Proposed rainbow trout regulation Change for Lake Ontario ( fmz 20)

[esoxansteel]

Getting the limit down to 2 is a great step forward. This gives the shore anglers a similar advantage and perhaps a chance to increase the overall population back up to what should be acceptable. We will never see the populations like we did in the 80's, there have been many more fish stocked into the Great lakes and the bait fish populatoin can only sustain a certain amount as well. When was the last time you walked the shores and seen the Alwive die off after spawning like there use to be. When was the last great run of Smelt seen in any of the tribs?

 

In my opinion, the Trout and Salmon are the only fish which you can angle for before they get a chance to spawn. Even Pike will be closed in Lake O by the first of April. To me, I find it rather ironic that you can harvest fish before they get a chance to reproduce.

 

In my perfect world, the regulations would be like this:

 

Tagging system - 5 tags allotted with your Sport fishing license, 1 tag for conservation license.

 

Catch and release only from Jan 1 - 4th Sat in April.

 

For now, a 2 fish limit is a step in the right direction. We will have to wait and see if that will improve the population.

 

Cheers, Ron...

 

 

Regarding your coment about trout and salmon been the only fish angled before spawning, what about ice fishing for walleye on the BOQ or Scugog etc, and the new ice fishing for panfish in Zone 17 which also allows the taking of fish before they as well spawn , or should those above species be C and R as well.

[fishhunter]

I had to add my 2 cents to this one. After reading alot of posts I figured I would reply to a few in no order.

Well first off in August when the water gets warmer most fish move to deeper water. (blue zone). There is no way to keep one fish or another from hitting. some days you have lots of bows and a few salmon other days you have more salmon then bows. A ethical captain will fish where he wants to and how he wants to staying with in the law given to him making sure his clients are 100% happy.

I think this is not a bad thing putting the limit down to two bows but you will see alot of floaters when this starts. I do not use a net when we are not keeping bows and

I still get floaters from time to time and I'm Only one boat. When I get a floater I treat as a man over board drill with one person does not take his eyes off the fish untill its picked up. I will not leave a fish for gulls to pick eyes out till its dead

before you start pointing the finger at charter boats ask yourself how many people fish with rainbow roe (eggs)?

When charter boats get fish they dont say its a male and throw it back because it has no eggs. We dont use eggs for chum. Maybe people should look at the hole picture and ban roe fishing in lake ontario too.(I use roe for fishing but if that changes I welcome it with open arms)

How many female fish do you think would live in one year then two year and so on.............

I love people that are for catch and release but still use rainbow row. This means you need to kill a fish or two to use rainbow eggs for bait and if he or she fishes alot its more like 3-6 fish for a winter/spring season. My point is look at it all before you point fingers.

The Lake is only so big and and can only handle so many fish do to lack of food so if you think you will get it back to the way it was in the 80's then you live with blinders on.

Its a good thing when we try and fix something but look at all the problems not just one or two then to fix the problem. This is my 2cent and I'm sure Ill get them back ten fold.

Edited March 26, 2011 by fishhunter

[Ron]

Regarding your coment about trout and salmon been the only fish angled before spawning, what about ice fishing for walleye on the BOQ or Scugog etc, and the new ice fishing for panfish in Zone 17 which also allows the taking of fish before they as well spawn , or should those above species be C and R as well.

 

Perhaps a rephrase would be better. Trout and Salmonoids are the only species you can angle for while they are stageing. A river is much narrower than what Quinte is for an example.FMZ17 also set in place a size restriction to protect walleye to ensure they spawn at least once before harvest. As for pan fish, they are prolific spawners and keep in mind, the regs were recently changed to reflect this plus also to protect over harvest.

[rock34]

Awesome! This is so long overdue its incredible.

[chessy]

looks like we are going to have to do this by ourselves as the OFAH says they are not willing to suport this proposed regulation change

http://www.ofncommunity.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=52177

[TroutnMuskieHunter]

Awesome proposal!!!! ...it's about time and I hope it goes through!

[fishhunter]

Getting the limit down to 2 is a great step forward. This gives the shore anglers a similar advantage and perhaps a chance to increase the overall population back up to what should be acceptable. We will never see the populations like we did in the 80's, there have been many more fish stocked into the Great lakes and the bait fish populatoin can only sustain a certain amount as well. When was the last time you walked the shores and seen the Alwive die off after spawning like there use to be. When was the last great run of Smelt seen in any of the tribs?

