Mass shooting in Florida--NF

[leaf4]

So the wood one would also need a huge magazine like that for hunting also, right?

[SirCranksalot]

 

I hope you understand that the reason we do this kind of thing is that we care about our neighbours to the south. If we didn't care, we would be up here eating popcorn watching the carnage ensue.

 

Yes, we care. But I find that the more chances Americans pass up to better control their guns the harder it is for me to care.

[leaf4]

 

Yes, we care. But I find that the more chances Americans pass up to better control their guns the harder it is for me to care.

I also hold this sentiment. If the same things keep happening and they don't change how can I care more about the victims than seemingly millions whom think their guns are worth more to them on a personal level, than hundreds of lives every year.

[aplumma]

I really hate how every time something like this happens the topic immediately goes to gun control. Gun control is definitely part of the problem, but almost equally, and maybe even morseo in some cases, the issue includes:

 

-mental health

-religion

-radicalizing religion

-homophobia

-bigotry

-racism

-sexism

-bullying

-marginalization

-failures of past administrations allowing these radical groups to prosper

-cultural violence

-etc.

 

To say that banning the "other" religion or banning guns of some sort will make this go away is very short sighted and narrow minded. There is so much to this it's difficult to debate.

 

If you want my narrow minded opinion, removing hatred and vengeance from society is where we should start. Yes, it's true, people kill people. We should try to make it so people don't want to kill each other.

Well said and I TOTALLY agree.

 

Art

[aplumma]

A quick Google check indicates that toddlers in the U.S. have killed more people in 2015 than terrorists. So far this year, 23 people have been killed by toddlers in the U.S..

Please don't start with the analogy of how many people have been killed in cars this year we all know that toddlers can't reach the pedals and steer at the same time.

HH

 

Ps - to Art

I hope you understand that the reason we do this kind of thing is that we care about our neighbours to the south. If we didn't care, we would be up here eating popcorn watching the carnage ensue.

I have never doubted that you all are looking after our best interest but so far no one has a viable answer. I am just playing the cards that are dealt as best as I can. I have one wish and that is Canada Never allows handguns to be as easily available as they are in the US. I am betting I can find a statistic that lightning, sharks and even little old ladies with one leg divorced from grumpy old men have killed with a gun.

 

Art

[Bitsmith2k]

And what's the point of being able to turn a normal hunting rifle into a tactical weapon is what again?

 

Why do normal everyday people need that weapon in that trim? I was looking for a hunting version of the AR-15 but I couldn't seem to find one.

 

Dave... don't get me wrong I like guns..... I love going to the range and shooting trap / skeet, and even targets with my hunting rifles.

 

you want the AR-180B if you're looking for something similar to the AR-15.. pretty cool but a little overkill for blasting Coyotes..

[aplumma]

can you please explain to me exactly how this limits ones ability to attain a gun? It does not...it simply makes it more difficult.

It doesn't limit it as a mater fact any law you write will not make it harder to get a gun if you are willing to break the law. I can have a flame thrower, full auto machine gun and a 50 cal. sniper rifle in 24 hours if you have the money. Since it is breaking the law I would not do it. If Obama wants to do something he has to do it legally he must get the support of the people to enact a law. Executive orders are not for him to use just because he wants something. How would you like it if the Prime Minister of Canada decided he wanted the drinking age in Canada to be raised to 30 years old because to many young adults are killed in car accidents? I bet the 21-29 year olds would say heck no and the 30-40 would say mostly they do not care. Now let him raise the age to 40 and if 51 percent of Canadians would be denied alcohol it would never pass no matter how right or just it is. While it is a true statement that alcohol has no real benefit meaning it cost everyone money with health care, police enforcement, robberies, and the list goes on. Now that alcohol is illegal does this make the problem go away? Heavens no it is just beginning you now have unregulated alcohol twice as much work for the police health damage from unknown brewing tactics and even more underground crime. ( while this seems like a fantasy or some untested theory it is from the Prohibition time right out of the history books). Prevention before pandoras box is opened is the correct answer other than that damage control will at best make legal gun owners weaker than the bad guys.

