Raf Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) A RAV4 will be outmatched by that boat of yours easily. I'd never consider a rav4 to be a serious tow vehicle unless we're talking a utility trailer to your neighbourhood yard sales. Tacomas are nice and a great choice but be prepared to pay, unbelievable resale. cityfisher, there's something wrong with your jeep or your right foot. I get between 10-11 l/100 on the hwy (not towing) if i keep it under 115 in my 02 Limited v8. Towing my 1000lb rig, I'm around 12-13 keeping it ~100-105km/hr. Edited April 17, 2012 by Raf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckrb2007 Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 I have an '07 FJ Cruiser and absolutely love it.....would buy another in a heartbeat. It's built on a Tacoma chassis with the same 4.0l V6 in it as well. I pull my dads 18ft Princecraft around with no problems. Prior to the FJ I was in an '07 Dodge Durango with the Hemi in it. The wife wrote it off (not her fault) so with the insurance $$ we got the FJ. HUGE difference in the rides. I also use the FJ for back lake fishing trips as it's a super capable off-roader right out of the box. Yes, you'll pay more, but you might as well get exactly what you want when you purchasing a vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimaster Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 A RAV4 will be outmatched by that boat of yours easily. I'd never consider a rav4 to be a serious tow vehicle unless we're talking a utility trailer to your neighbourhood yard sales. Tacomas are nice and a great choice but be prepared to pay, unbelievable resale. cityfisher, there's something wrong with your jeep or your right foot. I get between 10-11 l/100 on the hwy (not towing) if i keep it under 115 in my 02 Limited v8. Towing my 1000lb rig, I'm around 12-13 keeping it ~100-105km/hr. +1 be very careful. 3000 pounds is a serious amount of weight to be hauling around on a regular basis. A friend of mine has a newer rav4 and I have driven it a fair bit, I would not consider it a tow vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icefisherman Posted April 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) +1 be very careful. 3000 pounds is a serious amount of weight to be hauling around on a regular basis. A friend of mine has a newer rav4 and I have driven it a fair bit, I would not consider it a tow vehicle. Is your friend's RAV4 the 4 or 6 cyl version? I am confused a bit here guys...if a vehicle is rated officialy for 3500 lbs towing and I am about 15-20% less than that...I cannot understadn why it will not be able to tow it? Yes we all wish we have double of tripple towing capacity but it is not always possible nor in the cards for many reasons. Again my Pathfinder is 3500lbs as well and I remember many many people telling me how it's pushing it with my 2800 lbs boat/trailer combo but I've personally done if for last 5 years not one issue ever. So now I am looking at considerably more powerful vehicle (100 HP more than the Pathfinder) and certified to tow 3500 lbs...so really don't see why it can't do it, what are those tow rating for then?!?....if anything I'd expect to do it bestter/easier than the Pathfinder...and save me ton of money in the process on mileage. It may not tow as powerful as some V8 engine but sure enough it should not have any issues with meager 2800 Lbs. behind itself ;-) We are not talking here about some 25 feet fiberglass boat that weights tripple than mine guys ;-) Anyone here who owns a RAV4 V6 Version using it to tow who can share personal experience on it? Edited April 17, 2012 by icefisherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillM Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 It's not the towing that gets people in trouble, it's the stopping (or lack thereof). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyb Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 It WILL be able to tow it...that's what the ratings are for. The ratings don't necessarily take into account how frequently you tow though. It may not hold up as well as the pathfinder or a beefier vehicle...but there are things you can do to help it last longer and put up with the extra strain. Heavy duty engine and transmission cooling can be added on, and sometimes they will come as part of the vehicle's tow package. Also trailer brakes I'd say would be a must in this case. The only other thing I can think of that you should look at is the torque difference between the Rav and the Pathfinder. The extra horsepower will be useless if there isn't enough torque. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icefisherman Posted April 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) It WILL be able to tow it...that's what the ratings are for. The ratings don't necessarily take into account how frequently you tow though. It may not hold up as well as the pathfinder or a beefier vehicle...but there are things you can do to help it last longer and put up with the extra strain. Heavy duty engine and transmission cooling can be added on, and sometimes they will come as part of the vehicle's tow package. Also trailer brakes I'd say would be a must in this case. The only other thing I can think of that you should look at is the torque difference between the Rav and the Pathfinder. The extra horsepower will be useless if there isn't enough torque. All good points Johnny. But they are not new to me as I've done it for years with the same boat and the Pathfinder. Should have mentioned tow use is average of once a week