Idea's of buying a Kawartha resort?

[Salmonidstalker]

Also keep in mind how you plan to liquidate if the need arises to sell. I can see these businesses very easy to buy, but come time to sell it could be a very lengthy process taking years to unload your business.

 

In my honest opinion, I couldn't imagine running a fishing business now or especially when Im retired. I love to fish and I believe that turning it into a business would sour my passion for the sport. I also know a few who do it and have done it, and the story is the same over and over. Too much work and not enough pay.

 

I hope when I retire Im not thinking about working. Life is short, enjoy your family and friends and all the little things in between.

[manitoubass2]

To some its a dream job.

 

You gotta love to work eat and entertain.

 

Its not for everyone.

 

Aside from the two owners I posted about, 6 or so turned out to alcoholics, divorced, or bankrupt.

 

Or any combination of the three

[pics]

You might be better off trying to find a cottage with room to build a rental unit or 2. That way you keep it small and manageable while someone else helps you to pay the bills

[esoxansteel]

Scotsman Point on Buckhorn, Musky Bay Resort on Rice Lake, and a few others have recently sold, as well as one on the east side of Balsam as well, not that it matters but it appears to be a draw for Orientals as well, as the Asian economy is very strong, and the money is there to buy these very very pricey resorts.

[DanD]

You might be better off trying to find a cottage with room to build a rental unit or 2. That way you keep it small and manageable while someone else helps you to pay the bills

 

To me that's sounds like a good idea; if you were allowed to build on the property?

If you do find a camp, it doesn't mean you have to open the cottages too weekly guests; but seasonal or long term leases. These tenants would have their own hydrometer and be responsible for whatever services that are offered in the area. They look after the landscaping and other shared cost for their cottage; kind of like a condo set up, where everyone kicks in a bit to make it more affordable for all?

 

Dan.

[Pikeslayer]

Raycaster,

For your consideration, I’d like to add the following:

There is a severe shortage of ‘truly’ accessible cottages/resorts for those with mobility access challenges (ie wheelchairs/walkers). The ones that are truly accessible are in high demand and short supply. Many of them are advertised/booked through various associations such as March of Dimes, MS Society et al.

That said, there are many cottages/resorts that advertise as “wheelchair accessible” but the majority of these are limited to entrance ramps and grab rails in washrooms. Speaking from experience, for those who are challenged with mobility, a truly accessible cottage/resort experience would include:

· Entrance ramps and grab rails where required.

· 34” doorways

· Turning space for wheelchair in bedroom, living areas and porch/deck

· Patient lift availability (these can be rented as needed)

· Large walk in/wheel in shower area

· Screened in porch/deck

· Access to common areas. ie campfire, recreation hall etc.

· Access to dock

· Access to a pontoon boat would be nice

· ‘Access’ means the ability to push a person and their wheelchair (200 lbs +) with relative ease (no steep grades) to go where any able bodied person may.

· Cottage should be within 30 minutes of a regional health care facility/hospital.

 

Here is an example of one of the better accessible cottages I researched (but it is still lacking in total access): http://www.willowbeach.com/cottage-handicap-accessible.php

 

Also of note:

· Quality used accessibility equipment (grab rails, patient lifts, portable ramps etc) are readily available at reduced prices through various organizations online as well as Kijiji

· Typically, extended family and caregivers vacation with those that are mobility challenged as these are ‘special’ events. Chances are that if you are renting an accessible cottage, you would need a standard cottage to accommodate larger parties.

· Truly accessible cottages can justify ‘premium’ rates.

 

Long story short, if I was to consider purchasing a ‘resort’, I would most certainly want to target a ‘unique’ clientele. As mentioned, this is a high demand industry (unfortunately) with an extremely low level of supply. IMHO, this is a promising business opportunity.

 

 

As an aside, our family is currently planning & looking for a suitable property for our son. Minimum 5 bedrooms, < 3 hour drive and within 30 minutes of regional hospital. It will likely include one of these:

http://www.cottagelifts.com/pictures.html

Our intention is to purchase and modify/renovate a property that is truly accessible from the front door to the pontoon boat. We will also make the property available for rental through various associations/foundations to allow families to enjoy an all inclusive cottage experience. I have no doubt that we will be able to achieve a 90% or better occupancy for whatever rentals we make available.