 

Art

[Rodbender]

How about this??

http://www.newstalk1010.com/news/2016/06/14/breaking-news-wife-of-orlando-shooter-allegedly-knew-of-attack-before-it-happened

 

Wife knew about it before hand

[dave524]

And what's the point of being able to turn a normal hunting rifle into a tactical weapon is what again?

 

Why do normal everyday people need that weapon in that trim? I was looking for a hunting version of the AR-15 but I couldn't seem to find one.

 

Dave... don't get me wrong I like guns..... I love going to the range and shooting trap / skeet, and even targets with my hunting rifles.

 

The Ruger 10-22 is still just a 22 rimfire in either configuration, pretty much a rabbit and squirrel gun if you are a hunter, nothing military about it cartridge wise. The AR-15 is the hunting version of the M-16/ C-7 rifle, I've hunted with one as well as the Ruger Mini 14 , with 20 round mags and scopes on both, great coyote rifles. This was before our own home bred terrorist , Gamil Rodrigue Liass Gharbi, unleashed his own anti feminist attack on female engineering students back in 89 , and the AR became a restricted weapon, no longer allowed in the field and we were saddled with 5 round mags for centre fire semi autos.

 

Edit: looks like Carey Price agrees with me, I assume this pic was taken stateside

 

Edited June 14, 2016 by dave524

[aplumma]

 

Yes, we care. But I find that the more chances Americans pass up to better control their guns the harder it is for me to care.

 

 

I also hold this sentiment. If the same things keep happening and they don't change how can I care more about the victims than seemingly millions whom think their guns are worth more to them on a personal level, than hundreds of lives every year.

Or hows about the thousands of lives that are saved by having a gun in the right situation? They rarely make the paper but are present. Why do you think we Value the guns so highly? It is the freedom that we value more than a few hundred lives because we go to war and it cost us dearly in lives for our and others freedom.

 

If a few hundred lives saved is all you are asking for then stop people from drinking and smoking you will save hundreds of people in a month. Even easier give 1000.oo to a charity that feeds the children bang we saved a few hundred more.

 

Guns will not disappear no matter how hard you wish them away or what law you write. This is a given we might as well be trying to control alcohol and weed in Canada but we already know that doesn't work.

 

I know I haven't changed any ones mind and I am not trying to. The things I have written are an insight on what it really is like and what is not possible from my point of view. If you lived next door to the farm here you would find a very peaceful place that resembles pretty much your own piece of paradise.

 

 

Art

[NANUK]

I don't know what the solution is about gun control, I wouldn't even attempt to debate that issue because I don't know all the facts from both sides of this debate.

What I do think is one of the most effective solution to this type of extremism has to come from that particular community,

Like rodbender's link above, his wife knew what direction her husband was thinking, you can't tell me no one else in his family and friends noticed his behavior ?

I can't imagine that I will do nothing if some one I knew would behave that way, specially buying ammo and scoping out his target.

[AKRISONER]

pretty hard to shoot 100 people with a 2 shot clip...

 

you can have your guns and still shoot too...just not in rapid succession...when was the last time you needed to shoot 100 rounds of ammo while hunting?

[FrankTheRabbit]

Just came across this short video, that touches a little bit of the topic in this thread:

 

[aplumma]

pretty hard to shoot 100 people with a 2 shot clip...

 

you can have your guns and still shoot too...just not in rapid succession...when was the last time you needed to shoot 100 rounds of ammo while hunting?

Your right you win I have never shot at an animal 100 times. I however have qualified for tactical courses using over 300 rounds to certify. I also have loaded over 500 rounds in assorted clips ranging from 7 - 35 rounds mags while shooting the gun range behind the house. I have picked up over 2000 casings after a group of us have been shooting at the range. I have reloaded over 5 thousand rounds in the winter. You will never understand, I can not give you more info to process since you are only looking for what ifs and how comes both are not an answer.

 

Art

[manitoubass2]

A few questions...

 

How many rounds did this guy fire?

 

How many clips did he carry?

 

Why did it take swat 3 hours to respond to the emergency?

 

What happened to the second guy that was reported that had a bomb in his car?

[DRIFTER_016]

Your right you win I have never shot at an animal 100 times. I however have qualified for tactical courses using over 300 rounds to certify. I also have loaded over 500 rounds in assorted clips ranging from 7 - 35 rounds mags while shooting the gun range behind the house. I have picked up over 2000 casings after a group of us have been shooting at the range. I have reloaded over 5 thousand rounds in the winter. You will never understand, I can not give you more info to process since you are only looking for what ifs and how comes both are not an answer.

