Limits on pan fish and limiting out

[outllaw]

pull up the harvest numbers for l. erie. if you can get them it should show. . I would like to see if the changes were made on mnr quota.. never the less I feel keeping some walleyes wont affect the population.

[G.mech]

pull up the harvest numbers for l. erie. if you can get them it should show. . I would like to see if the changes were made on mnr quota.. never the less I feel keeping some walleyes wont affect the population.

 

The link I posted shows the actual harvest & Total Allowable Catch for the entire lake (which is set out by the International Lake Erie Comittee not the MNR) which is the numbers I quoted. It also says:

 

 

In 2014, lake-wide Walleye harvest was estimated at 2.869 million fish. Recreational fishers harvested 1.577 million fish and commercial fishers harvested 1.292 million fish.

 

 

The OMNR&F can only decide hour the Ontario portion of the TAC is split up between commercial and sport. The TAC for each of the four international management zones changes a bit every year but it's not much different now than for the 2014 report I posted. I agree though, the sportfishing limits in Lake Erie don't seem unreasonable but I don't think the same can be said for other lakes.

 

Point is that the sportfishing harvest is far more than lots of people think it is relative to the commercial harvest

Edited January 14, 2017 by G.mech

[manitoubass2]

Honest question...

 

How does MNR track angler takes?

 

I cannot think of any reliable and or pheasable way to do such a thing

[Acountdeleted]

They do creel surveys. First year I met Chad and Joey on nippising we got stopped. Took size, number and scales to age the fish. After that it's all formulaic to estimate within a 95% certainty.

 

It's true what you said about Erie. When I was down there the MNRF used to have a field day. I think it's 4 votes on all that goes on with Erie. Ontario gets one, Michigan gets one, Ohio gets one, New York gets one. If the states wants something and Canada doesn't, we're screwed.

Edited January 14, 2017 by jeremy84

[G.mech]

Honest question...

 

How does MNR track angler takes?

 

I cannot think of any reliable and or pheasable way to do such a thing

 

 

They calculate the estimated catch using data from anglers who do their 'Angling Diaries' each season to determine how many fish are caught for each 'angler effort hour'. The combine this data with info from the boat launches and other surveys which gives them approximate 'angling effort hours' and do the math. They've done it this way for a long time and they seem to think it gives them a pretty good guestimate at least. Certainly not perfect but no statistical method such as this really is.

Edited January 14, 2017 by G.mech

[Sterling]

For some lakes, panfish are in direct competition with the most targeted species (walleye) and so the MNR want angling pressure on perch.

 

Even with such liberal limits for perch, 90%+ of angling effort goes to other species, so as far as larger lakes are concerned, perch are in no danger. In fact they're thriving.

 

The downside of course, is that smaller lakes suffer.

[manitoubass2]

 

 

They calculate the estimated catch using data from anglers who do their 'Angling Diaries' each season to determine how many fish are caught for each 'angler effort hour'. The combine this data with info from the boat launches and other surveys which gives them approximate 'angling effort hours' and do the math. They've done it this way for a long time and they seem to think it gives them a pretty good guestimate at least. Certainly not perfect but no statistical method such as this really is.

Thats what I thought.

 

Thanks!

[Acountdeleted]

For some lakes, panfish are in direct competition with the most targeted species (walleye) and so the MNR want angling pressure on perch.

 

Even with such liberal limits for perch, 90%+ of angling effort goes to other species, so as far as larger lakes are concerned, perch are in no danger. In fact they're thriving.

 

The downside of course, is that smaller lakes suffer.

Although there is some overlap, wouldn't walleye just eat the perch? (Until of course they become too big) what is the biggest perch a walleye could eat? Saw a 2 lb burbot crammed down a walleyes throat once. And that's not even counting the time Brian B tried to make Wall-Bur-Pike. (Like Tur-duc-ken) Edited January 15, 2017 by jeremy84

[outllaw]

thanks for the new details.on quota..i do agree inland lakes can be hurt real fast on over fishing.

[Acountdeleted]

thanks for the new details.on quota..i do agree inland lakes can be hurt real fast on over fishing.

It's my bigger concern vs Ontario, Erie Simcoe and the other big boys

[dave524]

. And that's not even counting the time Brian B tried to make Wall-Bur-Pike. (Like Tur-duc-ken)

 

As long as you don't try to breed a Ko-Wal-Ski

[OhioFisherman]

http://www.walleyecentral.com/articles/?a=1370

 

 

http://www.cleveland.com/outdoors/index.ssf/2013/03/lake_eries_walleye_yellow_perc.html

 

 

 

 

Bits and pieces on the Lake Erie fish population, I have caught steelhead with perch in their bellies, but they were far out numbered by emerald shiners and shad.

[Old Ironmaker]

I am intrigued every time I watch them pull their nets out here. Some sets are more than a kilometer long. I only saw a few "other" species in that haul that were clearly not perch. I would say they were large perch size Small Mouth. Not many though.

[AKRISONER]

they were doing some very serious surveying around PAB 2 years ago to the point that i became friends with the MNR guy because I saw him every weekend for a year straight lol.

Same old story, he would pull up say hey scott hows it going. Any luck today? by the end of the season he knew every single one of my honey holes

[OhioFisherman]

Although there is some overlap, wouldn't walleye just eat the perch? (Until of course they become too big) what is the biggest perch a walleye could eat? Saw a 2 lb burbot crammed down a walleyes throat once. And that's not even counting the time Brian B tried to make Wall-Bur-Pike. (Like Tur-duc-ken)

 

When I was young it used to be legal to use perch for bait at Pointe Au Baril. There was a old guy that lived there that we used to see trolling all the time for pike and skis? LOL, I still remember his comment! " the bigger the perch? the bigger the pike!