 

Best of luck to you. Resort ownership can indeed be profitable with a proper business plan.

[jimmer]

It will not be a semi-retirement as others have said. I have known two families that have owned resorts. One broke up and sold everything for a loss on all they invested, the other finally gave in and moved to Peterborough. They are all happier. My daughter owns a trailer park in the Barrie area. They have year round trailers and boat rentals. They run their arses off during the summer and slow down a bit in the winter. She would like to give it up.

[MrSimon]

I always dreamed of owning/operating a camp too .... but with a wife and three kids it's not something I would actually do.

 

But, I did buy a 3 bedroom cottage on Black Lake (five minutes across the St. Lawrence from Brockville) that I can use for vacations with the family.

 

I got the idea to rent it out and maybe make some income back. I listed it on VRBO and wouldn't you know people rented it. Last year it almost broke even and this year it's rented enough to actually turn a profit.

 

My point is that sometimes you can realize your dream .... even if it's only a small piece of it.

 

PS - Knowing what I know now, I wish I would have bought a larger property with the ability to expand by building one or two more cottages right next to each other.

[bare foot wader]

lots of good info already mentioned here...and if you really want it, anything is possible, but like MrSimon mentions, I'd say a lot depends on the number of rooms/cabins you're thinking of?

 

many mom and pop operations do not have a proper business entity setup for liability protection, which is a huge thing to consider...you'd certainly want to work out a legitimate client use waiver with a lawyer....one accident and everything you've worked for is at risk

 

it's fairly easy to self manage advertising with the internet these days, but depending on the scale of the property working with a tour operator to sell to foreign guests has it's advantages

 

most properties I've seen need about a 60-70% occupancy rate to stay profitable

 

I was the accountant/groundkeeper/carpenter/about 18 other things at a remote wilderness/ski lodge, 30 room lodge plus chalets, feel free to PM if you had any specifics

 

for semi retirement, MrSimon's idea sounds more enjoyable than a full scale resort

[Musky or Specks]

Heres the only thing that matters when it comes to owning a fishing/hunting resort. Do you enjoy angling and hunting? If so don't do it because you'll never get a chance to do it for pleasure again.

[Rice Laker]

My wife and I purchased a seasonal fishing camp 18 years ago. With the right decisions/planning being made it can be a very satisfying semi-retirement. You don't work 18 hour days 24/7 as has been posted and in recent years we spent 2-3 months in Florida as our vacation. The busiest times are before opening (mid-May) and after closing (Thanksgiving).

We got to know other couples who bought for similar reasons to us: large house in the GTA, kids had left home, mid 50's, job frustrations and just wanting a "mid-life change".

From our experiences I would list the following as the most important points in evaluating camps:

1) A substantial repeat business; look at the reservations for this year, next year and the last 3 years.

2) See accountant prepared P & L statements.

3) A camp that has both cottages and daily boat rentals so you are not dependent on just one income stream.

4) 12-15 cottages can be easily run by a couple with weekend help for cleaning etc. Any more than that would probably require help during the week, meaning additional expenses.

5) If you have lived in a city for many years, evaluate carefully moving to a place in the "boonies". Being 2 hours from Canadian Tire, Walmart, Home Depot, Timmies, doctors and a hospital could be a real shock, especially for the wife!

[Big Cliff]

My wife and I purchased a seasonal fishing camp 18 years ago. With the right decisions/planning being made it can be a very satisfying semi-retirement. You don't work 18 hour days 24/7 as has been posted and in recent years we spent 2-3 months in Florida as our vacation. The busiest times are before opening (mid-May) and after closing (Thanksgiving).

We got to know other couples who bought for similar reasons to us: large house in the GTA, kids had left home, mid 50's, job frustrations and just wanting a "mid-life change".

From our experiences I would list the following as the most important points in evaluating camps:

1) A substantial repeat business; look at the reservations for this year, next year and the last 3 years.

2) See accountant prepared P & L statements.

3) A camp that has both cottages and daily boat rentals so you are not dependent on just one income stream.

4) 12-15 cottages can be easily run by a couple with weekend help for cleaning etc. Any more than that would probably require help during the week, meaning additional expenses.

5) If you have lived in a city for many years, evaluate carefully moving to a place in the "boonies". Being 2 hours from Canadian Tire, Walmart, Home Depot, Timmies, doctors and a hospital could be a real shock, especially for the wife!

