Enough is Enough

[Dutch]

Shouldnt the town be lobbying the Province to actually enforce the regulations or are these all municipal issues?

[FloatnFly]

I hope whatever regulations they put in place doesn't affect my abilities to fish for the resident trout upstream before Sept 30...I'd be devastated.

 

 

it won't, this is strictly relevant to the area where the river passes through Port Hope, the downtown core

[ecmilley]

Guessing its the same crowd that shows up in there tinners during the crappie spawn

[FloatnFly]

Shouldnt the town be lobbying the Province to actually enforce the regulations or are these all municipal issues?

 

 

this would be municipal, ie by law office stuff, for the short term solution, provincial for the long term solution

[John Bacon]

 

 

steelhead population, and i think the kings that run this side of the lake are wild, but down niagara area they are stockers

 

The Chinook population is about 50/50 wild vs stocked based on the results of fin clipping done a few years ago. The stocking target for Chinook on the Canadian side of Lake Ontario was recently increase from 540,000 to 600,000 per year; I think the U.S. stocks about three times that many. Many of the rivers, such as Credit, Highland, Don, Bronte, are stocked with Chinook each year. So the north shore is not entirely wild Chinook.

 

There are also steelhead stocked on the north shore. The Credit and Rouge rivers are both stocked with steelhead. Other rivers, such as the Ganny, have self sustaining populations.

 

Brown trout are stocked all along the northern lake shore. The MNR is reviewing the stocking program for browns and are considering concentrating the stocking into fewer locations. According to the MNR there is very little wild reproduction of brown trout.

Edited September 17, 2015 by JohnBacon

[Freshtrax]

I'm in. I was tossing lures for them for the first time in ages a few days ago. Its just not fun anymore. 20lb fish in an 8 foot deep estuary. Blah. Get rid of the chinooks and be done with it!

Screw you guys

 

Fight a 30 pounder in 300 Fow. Rainbows aren't exactly native species either. You guys jut want to fish Atlantics?

Fishy History

In 1989, rainbow and cutthroat trout were moved by taxonomists from the genus Salmo, which includes Atlantic salmon and brown trout, to the genus Oncorhynchus, which includes pink, sockeye, chum, Chinook, and coho salmon. Technically, the rainbow trout (oncorhynchus mykiss) isnt a trout at all, but a salmon. Its also the same species as the East Asian trout.

While long a fixture of Ontarios fishery, rainbows are non-native to the province. They were once found only on the West Coast of North America, but humans have widely transplanted this magnificent fish. Today, one of the most important transplanted, self-sustaining populations of steelhead in the world is in the Great Lakes.

The first transplants to the Great Lakes watershed began in the U.S. in 1874, but the first introductions of steelhead to the lakes proper took place when the Aux Sables River was stocked in 1876. On the Ontario side, the first fish were brought in privately sometime in the 1890s to a headwater pond on the Nottawasaga River. The first known recovery of a steelhead in Ontario was a 4-pounder taken near Duck Island, near Manitoulin Island, in 1904.

With an introduction in 1878 in the State of New York, the Lake Ontario watershed was the second Great Lake to receive rainbows. By 1920, they were well established in a number of rivers on the U.S. side. The first seeding on the Ontario side took place in 1922 into a pond in Riverside Park, Toronto.

- See more at: http://www.oodmag.com/fishing/trout/a-history-of-ontario-steelhead/#.dpuf

Edited September 17, 2015 by Freshtrax

[FloatnFly]

 

The Chinook population is about 50/50 wild vs stocked based on the results of fin clipping done a few years ago. The stocking target for Chinook on the Canadian side of Lake Ontario was recently increase from 540,000 to 600,000 per year. Many of the rivers, such as Credit, Highland, Don, Bronte, are stocked each year. So the north shore is not entirely wild Chinook.

 

 

kind of what i was thinking, the west side of Toronto being where most of the stocking takes place

[FloatnFly]

Screw you guys

 

Fight a 30 pounder in 300 Fow. Rainbows aren't exactly native species either. My our guys jut want to fish Atlantics?

Fishy History

In 1989, rainbow and cutthroat trout were moved by taxonomists from the genus Salmo, which includes Atlantic salmon and brown trout, to the genus Oncorhynchus, which includes pink, sockeye, chum, Chinook, and coho salmon. Technically, the rainbow trout (oncorhynchus mykiss) isn’t a trout at all, but a salmon. It’s also the same species as the East Asian trout.

While long a fixture of Ontario’s fishery, rainbows are non-native to the province. They were once found only on the West Coast of North America, but humans have widely transplanted this magnificent fish. Today, one of the most important transplanted, self-sustaining populations of steelhead in the world is in the Great Lakes.

