out after 33 years because it was getting noisy but it still worked.

https://www.sumppumpsdirect.com/Wayne-SPV800-Sump-Pump/p2467.html

 

 

Then get a water driven back up sump pump if you have city water. This way it does matter if the electric goes out or not. I put in a Liberty back up pump after a lot of research. Easy to install just make sure you use a 3/4 feed line and not a 1/2" line.

 

https://www.sumppumpsdirect.com/Liberty-Pumps-SJ10-Sump-Pump/p8545.html

[Rizzo]

Bingo, thats what I was referring to...I also have a water-driven liberty pump...no alarm, no battery, no generator etc...easy peasy piece of mind

[Dutchy]

We went through 2 sump pumps in 4 years, thankfully with no major floods. Our house is only 7 years old. Doesn't seem right. We ended up bringing in a plumbing company who did some thing in the pit (and I don't know what it was) and put in a certain make of sump pump (Edit, we had bought a pump and when they saw what we had they laughed and said no. Its not like the pump they put in was expensive compared to the one we bought). No problems since. That was 2 years ago. I can go down and see what make it is if you want. We have alot of standing water near our house.

Edited April 15, 2017 by Dutchy

[sumppumpadvisor]

If anyone find some reliable sump pumps then read out our guides at http://www.sumppumpadvisor.com/. Might this guide helpful for you. Thanks

[Walshskie]

Sump pumps should NEVER be on a GFCI receptacle, they will trip every time. And its in the electrical code.

[myot]

Put in a battery backup best $500 you'll ever spend

 

Dan

[Sumppumpcenter]

You need to read this article. If you need sump pumps: https://www.sumppumpcenter.com/

[Jmeyer]

You shouldn't be burning out pumps that quick, if I were you I would be checking the outlet pipe. Does your pump come on quickly after a rain ? Does it run steady during a rain or in the wet months? Is your basement lower then your neighbours ? Are you in sand or clay? Maybe your in the water table? Your pump should keep up regardless unless your outlet is bad and your just recycling water or There is to much of a load on your outlet pipe with added trough water on the same pipe. It's not attractive but it works, have your sump outlet above grade then drain it straight down to the storm sewer pipe, if there's any resistance the pit water will still boil out from the top if the load is to great down lower. Sounds like a storm sewer pipe issue to me.