 

Art

 

My buddy in North Carolina is heavy into the 3 gun shooting scene and shoots untold numbers or rounds in training and competition.

[dave524]

pretty hard to shoot 100 people with a 2 shot clip...

 

you can have your guns and still shoot too...just not in rapid succession...when was the last time you needed to shoot 100 rounds of ammo while hunting?

 

A few times I pretty much went through a caseguard of 60 .220 Swift rounds groundhog shooting and way back when you could still go to the dump ( don't think the term sanitary land fill site had been invented yet ) and shoot rats I'm sure I've gone through a couple of boxes of 50 22 Long Rifle hollowpoints.

[DRIFTER_016]

 

A few times I pretty much went through a caseguard of 60 .220 Swift rounds groundhog shooting and way back when you could still go to the dump ( don't think the term sanitary land fill site had been invented yet ) and shoot rats I'm sure I've gone through a couple of boxes of 50 22 Long Rifle hollowpoints.

 

When I was shooting trap and sporting clays I was going through a case of ammo a weekend.

[dave524]

 

When I was shooting trap and sporting clays I was going through a case of ammo a weekend.

 

Tell me about it, shot all 4 gauges of skeet back in the 70's early 80's, had a bench with Mec 600 loaders in 12, 20, 28 and .410. There was a real saving in loading your own back then, when I got my first 12 gauge loader it was 1967 and Red Dot powder was $3 a pound and shot $7 for a 25 pound bag, now there is no savings in target loads if you buy a case. The examples I gave earlier were actual hunting situations.

[aplumma]

I have a friend who is fully vested up to class 3 (machine guns, silencer, short barrel rifles) who has a reloading station that can produce a round every 5 seconds or one pull one bullet. The powder hopper hold 3 lbs and the primer tray has a 500 capacity. He has to with the amount of rounds he fires a few times a week. He is thinking about getting a full auto reloader but hasn't found one he likes. The savings on something as common as the 9 mm is 5 cents and the .223 rifle is still 16 cents per round. The .50 caliber which has to be handloaded and takes 2 minutes each saves almost 2.00 a round.

 

 

Art

[dave524]

I have a friend who is fully vested up to class 3 (machine guns, silencer, short barrel rifles)

 

Art

 

Full autos were collectible here as well until the late 70's , the guys that had them were grandfathered and allowed to keep them but no new collectors and they are now all getting a little long in the tooth. Public opinion and acceptance of firearms varies widely here depending on age, province and whether urban or rural. Guess it is the same there, there are probably places that people don't even look twice at open carry. Art here is an example that you might be interested in, maybe a good price with the exchange rate, seems you have a thing for 50's . This is at a Canadian Tire in Alberta, in Toronto a lot of CTC customers would probably wet themselves if they saw this on the rack.

 

 

 

[AKRISONER]

i understand you guys shot a lot at the range etc...but it still makes 0 sense why this is a necessity.

 

Its not...its a convenience...

 

You guys are acting like im anti gun, im not, I own guns...there is a gun case in my parents basement with multiple rifles. It still doesnt justify the fact that people need to have extended clips with semi automatics or even fully automatic

 

If you want to argue that Gun control doesnt work...its already been proven that it does. They did it in Australia and it worked perfectly.

 

The fact that this guy was able to shoot 100 people with a legally purchased weapon clearly shows that there is a problem here.

 

Once again, I am not saying ban guns etc etc...but holy crap, at least make the guy reload after taking a couple of shots.

 

Ive been there done that, weve shot gofers and magpies on a cattle farm with shot guns and .22's It still does the trick, we just needed to reload every once in a while.

Edited June 15, 2016 by AKRISONER

[fishing n autograph]

[dave524]

image.jpg

 

What do you need a brake on a 5.56mm firearm for? You should just slip a maxipad under your bra strap to dampen the hellish recoil.

[fishing n autograph]

Haha I couldn't help but wonder if this "journalists" 8 year old daughter kills the spiders in his house. What a wuss. There is less recoil in an AR than a beretta or Glock hand gun. It's a loud crack but not an explosion..... Smh