 

Nice to hear it from the "voice of experience" side of things and you make some very good points for anyone moving from the city to the country, our newest neighbors were at our door almost daily for the first 6 months after they moved in needing to borrow eggs, bread, milk..... they just weren't use to living in the country and so didn't plan ahead.

 

Just out of curosity, do you still have your place and if so, where is it? I know a camp owner in the Kawarthas that does exactly what you are describing!

[netminder]

Maybe a suggestion if you're looking for semi retirement but don't want the headaches and would appreciate some free time would be to get a job at one of those places, rather than going all in as an owner?

[jimmer]

What musky and specks said is what kept me from ever making the decision to own a resort/fish camp. However, it could work if it was very small, just don't know if the revenue would cover the yearly expenses. Working in one might be a good option.

[fishindevil]

You will get out if it what you put into it !!! A freind ows a big resort on pigeon lake and does very well !!!! And is very busy but still finds time to vacation & unwind & do their own things !!! And yes of course money helps !!!! But it's a commitment of epic proportions !!! There is a nice resort on sturgeon lake for sale almost 1million dollars I believe ?? Lol ....

[Old Ironmaker]

Great post from Rice Laker. From the horses mouth so to speak.

[jimmer]

One sold quite a few years ago on Pigeon for over $1 million bucks. It's not even open to the public anymore after the previous owners worked their butts off to get it to where it was. They made the yearly outdoor show trek through the states to promote the resort and it paid off as fishindevil said.

[Regan Thompson]

I might be able to weigh in here as my wife and I own one ourselves.

 

It's not a simple "yes" or "no" answer, but from my perspective the answer is "yes". I stress the words my perspective in saying this however, because it really boils down to "are you the right kind of person or persons to own a lodge?". Many owners get in thinking it's a "retirement gig" and have a rude awakening. Others get in without the skills required to run a lodge and it quickly falls apart. For example, If "Billy Bob" without a highschool education won the lottery or got an inheritance what would he do? The answer is buy a fishing lodge, and it probably wouldn't last long because Billy Bob would be out drunk fishing every day. My point is there are a lot of people who get into it for the wrong reasons or with the wrong skill set and if this is the case it usually fails, so you need to evaluate this for yourself. This isn't true for just with lodges but for any business. Owning a lodge is like owning any other business; location, hard work and survival of the fittest.

 

Before getting into the lodge business ourselves, my wife and I worked office jobs (like many) where we worked 8 hours per day, 5 days per week, 50 weeks per year. Now we work 10 hours per day, 7 days per week but 21 weeks per year (although not this winter if you follow us on facebook!). So although you're working like a beaten slave in the summer (not that our customers literally beat us lol), you're rewarded with 6 months off every year. Also, if I had to choose between 6 months of working 5 days per week in the office and 6 months of working every day as a lodge owner, I'd take the lodge owner gig every time. It's tonnes of work but the rewards are huge. A typical day for us is pumping out boats in the morning, talking to guests about fishing, building docks, cottages, cutting grass, talk some more fishing, take guests out fishing, etc. You're working outside in the sun every day. We also love the creativity it allows us when it comes to the marketing of the business. The best part I'd have to say though is the people. In a typical job you see the same handful of people all year, but in this job you meet SO MANY interesting a fun people. In one year of owning this lodge we have more friends and crazy stories than our previous 10 years as a couple.

 

So I if you're the right kind of person and if it's what your really want go for it dude! People told us we were nuts but now we're loving it. Before you do though there is A LOT more you should know about location, infrastructure, septics, financing, grants, the list goes on and on and on. I won't get into that stuff on the thread but if you're really serious about taking this step please call me and I can give you some sound advice.

 

Cheers!

[Regan Thompson]

Just one final note, you have to ready this article... I've been to a tonne of lodges and have met all these types lol!

 

http://www.bulkleysteelhead.com/blog/4-types-fishing-lodge-owners

 

[mikemcmillan]

Our family ( brother & sister) bought our place in 2007 near Magnetawan. a little different though as we were not retired at the time and sold our family cottage to get started.

My brother has since retired but I am a full time shift worker, 3 on 3 off with 12 weeks of holidays so pretty easy to be at the resort. I call it the cottage though as that is what I consider it.

