Ontario to spend $7-billion on sweeping climate change plan

[Old Ironmaker]

We have the once largest coal fired generator plant down the road from us being dismantled and the turbines being sold to the highest bidder, the Chinese. There was talk some years back t retrofit it to Natural Gas fired but the cost to extend the NG line was prohibitive. I don't buy that, then it was said it would be too loud for residents to live in the shadows of the plant, at least 100 people, maybe.

 

I bet the Chinese don't purchase the electrostatic precipitators and scrubbers as well. As long as the carbon emissions stay in Asia we will be OK.

[Dutch01]

We have the once largest coal fired generator plant down the road from us being dismantled and the turbines being sold to the highest bidder, the Chinese. There was talk some years back t retrofit it to Natural Gas fired but the cost to extend the NG line was prohibitive. I don't buy that, then it was said it would be too loud for residents to live in the shadows of the plant, at least 100 people, maybe.

 

I bet the Chinese don't purchase the electrostatic precipitators and scrubbers as well. As long as the carbon emissions stay in Asia we will be OK.

I would be surprised to learn that China bought a coal fired generating plant. I have read estimates of 350,000-500,000 deaths per year in China due to air pollution. They are actively phasing out coal to the tune of 4% of their capacity per year and replacing the lost capacity with renewables. Edited May 31, 2016 by Dutch01

[glen]

Nice to see they are doing something about it before it gets bad.

[John Bacon]

I would be surprised to learn that China bought a coal fired generating plant. I have read estimates of 350,000-500,000 deaths per year in China due to air pollution. They are actively phasing out coal to the tune of 4% of their capacity per year and replacing the lost capacity with renewables.

 

I doubt they would be interested in buying second hand coal plants from us. But that is because they can mass produce them ceaper there than what is would cost to bring them over from Canada. They are building plenty of coal plants.

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/12/02/the-truth-about-china-2400-new-coal-plants-will-thwart-any-paris-cop21-pledges/

[Dutch01]

 

I doubt they would be interested in buying second hand coal plants from us. But that is because they can mass produce them ceaper there than what is would cost to bring them over from Canada. They are building plenty of coal plants.

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/12/02/the-truth-about-china-2400-new-coal-plants-will-thwart-any-paris-cop21-pledges/

Your link is based on a report by a discredited organization. They are climate change deniers busted for using a non-profit for political work.

 

China's consumption of coal is going down.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/feb/29/china-coal-consumption-drops-again

Edited May 31, 2016 by Dutch01

[manitoubass2]

Your link is based on a report by a discredited organization. They are climate change deniers busted for using a non-profit for political work.

 

China's consumption of coal is going down.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/feb/29/china-coal-consumption-drops-again

Remember, the scientists are all in on it?

 

Lets all just focus on a solid bowel movement in the am?

 

Oh, and if I read that last statistic correctly, amazing!!!

Edited May 31, 2016 by manitoubass2

[John Bacon]

Your link is based on a report by a discredited organization. They are climate change deniers busted for using a non-profit for political work.

 

China's consumption of coal is going down.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/feb/29/china-coal-consumption-drops-again

Consumption is going down; but they are still building new coal fired plants. There are plenty of other links beside the one that I posted.

 

They appear to be taking steps to limit new plants; but there are still more coming on-line.

 

http://energydesk.greenpeace.org/2016/03/24/china-crackdown-new-coal-power-plants/

 

http://instituteforenergyresearch.org/analysis/as-u-s-shutters-coal-plants-china-and-japan-are-building-them/

[Dara]

Your link is based on a report by a discredited organization. They are climate change deniers busted for using a non-profit for political work.

 

China's consumption of coal is going down.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/feb/29/china-coal-consumption-drops-again

 

 

Please read a bit closer.

Coal use is down because the economy is tanking due to the oversupply they caused.

a 34% increase in wind power means they had 50 wind turbines and built 17 more

74% increase in solar means they had a small farm and built another a bit smaller.

I see no real numbers in there, just hype.

 

Ontario has closed ALL of its coal fired plants and replaced them with NG, solar and wind.

We are currently building hydro plants on every little river that can support it, viable or not and whether the locals want it or not, see Bala falls.

This government still doesn't care what the people want, they are just following their agenda.

Our power rates have quadrupled in the last 10 years and are going higher.

I say we are now an example of what should be done and the rest should do a bit of catching up before we bankrupt ourselves to set an even better example of how not to do it

Edited May 31, 2016 by Dara

[Dutch01]

 

 

Please read a bit closer.

Coal use is down because the economy is tanking due to the oversupply they caused.

a 34% increase in wind power means they had 50 wind turbines and built 17 more

74% increase in solar means they had a small farm and built another a bit smaller.

I see no real numbers in there, just hype.

 

Ontario has closed ALL of its coal fired plants and replaced them with NG, solar and wind.

We are currently building hydro plants on every little river that can support it, viable or not and whether the locals want it or not, see Bala falls.

This government still doesn't care what the people want, they are just following their agenda.

Our power rates have quadrupled in the last 10 years and are going higher.

