Driver charged with death of passenger - breaking through ice

[KawarthaAngler]

Just a FYI.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/driver-charged-with-mans-death-in-crash-through-lake-ice/ar-BBUDHvk?li=AAggXBV

[lew]

Just my opinion, but if the passenger willingly got in the car knowing they were gonna be driving on the ice he's as much responsible as the driver was and I see no reason the driver should be charged with the death.

No different than 2 friends walking across the ice on foot and they fall through and one dies and one lives, why would the survivor be charged with anything ?

[Terry]

I agree unless the other person is under age. Which he was not They both made the decision to go on the ice.  Driver and passenger responsible for their own decisions 

[Garnet]

Maybe they where fishing just out joy riding.

[Reef Runner]

Charged not convicted, so there's a presumption of innocence here on both charges.

I can see the argument if you've made the decision to get in the car but if the driver makes a bad/reckless judgment call like says "hey lets try and skip this open patch of water over there" and start gunning for it, what are you going to do?

I don't know all the details so don't want to comment more; condolences to the family of the lost

[Whitespinnerbait]

When a driver gets a speeding ticket or runs a red light.........not to sure the passenger is to pay half the fine.

[ketchenany]

Yes they made that decision to go out unfortunately one died, sad to hear.

Last week two kids died  (15 and 11) going on ice at midnight. Of all hours. What were they thinking and where were the parents. I saw a news report how they lost great kids. . .  But nothing about their responsibilities. 

RIP, every year the OPP and others warn about ice conditions but some won’t listen.

Many years ago off the 9th solid ice about a mile out and at shore one of our guys went through in three feet of water. drainage ditch was flowing underneath.

[bassman87]

"When a driver gets a speeding ticket or runs a red light.........not to sure the passenger is to pay half the fine."

 

I'm not sure what this has to do with the situation.

Edited March 11, 2019 by bassman87

[bassman87]

2 hours ago, Terry said:

I agree unless the other person is under age. Which he was not They both made the decision to go on the ice.  Driver and passenger responsible for their own decisions 

Amen.

[Rizzo]

If the driver acted recklessly that's one thing, but if it was "normal" conditions I can't see the charges sticking. My buddy once drove out but I made the decision to walk because I had my concerns of safety. Sucker took my car though! Saw it go whipping past me on the ice, rotten bugger

[chris.brock]

1 hour ago, ketchenany said:

 

Last week two kids died  (15 and 11) going on ice at midnight. Of all hours. What were they thinking and where were the parents.

The parents were with them but managed get out of the water. Late night, drunken snowmobiling is inherently dangerous, to bring kids along is just plain stupid. 

If my son and I are in the water, I'm helping him get out even if I don't make it out. 

I don't understand what happened there.

Edited March 12, 2019 by chris.brock

[ketchenany]

44 minutes ago, chris.brock said:

The parents were with them but managed get out of the water. Late night, drunken snowmobiling is inherently dangerous, to bring kids along is just plain stupid. 

If my son and I are in the water, I'm helping him get out even if I don't make it out. 

I don't understand what happened there.

Chris, I understand  your feelings and whatever happened could have been avoided. but when it happens don’t go on Tv and  want sympathy.

Yes if it does happen we save others not ourselves. better to be aware befor you go out. 

let’s all learn a lesson here and next year we won’t have to post.

 

 

[Fisherman]

2 minutes ago, ketchenany said:

let’s all learn a lesson here and next year we won’t have to post.

 

 

The problem is some peoples memory patterns are severely lacking.  Unfortunately it will most likely happen again unless there's no ice.

[BillM]

2 hours ago, Whitespinnerbait said:

When a driver gets a speeding ticket or runs a red light.........not to sure the passenger is to pay half the fine.

Don't think there's any law against driving on the ice.

[Terry]

Exactly  

If  just being on the ice gets him charged then anyone who drives someone onto the ice would need to be charged with endangering life 

unless they were high or jumping and jumping a crack.  Or trying to skip open water. I don’t see how they charged him. 

[BillM]

Yeah, me either Terry unless there are some details we aren't being given. 

[LeXXington]

The charge would be required for 2 reasons.

The driver is always responsible for the operations of a car.  Someone died so they need to charge someone.  When it goes to court the charge may stick but where it goes from there based on the passenger knew etc.

The passenger family will sue the driver for insurance.  A charge just helps it along

Nothing to do with it being on the ice, its just the way things are

 

 

 

[Old Ironmaker]

This is going to be a tough one for the Crown to get a conviction for all the points mentioned above. Did he kidnap the person that unfortunately was killed, was that person aware they were on the ice? The 1st time I drove on the ice I didn't know,  It isn't illegal to drive on a frozen body of water. Only illegal if the vehicle breaks through the ice, I think. I don't practice Law or Medicine online. We have had this discussion many, many times before here on OFC. Is a vehicle insured if it goes through the ice? My agent says no, good enough foe me. Some ice fishing pals say "yes" they are insured. My  licenced vehicle is insured to travel on roadways and private property provided to the public, if I go off roading in my 4X4 and I damage it or harm a passenger, my insurance will NOT cover my collision or liability, I have that in wrighting. Seldom do we get the details of our policies other than the invoices, we don't have insurance during times of war, riot as well as trying to cross a picket line. Who knew? I did because my car was damaged during the Stelco 81' strike and my windshield was busted out with a brick  and zero insurance Recreational vehicles maybe if insured, he hasn't got back to me about that scenario for 3 years, I don't have a sled or off road 4X4 any longer but wanted to know. That's why we have a Google page (used to be Yellow Pages) full of Lawyers for a county of 45,000 citizens. 

Condolences to the Family of the deceased. Let us not forget this is about a loved one that has passed. 

Edited March 12, 2019 by Old Ironmaker

[Fisherman]

Go see section 249(1) CC sub (4) https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Canadian_Criminal_Sentencing/Offences/Dangerous_Operation_of_a_Motor_Vehicle  and 320.13 (3) CC https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/page-68.html