The first transplants to the Great Lakes watershed began in the U.S. in 1874, but the first introductions of steelhead to the lakes proper took place when the Aux Sables River was stocked in 1876. On the Ontario side, the first fish were brought in privately sometime in the 1890s to a headwater pond on the Nottawasaga River. The first known recovery of a steelhead in Ontario was a 4-pounder taken near Duck Island, near Manitoulin Island, in 1904.

With an introduction in 1878 in the State of New York, the Lake Ontario watershed was the second Great Lake to receive rainbows. By 1920, they were well established in a number of rivers on the U.S. side. The first seeding on the Ontario side took place in 1922 into a pond in Riverside Park, Toronto.

- See more at: http://www.oodmag.com/fishing/trout/a-history-of-ontario-steelhead/#.dpuf

 

 

While I do appreciate the fight of a big chinook in deep water, the fight of an Atlantic is that much more, its called the The Leaper for a reason, the Atlantics also return to the lake after spawning. I would love to see Atlantics make a recovery, it would be a landmark occasion.

 

you'll be very very very hard pressed to rid the lake of steelhead and chinooks now, just too many of them

[Freshtrax]

Although I am all for shutting down the rivers for spawning fish. Go chuck some spoons off a pier.

Edited September 17, 2015 by Freshtrax

[moxie]

Good on Port Hope. I moved out to Durham Region almost 30 years ago and fished these flows when they were tree lined and ran cold most of the year. Had to give it up as i was just tired of the routine confrontations with hacks whether it was educating them on some edicit or telling them to pick up after themselves. I hope the Hope can make it happen and other municipalities follow suit .

[spincast]

I wish more municipalities would follow suit.

 

Can you fish for bass, muskie, or walleye when they are spawning? No.

 

Why Trout and Salmon?!

 

Open the creeks/rivers back up on November 1st.

Exactly. Let the fish do their thing and maybe we can have a stronger fishery at significantly lower cost.

 

Passing new rules to limit this annual travesty will be a great step forward, It will be enforcing it that will be the challenge. The poachers wont care about getting up at 3:00 am to do the desecration. Will the by law officers be there ? And will the punishment be enough to make it hurt?

 

As for the Atlantics re-establishing in Lake O. Unfortunately the lake and tribs have changed too much for that to happen. Count the catches after the millions that have been stocked. Great idea, but not practical.

[ckewley]

Unfortunately it only takes a couple people to ruin everyone's reputation. How people think this is ok... I guess if you get away with it for long enough...

 

On a side note though, I think I need a history lesson on the issue with the salmon. Can someone enlighten me on this?

 

I read this years ago so some info I may get crossed, but beside over fishing & environment changes in the river systems alewives which were always native to lake Ontario by the way of the St. Lawrence river began to explode in the lake which had very detrimental effects on the Lake Trout populations & when the canal system was put in place they spread like wildfire to the other lakes, specifically Lake Huron & Michigan. Can't remember the man's name but was a world class fisherman from Michigan that saw a opportunity to introduce Salmon to the lake. After a few years of getting approvals he stocked Coho smolts into Beer creek & another river that escapes me right now(around the mid 60's). These fish gorged themselves on the overabundant alewives creating the world class fishery he envisioned, which was his only goal. Now with the ever dwindling alewives population the lake trout & walleye populations have rebounded big time in those lakes which to most lake fisherman "once the salmon are gone I'm selling my stuff" is a common response I hear.

'

[FloatnFly]

Exactly. Let the fish do their thing and maybe we can have a stronger fishery at significantly lower cost.

 

Passing new rules to limit this annual travesty will be a great step forward, It will be enforcing it that will be the challenge. The poachers wont care about getting up at 3:00 am to do the desecration. Will the by law officers be there ? And will the punishment be enough to make it hurt?

 

As for the Atlantics re-establishing in Lake O. Unfortunately the lake and tribs have changed too much for that to happen. Count the catches after the millions that have been stocked. Great idea, but not practical.

 

 

The Atlantics haven't been able to establish because they have been using the weakest most sensitive strain of Atlantic salmon to try and restock the lake, they need to get a more resilient strain, and not to mention not a landlocked strain, which has been used for the most part instead anadromous strain

http://www.tucanada.org/files/1/ON-012_AtlanticSalmonStrains.pdf

[John Bacon]

 

 

The Atlantics haven't been able to establish because they have been using the weakest most sensitive strain of Atlantic salmon to try and restock the lake, they need to get a more resilient strain, and not to mention not a landlocked strain, which has been used for the most part instead anadromous strain

http://www.tucanada.org/files/1/ON-012_AtlanticSalmonStrains.pdf

 

The news strains (Sebego & Lac St Jean) are much more resiliant in the hatchery. Hopefully that will translate into better survival in the wild too.We

 

I am not convinced that an anadromous strain is necessary. Landlacked may actually be better because as large as Lake Ontario is, it is still a lake, not the ocean.

[Rod Caster]

These people are already breaking existing laws, why not just enforce them properly. Littering, meat wasting, snagging etc...

