mattaw Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 (edited) Hey everyone, I've been a very sporadic poster and a long time lurker here, but I feel I have to ask for your help. I spend a lot of time in the Bancroft area on the lakes there, a family friend just sent me this and I'm shocked an appaled " Hi lake family and friends-not sure if everyone knows about this yet-A company named Armatec that tests military tanks for survivability wants to purchase 2200 acres bordering on Benoirs and Elephant Lake. They would be performing survivability tests-ie blowing up tanks and running them through obstacle courses..They have applied for re-zoning and this will be addressed at the council meeting in Haliburton this coming Monday March 3rd at 5pm. If they don't get re-zoning they will go to the OMB. If you are opposed to this, please sign this petition that has been started on Change.org (link below) it would be great to get as many signatures as possible before the council meeting Monday. Armatec has most likely chosen this time to try and push it through as most cottagers are currently away and unaware this is happening. [You can also email/write to the Dysart counciller Steve Pogue-email here: [email protected] ] PETITION LINK: http://www.change.org/petitions/reeve-murray-fearrey-deny-rezoning-proposal-for-armatec-military-testing-site-near-benoir-lake-haliburton-and-algonquin-park?share_id=BJaMQEBqxr&utm_campaign=share_button_action_box&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=share_petition This weapons testing range just inland from Elephant Lake and the upper York River (some say with some shore land) is a serious threat not only to wildlife and residents experience of norther peace and quiet but also to the Elephant - Baptiste fishery. Heres why: about 30 years ago a plant called Combiboard opened on the Y Road near Birds Creek. Soon people as far away as Fort Stewart and Boulter started complaining about "THE HUM." It wasn't a joke, because of rock formations in the area the noise and vibration carried up to at least 30 kms. The problem was only solved when the plant was taken over by Georgia Pacific and proper equipment was installed. So now we have the threat of huge explosions occurring almost under the lake. The fish will be affected, don't know how but they certainly will." I'm asking for anyone who's willing to help here to preserve this wonderful fishery and area. Be it signing the petition, writing to the Councillor or forwarding this on to friends and family. I can't think of anything more terrible for the area for both our generation and the next. I started going to the area as a young boy and while I'm still fairly young it's a special place for me (and a lot of others). A place to get away and relax (and do some serious fishing), and a place that I want to enjoy tank free. Thank you guys for taking the time to read and hopefully help out! Max Edited March 4, 2014 by mattaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillM Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 (edited) Are they building two or is this just a repost? This just feels like spam to be honest. Edited March 4, 2014 by BillM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinker Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Its a repost, but not even close to spam. Ive been cottaging in wilberforce for almost 30yrs, and fish elephant/benoir/baptiste a lot. This sucks!!! S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattaw Posted March 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Hey. Didn't see the other thread but definitely not spam. Sorry for the repost. It's just a very near and dear issue for me. Apologies Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunatic Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 seems like a very very stupid place to do this no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistaredone Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 That sucks! Baptiste lake is a soul soothing place for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistaredone Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Just signed the petition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris.brock Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 seems like a very very stupid place to do this no? totally! I've dealt with Haliburton County before Mattaw, it might be less painful banging you head against a wall good luck though, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 I don't know if some of you might have seen this. http://www.newspapers-online.com/haliburton/?p=3539 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinker Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Thanks for sharing that, Roy. S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillM Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 (edited) I love when facts are presented.. I wonder what everyone is going to be up in arms about now? he survivability testing site – where detonations would occur – would be located in the centre of the property, 1.6 kilometres from the property line. According to company, the explosions would have a sound pressure level slightly higher than that of a power saw or planer, with a duration of one second.These explosions would happen no more than 30 times a year and no more than once a day.There would be fencing to keep people and animals out of testing areas. According to the company, regular soil testing must be done for any soil contamination from explosive byproducts in accordance with government regulations. Edited March 4, 2014 by BillM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattaw Posted March 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 totally! I've dealt with Haliburton County before Mattaw, it might be less painful banging you head against a wall good luck though, Luckily it's not just me, there seem to be quite a lot of us that care. I love when facts are presented.. I wonder what everyone is going to be up in arms about now? It's not just about the noise though. It's about the perception of a military testing site in the area, the drop in property values and tourism that result from it (as a relator apparently you have to disclose if there is a military site nearby when selling property) and the longterm impact on the area. If the company decides to rezone and expand in the future it will be much harder to stop. What everyone else hasn't mentioned is the noise of the survivability testing, not just the explosives. They are going to be running tanks and military vehicles through obstacle courses for up to 12 weeks a year. There are a lot of valid points and concerns here, last night at the council meeting it was recommended by the council that they deny the motion (the vote is later in March). If that happens it will go to the OMB for a final decision. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenboater Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 I think the answer that wasn't forthcoming was "why there ?" To plunk it down in cottage country (allow me to use that term for this discussion) when there's sooo much land in the province, doesn't make sense no matter how you slice it. There has to be another reason which they don't want to disclose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave524 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Don't they already have a huge chunk of real estate for a playground for those toys up by Meaford. In the 80's and 90's when I made a motel on the north end of town my home away from home every fall you could here them playing. How much land do they need?