 

In my opinion, the Trout and Salmon are the only fish which you can angle for before they get a chance to spawn. Even Pike will be closed in Lake O by the first of April. To me, I find it rather ironic that you can harvest fish before they get a chance to reproduce.

 

In my perfect world, the regulations would be like this:

 

Tagging system - 5 tags allotted with your Sport fishing license, 1 tag for conservation license.

 

Catch and release only from Jan 1 - 4th Sat in April.

 

For now, a 2 fish limit is a step in the right direction. We will have to wait and see if that will improve the population.

 

Cheers, Ron...

Mabye its times we stop taking steps and get right to the top all at once. The problem is no one has the brass monkeys to piss everone off at same time and fix the hole problem all at once. I have always liked the tagging system. Yes it would work but problem is we dont have enough people to look after what laws we have now. But its a system I would vote for. Catch and release on a fish that is in a river system for spawning from Jan1 till last Sat in April would be also something I would vote for.

[bigugli]

ITS ABOUT TIME.........They should do one better and have no possession limit, all c&r. Also they should start stocking the watersheds too. Go the same route as the states. Their rivers boast great numbers of bows and maybe add a few co's to the mix as well

To sustain such suggestions are you willing to support zone by zone, or species specific licensing like in Europe? The average taxpayer won't fork out for it.

Hoewever, if we want to up the return rates to spawning grounds, maybe we should just close those year round exeptions for trout on L Ontario. I'm not a trout angler per say, but from simple observation, there is a lot of scapegoating going on. If the damage is as bad as stated, reducing the limits is fine, but at the same time, close off all the open tribs until April opener. All I hear is "make someone else sacrifice", "it's their fault" but "don't touch my holy grail". Rather hypocritical from an observer's perspective.

Edited March 27, 2011 by bigugli

[Carp]

With the exception of a trout that may be injured & won't survive (rare), I practice catch & release on L.Ontario.

Anything that's good for the fishery is O.K. with me.

 

An idea to help the spawning fish would be extending the closed season by a week or two.

Edited March 27, 2011 by Carp

[Terry]

To sustain such suggestions are you willing to support zone by zone, or species specific licensing like in Europe? The average taxpayer won't fork out for it.

Hoewever, if we want to up the return rates to spawning grounds, maybe we should just close those year round exeptions for trout on L Ontario. I'm not a trout angler per say, but from simple observation, there is a lot of scapegoating going on. If the damage is as bad as stated, reducing the limits is fine, but at the same time, close off all the open tribs until April opener. All I hear is "make someone else sacrifice", "it's their fault" but "don't touch my holy grail". Rather hypocritical from an observer's perspective.

 

that is what I see here too

[canadadude]

On the one hand the MNR wants to cut the Limits to sustain a population, on there other hand they don't want to allow Rainbow trout to reach the spawning sites needed for a selfsustaining population. They are treated as non native speceices but recently have been upgraded to desirable, if you want to increase or sustain the fishery naturally, spawning habitat must be available and needs to be the #1 priority.Cutting limits, banning roe, closing seasons and all these other band-aid solutions won't fix the problem unless the management of the spawning sites is fixed.

[Richard S.]

On the one hand the MNR wants to cut the Limits to sustain a population, on there other hand they don't want to allow Rainbow trout to reach the spawning sites needed for a selfsustaining population. They are treated as non native speceices but recently have been upgraded to desirable, if you want to increase or sustain the fishery naturally, spawning habitat must be available and needs to be the #1 priority.Cutting limits, banning roe, closing seasons and all these other band-aid solutions won't fix the problem unless the management of the spawning sites is fixed.

 

The only river in regards to L. Ont that I am aware of where steelhead can't reach sutible spawning sites without help is the Credit river. Now having said that, just wait, the ladder in Norval will change everything.

 

 

Rich.

[BillM]

The only river in regards to L. Ont that I am aware of where steelhead can't reach sutible spawning sites without help is the Credit river. Now having said that, just wait, the ladder in Norval will change everything.

 

 

Rich.

 

Steelhead aren't being lifted at Norval only Atlantics I think. I could be wrong, but I thought that was the case.

[Richard S.]

Atlantic's, lake run browns, resdient browns and brookies, red sided dace, and american eel(i could be missing some) will be able to utilize the ladder to migrate upstream when it opens. Steelhead are still being transfered upstream.

 

 

Rich.

Edited March 28, 2011 by Richard S.

[Garnet]

This years is the 30th anniversary of the 100 year flood of Port Hope 1981. All the rivers were stripped of there silt. Ganny, Wilmot, Bowmanville, Oshawa ,Duffys everyone were silt free.