I say we are now an example of what should be done and the rest should do a bit of catching up before we bankrupt ourselves to set an even better example of how not to do it

I don't disagree with you, we are doing more. But someone else said it best - if your neighbor doesn't pick up his dog crap or cut his lawn, do you follow suit and not cut your own? China is doing more now than ever, because hundreds of thousands of people are dying yearly. Should we do less because they are? Should we wait until we have that many people dying? I don't think so.

 

Again, I'm talking about the goal, not the implementer (Wynne the incompetent).

[Dutch01]

Consumption is going down; but they are still building new coal fired plants. There are plenty of other links beside the one that I posted.

 

They appear to be taking steps to limit new plants; but there are still more coming on-line.

 

http://energydesk.greenpeace.org/2016/03/24/china-crackdown-new-coal-power-plants/

 

http://instituteforenergyresearch.org/analysis/as-u-s-shutters-coal-plants-china-and-japan-are-building-them/

You may be correct, I'll give you that since I'm at work and didn't read your article. My point is its long been the refrain of the denier that "we should do nothing because China is doing nothing". China is no longer doing nothing.

[Hedfish]

I don't disagree with you, we are doing more. But someone else said it best - if your neighbor doesn't pick up his dog crap or cut his lawn, do you follow suit and not cut your own?

No but you shouldn't keep increasing your "lawn cutting" budget either. There are lots of better ways to spend your money.

 

Hehe, gotta love analogies.

[Dutch01]

No but you shouldn't keep increasing your "lawn cutting" budget either. There are lots of better ways to spend your money.

 

Hehe, gotta love analogies.

Fair enough. But to get off the analogy, if the end result of not spending enough was 350,000-500,000 dead per year, than it would be foolish not to spend whatever is necessary.

 

Keep in mind that that many people dying annually would cost billions as well. We can spend to prevent, or spend to treat, we're spending either way.

[Dara]

I don't disagree with you, we are doing more. But someone else said it best - if your neighbor doesn't pick up his dog crap or cut his lawn, do you follow suit and not cut your own? China is doing more now than ever, because hundreds of thousands of people are dying yearly. Should we do less because they are? Should we wait until we have that many people dying? I don't think so.

 

Again, I'm talking about the goal, not the implementer (Wynne the incompetent).

 

 

I never said do nothing, I said slow down on the doing till we can better afford it...we already spent all and more than we can, now its time to build a bit of capital so we can do more again later, and when others start doing their share so we all afford it the same way

 

Maybe Trudeau should have done a bit more work in Paris

[Dara]

Fair enough. But to get off the analogy, if the end result of not spending enough was 350,000-500,000 dead per year, than it would be foolish not to spend whatever is necessary.

 

Keep in mind that that many people dying annually would cost billions as well. We can spend to prevent, or spend to treat, we're spending either way.

We aren't killing 500,000 a year, they are. We are neutral with all the trees we have to help clean things up.

We still need to help, but we don't need to go broke doing it

[Dutch01]

We aren't killing 500,000 a year, they are. We are neutral with all the trees we have to help clean things up.

We still need to help, but we don't need to go broke doing it

I am simply suggesting let's not wait until we also have 350 - 500K deaths from air pollution.

[Dara]

I am simply suggesting let's not wait until we also have 350 - 500K deaths from air pollution.

Then stop jaming 4 million people into the GTA just to save a few bucks on infrastructure, especially when we are running a deficit to enhance infrastructure spending

[Dutch01]

Then stop jaming 4 million people into the GTA just to save a few bucks on infrastructure, especially when we are running a deficit to enhance infrastructure spending

How do you tell people they can't move to a city?

[DRIFTER_016]

How do you tell people they can't move to a city?

 

Put up a sign that says "FULL".

[Dutch01]

 

Put up a sign that says "FULL".

Now I KNOW you're not from the GTA - nobody obeys signs down here!!!. ???

[DRIFTER_016]

Now I KNOW you're not from the GTA

 

No, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night!!!!!

 

Luckily they are knocking down more TO buildings to build more condos so more people can live in an already overcrowded city.

 

The Big Slice pizza spot on Yonge Street closes to make room for condos

 

http://toronto.ctvnews.ca/the-big-slice-pizza-spot-on-yonge-street-closes-to-make-room-for-condos-1.2924443

Edited May 31, 2016 by DRIFTER_016

[Dara]

Now I KNOW you're not from the GTA - nobody obeys signs down here!!!.

I didn't say can't.

 

You do understand that part of the Mcwynne plan is to have everybody in the city to save on infrastructure right?

They are encouraging everybody to live in the city, not saying they can't

[aplumma]

Please refrain from personal remarks and statements questioning others lack of knowledge on subjects. This discussion had degraded the last 3 pages and it is close to being locked.

 

Discussions not arguments are allowed.

 

Thanks

 

Art

[Dutch01]

I didn't say can't.

 

You do understand that part of the Mcwynne plan is to have everybody in the city to save on infrastructure right?

They are encouraging everybody to live in the city, not saying they can't

I didn't say can't either.

 

Wynne doesn't need a plan to jam people into the GTA. The GTA is where the jobs are, people are coming here regardless.

[scuro2]

 

The people of China are aware, change will happen.

Edited May 31, 2016 by scuro2

[Old Ironmaker]

I personally think they should build a wall around Toronto and sell to the Donald. And to be clear I lived there many years ago when you couldn't find much anything to do after dark during the week save for a few clubs.