for say 6-7 months/year...most towing is 25km/25 min from home to Lake O.....maybe 7-8 longer trips per year of say 300 km round trip average. Hardly anything too exsessive that will kill any vehicle. I know stopping is something to consider ...again have plenty of experience and know how to stop with the trailer behind...done it zillions times, nothing super special there really...just take it easy on the brake pedal and think well ahead, keep distance etc. By the way...246 lb-ft of torque for the RAV4 V6 vs. 196 lb·ft for the Pathfinder....so 25% higher than the Pathfinder in that department. And I have seen RAV4 V6 coming originally wth included heavy duty towing package... You wouldn't believe how often I see people towing bigger boats than mine launching at Port Credit behind a sedan like Toyota Camry, Suburus, etc. ;-))) Best thing is to hear/read someone who owns one of those RAV4 V6 beauties to see how he likes towing with it.... Edited April 17, 2012 by icefisherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimaster Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) Yes its a v6 rav. ad as the others have stated its not the pulling its the braking, the shocks, the suspension componets, the unibody frame. Over time that much weight puts alot of stress on things. Will it pull it. My corolla will pull a 10,000 pound skid steer. That doesn't mean its safe and good for the vehicle long term. V6 or V8 Isn't as much of a concern to me when pulling anything. I am concerned about the brakes, suspension, weight and frame. You are like a teter toter when you're towing and your hitch is the bigfat guy jumping on the other end, your rear wheels are the center and you are sitting on the bumper... We all know that the most braking is done with the front wheels, as well the steering. so when you are bouncing down the road and your trailer pushes down on the back, you effectively have less weight on the front wheels, and less traction and braking ability. On dry pavent not such a big deal, but in the rain, snow etc... this can make a huge different. Also almost all AWD vehicles do NOT have a locked center differential meaning you only actually have traction on one wheel at a time unless you have an LSD. with a 4x4 you lock the front and back giving you traction on one front and one rear wheel(again unless you have an LSD, posi, sure grip etc..) Some have a snow mode or something like that to temporarily lock or clutch te front and rear axles together... This makes a huge difference when you are trying to tug your boat out of the water on a slippery, steep or gravel launch. Can you do it? yah no doubt. you can pull your boat with a rav or any other small compact SUV. Is it entirely safe? Well thats really up to you to decide. For me, I always like to have more towing capacity than what I need. Edited April 17, 2012 by jedimaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimace Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 It's not the towing that gets people in trouble, it's the stopping (or lack thereof). Great point. You don't want that Lund pushing your Rav4 around when you are on the brakes in a hurry. Good luck with your choice and make sure you have some fun with the test drives. It is always fun to watch the salesman squirm a bit. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icefisherman Posted April 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) We all know that the most braking is done with the front wheels, as well the steering. so when you are bouncing down the road and your trailer pushes down on the back, you effectively have less weight on the front wheels, and less traction and braking ability. On dry pavent not such a big deal, but in the rain, snow etc... this can make a huge different. Also almost all AWD vehicles do NOT have a locked center differential meaning you only actually have traction on one wheel at a time unless you have an LSD. with a 4x4 you lock the front and back giving you traction on one front and one rear wheel(again unless you have an LSD, posi, sure grip etc..) Some have a snow mode or something like that to temporarily lock or clutch te front and rear axles together... This makes a huge difference when you are trying to tug your boat out of the water on a slippery, steep or gravel launch. Very good discussion so far...by the way my point remains...when the licensing body certifies a vehicle for 3500 lbs towing capacity I logically assume such vehicle can and should be able to tow up to that much. Under all normal road conditions and those include rain and snow... And organizations who certify them must be considering towing includes stopping as well....otherwise it doesn't make any sense...why would a vehicle be rated for 3500 lbs if it cannot tow that much or cannot stop with trailer behind that is that heavy. All I am trying to say is RAV4 V6 rated at 3500 lbs by the authorities MUST be able to tow AND stop with such weight behind. And I am sure it is certified to do it in rain and snow (not that I'll be towing the boat in the snow;-) or slippery roads. Yes frequency of towing is the only thing that cannot be calculated in advance but as I said I don't do it that often or that far... Jedimaster, RAV4 V6 trully is an amazing vehicle from what I've been reading about it over the last 5 years. It actually has that option. What Toyota calls Vehicle Stability Control (VSC) with traction control (TRAC). Here is a quote I just found: ...this compact crossover come available with front-wheel drive or all-wheel drive with a locking center differential. The