Brother & I do all the work and my sister & her husband just helps out with what they can do. We are handy guys and for the most part do everything ourselves.

we are social people and that is a key thing as guests love to chat you up and offer a drink. I enjoy this part as much as they do.

 

Yes it is a lot of work but if you are prepared, keep on top off things and offer a clean place people for the most part are happy.

Our cottages are older fishing resort type places that we try to keep spotless for when people arrive. We do have cleaners that are great and take pride in what they do.

We are lucky as we have a good clean well that we don't have to filter or treat, water gets tested all the time and always comes back pure.

One thing that made all our guests happy was new beds, all the beds were garbage when we got the place, after the first year we replaced them all and this put such a good spin

on the new owners that we new we had won them over.

 

We aren't breaking the bank but make enough to pay the bills, mortgage and put any profit back into the place. Cottages were run down a little when we took over but we have slowly fixed things up. Every year there is things that you have to do to be success full and make your time more enjoyable and allows you to relax some and do some fishing.

 

Now that being said during the summer, July & August we each look after the place for 3 weeks and help out when needed.

 

we have 9 cottages so that gives us 81 weeks to fill, this year we have 4 weeks left open and I think only 4 renters who are first time guests. Some people have be coming for 30 years or more.

And god forbid if you give their week away to someone else. They treat it just like their own cottage. In 8 years we have only had 4 renters that we would not welcome back and only 1 person that we kicked out. We warn new people that drunks or rowdies get kicked out, no second chance, no questions asked just pack your bags.

We have very few rules, respect the other people who are here, pick up after you dogs, keep the place clean and have a good time.

We do rent boats & motors, have a boat launch on site so this is a bonus. We have 3 canoes & 3 paddle boats that are there to use. I can't and don't want to worry about who is using them, the few bucks you make from renting them is not worth the time or trouble to manage them.

 

those 2 months are busy but May, June, Sept & October are not busy at all and for the most part it's just like being at home.

This is one thing we would like to see is more business in the shoulder season, most weeks we only have a few guests but it gives you time to do repairs and relax, oh and some fishing.

Most guests understand that after dinner we go fishing unless there is something major that needs taking care of and they respect that.

Most nights we get invited to a camp fire, offered a drink or 2 and enjoy listening to stories about their lives back in the city.

 

Yes there are headaches but I love it and would do it again. Oh and by the way when the season is over I love to snowmobile so we get to use the place when no one is there.

Although it does seem lonely at times. It's a fantastic place to be in the winter.

 

One thing you have to decide is, is it retirement/hobby or a business, there is a difference and you have to be careful what you buy.

Do you want a place with a marina, restaurant and all that comes with that type of place or just a few cottages to take care of.

Either way spend a few years looking around before you buy to see whats out there and what works best for you and your family.

All the best either way you go.

 

Ok, I think you can tell what side I am on as I love the place.

Mike

[wormdunker]

Wow! Lottsa good info here. I as well wanted a resort type of business, dating back to 1984 when my wife & I did our first search. At that time the 4 resorts we looked at in the North Bay area were quite expensive compared to the income they produced. Also over the years we looked at a few others in the French River area. At no time did I see a resort that produced a comfortable income. Fast forward to 2015 - I'm nearing retirement (3 years & counting) & I have no desire to become a resort owner. I love fishing, hunting, snowmobiling & all the other outdoor activities. I know it's a lot of work & long hours to operate a successful resort. So "for that reason I'm out". When I retire I want to be able to spend my time in the great outdoors with family & friends. I don't wish to spend ALL of my time painting cottages, cutting grass, installing a new roof on cottage # 3 or picking up other people's garbage. Just stating my desires for retirement.

[jimmer]

Does anyone actually know how many lodges/fishing resorts there are in Ontario? The competition must be overwhelming. I know it's overwhelming when I'm looking for a new place to go.

[manitoubass2]

My gawd I couldnt even imagine???

 

There are SOOOOO MANY lakes in Ontario

[Blue Lk]

https://www.ontariossunsetcountry.ca/accom.cfm

Just the resorts in NWO

[woodenboater]

K Dub Mike.

 

that's the kind of place I would go to ! you can m the name of your place if you don't want to post it here and the Magnetawan area is great. The Mag is a great whitewater trip if you start at Ahmic to the Britt.