[OhioFisherman]

I am intrigued every time I watch them pull their nets out here. Some sets are more than a kilometer long. I only saw a few "other" species in that haul that were clearly not perch. I would say they were large perch size Small Mouth. Not many though.

 

We used to watch the commercial fishermen on the bays off of Lake Erie hauling in their trap nets they used for catching carp and buffalo, those nets were huge too, so was their catch!

 

I recently watched a video of some carp netters on Lake Simcoe, all they got was 150 pounds or so. LOL, that's like 6 average carp here in places.

[bigugli]

 

When I was young it used to be legal to use perch for bait at Pointe Au Baril. There was a old guy that lived there that we used to see trolling all the time for pike and skis? LOL, I still remember his comment! " the bigger the perch? the bigger the pike!

Yep, growing up in the Muskokas in the 60's, perch was always the bait of choice. My uncle and his friends gave me a nickel for every perch I caught or trapped.

[Garfisher]

Just to quickly jump back to the original topic:

http://blog.nature.org/science/2015/10/15/why-everything-you-know-bluegill-management-wrong-fish-fisheries-panfish-fishing/

Sounds similar to what people have seen on some lakes with some high pressure, basically the large ones get taken out and the small ones take over due to harvest pressure. Easiest thing would be a reduction in limits, however there would likely be a lot of pressure from some of the angling community to either limit a reduction or even keep things as they are. If you personally want to attempt to make a difference (obviously one can't control what others do especially if they are within their legal right) the easiest thing would be releasing the larger panfish (such as maybe not keeping gills above 8-9" if in the Kawarthas) and not harvesting larger males when they are nesting. If you want to keep your limit of the big guys though and aren't doing anything illegal, all the power to ya haha.

[Dutch01]

I'm not sure there's anything to worry about, at least where Simcoe is concerned. It's been hammered every winter for decades and there's still no shortage of perch.

[Garfisher]

Simcoe is also a large waterbody haha (excluding the Great Lakes in comparison), in theory you could get areas of stunting but I would think it would take an insane amount of pressure on a small area to do it. And even then I'm sure perch roam enough that large ones would filter back in relatively quickly. It's the small to mid-sized lakes that are very susceptible to it.

[AKRISONER]

 

When I was young it used to be legal to use perch for bait at Pointe Au Baril. There was a old guy that lived there that we used to see trolling all the time for pike and skis? LOL, I still remember his comment! " the bigger the perch? the bigger the pike!

 

funny story outta our camp from last fall.

 

We had a friend up for the fall pickerel run. While deadsticking Bernie hooked into a perch and admittedly took his sweet time reeling err in in the off chance that a pike would t bone him. After playing this perch like a laketrout sure enough it happens, smack a 6lb pike takes the perch and the fight is on. Bernie running 4lb mono on a light stick is in for a hell of a fight. just as he finally ends his epic battle he culls the pike for lunch and wouldnt you know it...the MNR pulls up to the boat hahaha. Bernie is now sweating thinking holy crap, i bet that perch is hooked right through the lips in that pike's belly.

 

The first question outta the MNR is, "hey you kept that pike, do you mind if we take some samples?" Bernie says sure!...they then take the pike and cut its belly open! Bernie is a big old cape bretoner but my brother said he never saw bernie sweat so much in his entire life hahahaa. In the end the MNR took their samples and everyone went on their merry way. Was funny as hell though.

[Acountdeleted]

Hahaha that's good.

 

We used to get pike T boning walleye all the time. Would hook into a small little 8-10 incher, would get it 4 feet from the boat and the fish started fighting like it gained 10 pounds. Most of the time the walleye was in the pikes jaw when we brought it up. Pike would go green and spit the walleye out.

 

Before I knew it was illegal we used to get pike off the dock of the french all the time. Hook a 4 inch perch through the dorsal and hang it on 3 feet under a bobber. Hang out on the dock until the bobber goes under and dinner is on.

Edited January 18, 2017 by jeremy84

[manitoubass2]

Ive never actually had a pike hammer a perch. Its happened TONNES with walleye though! Thats one of the "get the net" moments trying to land 2 fish at once.

 

I once had a 27" pike on fishing off the dock and a huge northern took multiple runs at it. In the clear water is was pretty fun to watch that huge northern jolt up and hit it like a missle from below.

 

In the end I had to keep the 27"er as is was bleeding from the gills and had three seperate chunks removed from its back

 

Its more rare but ive had a few big walleye take runs at lil hammer handles. And bass taking runs at pike as well but thats more terrtorial lol. Flying headbut to the pike lol

[dave524]

The only times I have encountered " Stunting " is on small bodies of water that have a population far in excess of the available food supply, couple of farm ponds just loaded with silver dollar sized bluegills as a kid come to mind and a few beaver ponds similarly loaded with 4" brookies that attack anything that hits the water like pirranhas. Thinning the herd in both cases would increase the quality of the fish.

[jimmer]

People used to keep a trunk full of perch 20 years ago on Simcoe. It was disgusting and a recipe for trouble. I'm glad they put limits for perch on Simcoe. I think populations can be hurt on any size body of water if they are abused.