optional all-wheel-drive system uses electronic control to send power rearward when slippage in front is detected, and it offers a lock that fixes the front/rear torque split at 50/50. This last feature should score the RAV4 high marks with the four-wheeling crowd as well as some true capability in slush, snow, and mud. Its improved stability (from its wider track) and smoother ride (from its longer wheelbase) make it, once again, top of its class, thanks to an all-new suspension and stiffer chassis. Edited April 17, 2012 by icefisherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarg Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Very good discussion so far...by the way my point remains...when the licensing body certifies a vehicle for 3500 lbs towing capacity I logically assume such vehicle can and should be able to tow up to that much. Under all normal road conditions and those include rain and snow... And organizations who certify them must be considering towing includes stopping as well....otherwise it doesn't make any sense...why would a vehicle be rated for 3500 lbs if it cannot tow that much or cannot stop with trailer behind that is that heavy. All I am trying to say is RAV4 V6 rated at 3500 lbs by the authorities MUST be able to tow AND stop with such weight behind. And I am sure it is certified to do it in rain and snow (not that I'll be towing the boat in the snow;-) or slippery roads. Yes frequency of towing is the only thing that cannot be calculated in advance but as I said I don't do it that often or that far... Jedimaster, RAV4 V6 trully is an amazing vehicle from what I've been reading about it over the last 5 years. It actually has that option. What Toyota calls Vehicle Stability Control (VSC) with traction control (TRAC). Here is a quote I just found: ...this compact crossover come available with front-wheel drive or all-wheel drive with a locking center differential. The optional all-wheel-drive system uses electronic control to send power rearward when slippage in front is detected, and it offers a lock that fixes the front/rear torque split at 50/50. This last feature should score the RAV4 high marks with the four-wheeling crowd as well as some true capability in slush, snow, and mud. Its improved stability (from its wider track) and smoother ride (from its longer wheelbase) make it, once again, top of its class, thanks to an all-new suspension and stiffer chassis. Its rated maximum is not the same as what it can comfortably do, under ideal conditions it will likely do more, when those conditions are less than ideal the weight it can tow comfortably will be less, if you want something that can tow comfortably you want the tow rating of your vehicle to easily be able to handle the trailer. If it stops only adequately on dry pavement, it will stop something less than that when its wet, if it does the job adequately on mild grades it will do less on steep hills, if the cooling system of the vehicle keeps up on the average day how will it do on a very hot day, long trip, uphills, etc etc. You want headroom, you will in all likely hood be fine with something rated close to you trailer weight, but there may be times you wish you had more, I could be rated to bench press two hundred pounds, but its near my limit and it isnt easy, i can do 150 all day (kinda), rating me for 200 would be a little exaggerated. My mini van pulled my trailer, but you could feel it, and it didnt stop easily, it didnt manage hills easily, it strained coming up the ramp, backing into my driveway, but it worked, just not easily/comfortably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRIFTER_016 Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Very good discussion so far...by the way my point remains...when the licensing body certifies a vehicle for 3500 lbs towing capacity I logically assume such vehicle can and should be able to tow up to that much. Under all normal road conditions and those include rain and snow... And organizations who certify them must be considering towing includes stopping as well....otherwise it doesn't make any sense...why would a vehicle be rated for 3500 lbs if it cannot tow that much or cannot stop with trailer behind that is that heavy. All I am trying to say is RAV4 V6 rated at 3500 lbs by the authorities MUST be able to tow AND stop with such weight behind. And I am sure it is certified to do it in rain and snow (not that I'll be towing the boat in the snow;-) or slippery roads. Yes frequency of towing is the only thing that cannot be calculated in advance but as I said I don't do it that often or that far... Jedimaster, RAV4 V6 trully is an amazing vehicle from what I've been reading about it over the last 5 years. It actually has that option. What Toyota calls Vehicle Stability Control (VSC) with traction control (TRAC). Here is a quote I just found: ...this compact crossover come available with front-wheel drive or all-wheel drive with a locking center differential. The optional all-wheel-drive system uses electronic control to send power rearward when slippage in front is detected, and it offers a lock that fixes the front/rear torque split at 50/50. This last feature should score the RAV4 high marks with the four-wheeling crowd as well as some true capability in slush, snow, and mud. Its improved stability (from its wider track) and smoother ride (from its longer wheelbase) make it, once again, top of its class, thanks to an all-new suspension and stiffer chassis. My vehicle is a little larger (Honda Pilot) than the Rav4 you're looking at but I can say that