 

And that set the stage for in creditable reproduction. And the bait fish were in lake Ontario to support all these naturally reproduced fish.

 

So going back to the gory days of the 80's is just have a 100 year flood.

 

Lot's of guys go to Ohio,PA,NY and return with story's of huge catches 50 fish days all stocked fish. They look like steelhead but no thanks I will take naturals.

 

I will never support banning roe or fly only rivers. This is for elites,all these trout rivers are for family's and youth with to much time on there hands.

 

If you want to be elite just work around the important people.

[BillM]

 

 

Lot's of guys go to Ohio,PA,NY and return with story's of huge catches 50 fish days all stocked fish. They look like steelhead but no thanks I will take naturals.

 

 

There are more then a few South shore Lake E tribs that have natural populations of fish I'm assuming you've never fished down there.

[canadadude]

The only river in regards to L. Ont that I am aware of where steelhead can't reach sutible spawning sites without help is the Credit river. Now having said that, just wait, the ladder in Norval will change everything.

 

 

Rich.

Thats not exactly true, Bronte Creek has been degraded to a point it can't support healthy populations of trout. Dams built by Golf courses to create ponds have raised the water tempertures and reduced the flows so much that the spawning beds are silted over and the river has lost it's cold water.On the bright side Bronte is said to be getting a much needed restoration.

 

As for the Credit, I get upset when so much attention is given to this river in the way of stocking and restoration.Millions of dollars are invested in this system and yet we block the Rainbows and for that matter Salmon form reproducing.This river has the potential of being the one of, or the finest Steelhead fishery in Ontario, yet it has to be stocked and only a very few fish which have to be moved by hand ever reach the spawning sites.

[Garnet]

You would be wrong about me not fishing south shore. And they all have the stocker's in them making the whole crowd just that much easier to catch. Fun to fish not that challenging.

[BillM]

You would be wrong about me not fishing south shore. And they all have the stocker's in them making the whole crowd just that much easier to catch. Fun to fish not that challenging.

 

Of course they all have stocked fish, that wasn't my point. My point was, is that a lot of them still have wild fish populations along with the stockers. The Catt would be a great example.

[chessy]

The ganaraska has never been stocked with rainbows they use the ganny fo brood stalk for other rivers

[john from craa]

Unless things have changed Bill, the Catt does not have a significant wild population. Last time I spoke with NY's head bios they were hoping to 10-20% wild fish at best. Sure, still some. But that system is overrun with strays from Penn.

 

The Credit was 82% wild last year (09/10) and last fall about 98% wild, but most MNR stockers run in March so that percentage will drop once the lifts are complete. But alas, we still have to transfer the steelhead by hand.

 

Cobourg Creek recently had a record year flood. That can help...too bad it didn't knock out a few more dams.

 

Keep those comments coming to MNR. With OFAH apparently not supporting the lower limit the more people that speak up and do support it will help! There is plenty of science to support a two fish limit and none I have seen to support five fish (for a sustainable population).

 

John

[craigdritchie]

The ganaraska has never been stocked with rainbows

That is absolute nonsense - at one time the Ganaraska was one of the most heavily stocked rivers in all of Ontario, receiving in excess of 100,000 steelhead per year. Chessy, where do you think the fish came from in the first place? You do realize that rainbows are not native to the Great Lakes, right? It was many years of stocking huge numbers of fish, plus building the fishway on Corbett Dam in the late 70s, that resulted in the steelhead population developing into what it is today.

[chessy]

@craig . i will find out . from my understanding the ganaraska river is 97% wild. and what we were told the ganny has NEVER been stocked. and i am aware that the rainbows are not native to ontario i will find out 100% tomorrow. as i will be talking directly to the lomu about the fishway operation for the year

[chessy]

@ craig . fish were stocked in the ganaraska river in the 70 71 but studies have proved that the strain of fish they were using did not survive (old fish that needed to be hand milked) the ganaraska is 97 % wild and no stocking has been done since 71

[Spiel]

@ craig . fish were stocked in the ganaraska river in the 70 71 but studies have proved that the strain of fish they were using did not survive (old fish that needed to be hand milked) the ganaraska is 97 % wild and no stocking has been done since 71

 

As a long time outdoor writer/angler I'm sure Craig is well aware of the stocking history of the Ganaraska and likely everything else Steelhead/Great Lakes related. I suspect what he was implying was for you to become more aware of the facts before you espouse it as doctrine. Applause to you for looking into it.