 

New laws that make things that are already illegal, additionally illegal (?), are a waste of time and restrict everyone. Municipal Governments need to stay out of law making as far as I'm concerned.

[AKRISONER]

according to an acquaintance who is a marine biologist for the MNR, there are no "wild" salmon in lake Ontario at all. There is far too much sediment in the rivers caused by run off to properly spawn in any of the rivers.

 

The area is far to populous.

 

The story about the volleyball net is insane.

[Rustic-Fisher]

Ive just moved into the area , 10 min NE of Port Hope (Hamilton township) , for 20 plus years I was spoiled with easy and fast access to the Nottawasaga , rarely seeing anyone at the runs and pools I frequented I never realized how good I had it .

Last week I headed to the Port Hope pier a few times with a buddy to chuck some hardware and left in shock LOL . We were greased out multiple times lol It's unimaginable the crap that goes on down there. From the garbage, fights, and snagging to the shouting matches and just general idiotiodic behaviour of SOME, not all of the Anglers. If your skin is thick enough it actually provides entertainment between fish.

 

Though I know that as with all rivers it fizzles out in the coming weeks But I wouldn't blame the town at all for posting no trespassing signs .

November can't come fast enough !!!

[SirCranksalot]

From Gan Fishway FB page----looks like things are starting to happen.

"Enforcement was strong this afternoon and well into the evening on a Wednesday it maybe coincidental but looks like the town and the mayor called and got some quick results"

Edited September 17, 2015 by SirCranksaLot

[Gerritt]

Charge a fee to fish it, say 10 bucks a day...use the money to hire a CO.... CO lays charges... PROFIT!

 

Police are hired to do events, traffic control etc..... Let's do the same with CO's.

 

I think those 10% that cause 90% of the issues will go elsewhere.

 

G

[doubleheader]

Aren't you already paying them to do a job? We have the same thing here in the states. 5% make it tough on the remaining 95% due to their ignorance and slovenliness. Fisherman can hold these people to task similar to neighborhood watch groups. I guarantee if you pay for extra enforcement within a year you'll still be paying and the extra enforcement will be nowhere to be seen. That's the way all governments and bureaucrats work.

[John Bacon]

according to an acquaintance who is a marine biologist for the MNR, there are no "wild" salmon in lake Ontario at all. There is far too much sediment in the rivers caused by run off to properly spawn in any of the rivers.

 

The area is far to populous.

 

The story about the volleyball net is insane.

 

So how does he explain the fact that during the year classes in which all of the Chinooks stocked in Lake Ontario had their adipose fin clipped that only about 50% of the Chinook salmon caught in the lake had their adipose fin clipped?

 

Or, why we have strong runs of salmon and trout (if there is too much sediment for salmon then there is too much trout too) in rivers that do not receive any stocking?

 

The evidence supporting the fact that there are wild salmon in Lake Ontario is pretty much irrefutable.

Edited September 17, 2015 by JohnBacon

[manitoubass2]

This thread bothers me for numerous reasons?

[Gerritt]

For the most part it is not locals fishing the Ganny.... It's outsiders, the come here and "fish" in any manner possible, the piss and crap all over the place, the leave their garbage start fights, generally trash the place and take their meat home.... Regardless of the method used.

 

I don't blame the municipality or residents for being upset in the least given the conduct of these asshats.

 

If the provincial government can't police their own laws to protect the fishery and the municipality from the costs associated to allow it to be open..... These meat hunting slobs need to be stopped one way or another.

 

Then you either have two choices..... Let the municipality police it themselves.... Through a municipal license scheme or It shut it down completely (barricades)

 

Either way this cannot continue as is.....

 

I say let the municipality charge a per day fee to fish, upon proof of a valid fishing card. All regulations from the province are to be enforced. Pay an off duty enforcement officer from the fees raised. Use the remainder to pay for the port-o-potties, enhancements, trash collection etc....

 

This will drive away the unsavoury, knowing that one, they have to pay..... Two they have to show proof of a license... And three there will be 24/7 enforcement.

 

If every other small town can afford to hire off duty officers for every little thing IE. Parades, construction sites and such etc.... Surely Port Hope can do the same through licensing....

 

 

Just my .05 cents

Edited September 17, 2015 by Gerritt

[jimmer]

No way should they be able to administer a municipal fishing license, it will just open the door for every municipality throughout Ontario to do the same thing. Imagine the funds that Lake Simcoe would generate in the winter? Close it down if it's town property or enforce the present laws with heavy fines.

[FloatnFly]

No way should they be able to administer a municipal fishing license, it will just open the door for every municipality throughout Ontario to do the same thing. Imagine the funds that Lake Simcoe would generate in the winter? Close it down if it's town property or enforce the present laws with heavy fines.

 

 

they have to do something, and thats just one of the things being tossed around, the other include making that section a sanctuary, and posting no trespassing signs