pulling my 18 footer is like it's not even there. My popup camper is another story but it's very near the towing limit of the vehicle while my boat is at about 50%. You definately know the camper is there but it pulls and stops fine. My vehicle has the same type of all wheel drive system including the center locking diff and the only thing you need to be aware of is you start off in front wheel drive and if the front tires start to slip it shifts some power to the rears. This is all fine and good and it works fine but you need to make sure you do your tire rotation. The reason is the little bit of slippage on the front before it brings in the rears tends to wear the fronts much more quickly than the rears. If you never rotate the fronts will be slicks before the rears show any wear at all. Just a little something you will need to be aware of. One more thing to check is the Rav4's maximum tongue weight and the actual tongue weight of your trailer. My boat is well below the maximum but the camper is very close to maximum and it squats the rear pretty good even with after market air bags. I think the Rav4 will be fine for your needs. IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headhunter Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Or, you could consider moving closer to the Lake (LakeO)as that is where the majority of you fishing time is spent. I hear Oakville has some nice places! Good luck Emil... and one word of advice... just because the "specs" say something, doesn't necessarily mean that it will do it well! HH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish4Eyes Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 My 96 4Runner is rated to tow 5000lb. No chance in hell it could actually do it safely. My boat and motor MIGHT weigh only 1500lb and I really feel the boat on the back when towing and especially braking. I wont even get into when I have it loaded for camping. icefisherman: we all know that keeping a safe distance should be practiced when trailering a boat and you will be ok driving mostly any vehicle, but consider yourself lucky that you have never had to brake suddenly and be required to come to a complete stop within a short distance. I don't know about others, but my truck sure as heck swerves to one side due to the weight of the trailer/boat when I brake hard (as light as it is). If your really stuck on the Rav4, get trailer brakes put on your trailer and your gold. PS: friends of mine have a 4 cylinder rav4 and complain that it is a pig on gas, so ensure you inquire on a rav4 forum or something with regard to the realistic fuel economy. My buddy claims it wastes more than his 330 v6 bmw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityfisher Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 A RAV4 will be outmatched by that boat of yours easily. I'd never consider a rav4 to be a serious tow vehicle unless we're talking a utility trailer to your neighbourhood yard sales. Tacomas are nice and a great choice but be prepared to pay, unbelievable resale. cityfisher, there's something wrong with your jeep or your right foot. I get between 10-11 l/100 on the hwy (not towing) if i keep it under 115 in my 02 Limited v8. Towing my 1000lb rig, I'm around 12-13 keeping it ~100-105km/hr. must be as Ive never got numbers like that! I assume my 20 inch summer rims dont help, but even before i never got the numbers your getting .. o Well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimaster Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 There is alot more to consider than just the towing capacity.. Curb weight 3677 lbs GVWR 4720 lbs This leaves a payload of 1043 lbs Your trailer is 3000 pounds, so yout tongue is 300 pounds. that leaves 700 pounds for your occupants and luggage. This puts right at the tip toe end of the rated GVWR... Now another thing interesting to note is the GCWR. If a number is not explicitly specified it is assumed that the GCWR is The Curb weight plus the towing capacity. The payload is subtracted from the towing capacity. In other words you are not supposed to load the vehicle to the max GVWR and then tow the max Towing rating. So if you load a 1000 pounds in the car, your 3500 pounds is now 2500 pounds. Interestingly I saw references to the GCWR for a V6 Rav being only 4950. Now you may ask yourself well it weighs 3600 pounds and the GCWR is 5000 pounds so that leaves only 1400 pounds for payload and trailer. How is this possible that it could have a towing capacity and curb weight higher than the GCWR... Well the answer is that the RAV is not designed to tow that much weight. Anyway, be safe no matter what you drive or buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimaster Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 http://www.popupexplorer.com/forum/index.php?topic=73300.5;wap2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillM Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 You can never buy big enough... Ever thought of a short wheelbased Tahoe/Yukon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 There is alot more to consider than just the towing capacity.. Curb weight 3677 lbs GVWR 4720 lbs This leaves a payload of 1043 lbs Your trailer is 3000 pounds, so yout tongue is 300 pounds. that leaves 700 pounds for your occupants and luggage. This puts right at the tip toe end of the rated GVWR... Now another thing interesting to note is the GCWR. If a number is not explicitly specified it is assumed that the GCWR is The Curb weight plus the towing capacity. The payload is subtracted from the towing