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistaredone Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 If property values go down on Baptiste may be pro military site lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aplumma Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Good read Roy. I think that the not in my back yard is playing a lot in this knee jerk reaction. Placement of this facility has both a? military base near by? and the infrastructure to support an engineering/ mechanical industry. Is there an other place it could be built? sure but they have the logistics in place for this to be set up as the site, to change that is to go back to square one and spend a lot of time and effort to redo it. Some of the general comments at the meeting reported was the hatred of the military machine and that they deal with the USA as reasons to not have the facility built there but if not there it will still be in Canada so those are invalid arguments as for the not in my backyard stance. We all hate change that effects us but it will happen just as the first 100 people who bought their piece of paradise tried to make it so the next 100 would not effect there piece of paradise by voting no to further development. Progress is what made it possible for the first 100 to live there and progress is what will continue to make expansion of the infrastructure that is needed to grow a nation. Art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattaw Posted March 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 (edited) Good read Roy. I think that the not in my back yard is playing a lot in this knee jerk reaction. Placement of this facility has both a? military base near by? and the infrastructure to support an engineering/ mechanical industry. Is there an other place it could be built? sure but they have the logistics in place for this to be set up as the site, to change that is to go back to square one and spend a lot of time and effort to redo it. Some of the general comments at the meeting reported was the hatred of the military machine and that they deal with the USA as reasons to not have the facility built there but if not there it will still be in Canada so those are invalid arguments as for the not in my backyard stance. We all hate change that effects us but it will happen just as the first 100 people who bought their piece of paradise tried to make it so the next 100 would not effect there piece of paradise by voting no to further development. Progress is what made it possible for the first 100 to live there and progress is what will continue to make expansion of the infrastructure that is needed to grow a nation. Art All valid points. While I don't agree with some of the comments in the meeting about the war machine, a big piece of this for me is the nature and the proximity to the lake and Algonquin, and the property values in the area. Also, if they chose to expand in the future it will be very easy to do so on that property with unforeseen effects in the future. Property value wise, there are a lot of good hardworking folks in that area who have spent their whole life building in that area. While the noise may not be as bad as everyone fears the perception will drive down prices in the area resulting in serious effects for residents (and cottagers) there. Ecologically, there may not be runoff, but what about the survivability testing of running the vehicles through their courses. If you look up some videos of the tests, they're not short and they're VERY loud. It is also worth noting that the company hasn't actually bought the land yet. They have a conditional offer on it assuming the rezoning goes through and all the studies come back okay. Starting over at a new site would be a pain but not impossible for them. I see both sides, but I'm strongly with the not in my backyard group. Edited March 4, 2014 by mattaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancur373 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Everyone's home/business is in what was someones 'back yard' at one point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimaster Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Everyone's home/business is in what was someones 'back yard' at one point. The problem the number of backyards like that are not as plentiful as they once were. How much deforestation is acceptable until it's too much? How many backyards need to give way to business? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aplumma Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 I hope that mutual ground can be found so both sides are happy however the little I have read seems to be that the NIMBYs would rather break than bend. The benefits I see for not only Canadas prosperity and both of our military troops improving the safety of our men is worth its weight in gold. I do know how this feels though being I live 45 minutes from Washington D.C. housing the CIA, FBI,ATF and 6 major military bases. We have test sites on top of test sites here. Art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue pickeral Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Of course the local people are against it....it would mean JOBS! And they'd have to give up their E.I.! Look no further than Bala if you want to see what will happen if business does not move to central Ontario. No gas station, nothing open during the off season months. Worthless trendy junk clothing stores in the summer. A company has been trying to develop a hydro electric plant there for years now. Would create economic possibilities for the town. But - The current mayor and council have fought tooth and nail defeat it - bad for the rich people's property values. So far, their appeals have cost local taxpayers close to $200,000 but the dumb mayor is going to spend more money trying again. The mayor also turned down a fully funded low income housing development for local people. Said it didn't meet the planning guidelines when it certainly did. She approved a Yoga studio instead.... Now look to Bracebridge. Built a nice hydro plant, incorporated a fish ladder and an interpretive centre. That's the way to do business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenboater Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 approved a Yoga studio instead.... Sounds like what happened in Toronto a few years back. A local yoga studio rallied the neighbourhood (Queen West=trendy, hipster, cool crowd) to fight a proposed Tim Hortons because it didn't fit the character or some kind of Bull. They won. Still bugs me and I don't even live near there. Regardless, I think in this case, the proposed financial benefits are probably exaggerated to some extent imo. Why plunk this down in a beautiful part of southern Ont when there are plenty of other options available ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirCranksalot Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Why plunk this down in a beautiful part of southern Ont when there are plenty of other options available ? I think the short answer to that question is that it's close to CFB Petawawa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singingdog Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 The application was denied by council already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattaw Posted March 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 The application was denied by council already. No it was not. In the meeting on the 3rd, the planning committee suggested that they deny it. The decision on the final status at a local level will come March 24th at the full council meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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