capacity. In other words you are not supposed to load the vehicle to the max GVWR and then tow the max Towing rating. So if you load a 1000 pounds in the car, your 3500 pounds is now 2500 pounds. Interestingly I saw references to the GCWR for a V6 Rav being only 4950. Now you may ask yourself well it weighs 3600 pounds and the GCWR is 5000 pounds so that leaves only 1400 pounds for payload and trailer. How is this possible that it could have a towing capacity and curb weight higher than the GCWR... Well the answer is that the RAV is not designed to tow that much weight. Anyway, be safe no matter what you drive or buy. Ding Ding Ding!!!! We have a winner! I used to push my luck pulling my travel trailer with a Explorer Sport Trac. Wow life sure is better with the Expedition, until I get to the gas pump that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Bob Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 There are a LOT of opinions here and you know what they say about them... I will only speak from experience..... My 2002 V-6 Ford Escape with a tow rating of 3500, towed a 3000 lb pop up trailer (weight is fully loaded) out west to Yellowstone, Grand Canyon, Pikes Pike, Zion NP, Bad Lands, Mt Rushmore, etc...crossed the continental divide TWICE......without any issues whatsoever......but I did add another tranny cooler before doing this trip...the Escape with tow package already had on extra tranny cooler..... If your pushing the limits of your tow vehicle I would highly recommend a tranny cooler.....you can install it yourself for about $150......CHEAP tranny insurance.... On the stopping concerns.....just add electric brakes if you suddenly feel this new vehicle cannot handle the job......about $300 Or you can get a full size truck that will cost you more and more each time you fill up......if you go that route the Toyota Tundra is highly recommended by Billy Bob...... Good Luck in your new vehicle venture and let the good deal gods be in your favor...... Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 Something else to think about, this article mentions the lack of used cars because of the downturn in '09. Supply and demand. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-drive/driving-it-home/banking-on-buying-used-think-again/article2405145/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Targa01 Posted April 17, 2012 Report Share Posted April 17, 2012 If I was going to buy a new tow vehicle I would buy a ford f 150 eco boost. Lots of room inside and plenty of power for towing and great on gas. I have a Sierra 2500 6 liter and its an amazing truck but im thinking about trading it in for a eco boost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smally21 Posted April 18, 2012 Report Share Posted April 18, 2012 talk to someone that owns the new ecoboost before buying/suggesting them. we all know the mileage ratings on vehicle windows mean nothing but the ecoboost takes the cake. a new F150 with the V6 ecoboost gets the same 14-16 MPG as any other full size truck. after paying a huge premium to get their smallest engine... BTW who are the 'authorities' and 'organizations' being referred to in regards to towing capacities? these are numbers slapped on vehicles by the manufacturers they are about as helpful as the expected mileage numbers.. +1 on the tacoma! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkbait22 Posted April 18, 2012 Report Share Posted April 18, 2012 Wow this has been educational. Thanks! Some links that helped me http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/towing-capacity/vehicle/gcwr.htm http://www.internetautoguide.com/13-1/car-specifications.html http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/findacar.shtml http://calculator-converter.com/l_100km_mpg_convert_mpg_to_l_per_100_km.php BTW - the Rav sounds not up for the job. Tacoma GCVW is 8100 vs 4950 for the Rav. If I understand you should be pulling much more than 1500lb. Perhaps 3500lbs towing is with trailer brakes. Truck chasis can tow much more than car chasis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icefisherman Posted April 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2012 (edited) Very very good food for thoughts...but raising more questions than answers... Interestingly I saw references to the GCWR for a V6 Rav being only 4950. Now you may ask yourself well it weighs 3600 pounds and the GCWR is 5000 pounds so that leaves only 1400 pounds for payload and trailer. How is this possible that it could have a towing capacity and curb weight higher than the GCWR... Well the answer is that the RAV is not designed to tow that much weight. If you are right and those numbers are correct it in fact makes my point even more important....are you saying that the 3500 lbs towing capacity RAV4 V6 has is a bogus number and someone at Toyota is out to purposfuly mislead the public? If that is not what you are saying then what really is the meaning of the "towing capacity of 3500 lbs" ?!? It is obvious to me that one of the two numbers is wrong.... a) the towing capacity is not 3500 lbs... or b ) the GCWR is not 5000 lbs they cannot be both right... which one is it?!?! P.S. Out of curiosity could you please post the same numbers compariosn for the 1999 Nissan Pathfinder I've been towing with for the past 5 years or so. Let's see if similar comparison will make any sense there as it clearly makes NO sense with the RAV4 Cheers, Ice Fisherman Edited April 18, 2012 by icefisherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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