Rant NF

[Big Cliff]

This has been a really good thread with many good points both pro and con. I guess it all boils down to whatever you are comfortable with.

 

After my dad died my mom did the best she could to raise two sons. Social assistance, what was that? Mom walked to work every day winter and summer about a mile each way and those Quebec winters were cold. A woman didn't make much in those days but we had a roof over our head and she always managed to pay the bills and put food on the table but there weren't any extras.

 

Growing up poor made me appreciate every opportunity I had to get ahead. Every year the local news paper would have a subscription drive in Nov. and they would always have a contest and cash priizes (kids only) it was a small town and everyone knew everyone else. Every afternoon after school and on weekends I would be out there banging on doors, heck, I had some people that probably still have the subscriptions that I sold them back then LOL.

 

Every year I won either first or second prize, I was a kid at the time but as I grew older I realized that the people who bought a three year subscription from me EVERY year were just trying to help me because I was trying to help myself, the lessons I learned from those people have stuck with me today.

 

I know what it's like to not have the money to go to camp with the other kids, I couldn't play hockey because I didn't have skates (well a pair of girls skates but those darn picks and besides I was a boy). I know what it feels like when all your friends are talking about the big turkey they had for Christmas dinner and all your mom could afford was a chicken, I know what it's like when all the other kids are talking about the toys they got for Christmas or their birthday and you couldn't. Don't get me wrong, there was always a present under the tree for us or a gift on our birthday and everyone of them came with all the love you could pack into them but paying the bills and putting food on the table came first. We didn't have much but we didn't owe anything.

 

Perhaps growing up like that has made me the way I am today. I enjoy the opportunity to help others, it makes me feel good, be it slipping a panhandler a buck on the street (I always look them right in the eye and smile and tell them to have a nice day, they are people too regardless of their circumstances) or just trying to do something nice for someone everyday. I don't feel it's my place to tell the panhandler how to spend the money I give him, if he uses it to buy booze than it's his choice, it was a GIFT from me.

 

I have been very fortunate over the years and now I am in a position where I can do things to help others, we don't have a lot of money, but we've got enough. I am blessed with a wife that feels the same way I do.... do unto others. Our house isn't very big or fancy but you couldn't pack any more love into it if you tried.

 

Can't remember where I heard it but a long time ago someone said "it's not what you have when you leave this life that's important, it's what you leave behind"!

 

Guess we all just have to do what's best for us!

[Terry]

I disagree with just about everything Kirk said

 

posting on a website stating there is a cause that could use some money is a heck of a lot different then kids walking up to you and some have a pretty slick and practised line to try to make you feel you have to donate

or worst they bang on your door and lay on the guilt trip....that is panhandling and I think I red that about 20% of them are not collecting for a real cause and are unwitting participants in a con ...............

 

if the kids want to put up a sign in front of a store that states what they are selling/ pitching and sit and wait for you to come to them..that's fine, but in your face give me, give me is panhandling.......

a post about a cause on this website....is a choice that each person can make with no pressure ..

 

as I said I would never let my kids panhandle..(if you don't like that word, Begging is another word that comes to mind feel free to change the word panhandling to begging)..I just bought all the chocolate bars they brought home from school

[Fish Farmer]

Don't want to railroad your post Roy but, I wonder when they are going to start collecting money for the 25 million there going to pay for you know who, I just heard on the news. Or is that why they want to put toll on the 400 series HWY's or is this coming out of our fishing license money or taxes.

Good rant Roy

Now that you got my blood pressure up

[lew]

Here's another slant on things.

 

Back when I was a kid in the 50's we'd look forward to monster snow storms cause that always meant $$$$ in our pockets.

 

Me and Eddyk would grab our shovels and off we'd go around the neighborhood and we'd bang on EVERY door and ask if they'd like their driveways and sidewalks shovelled and most people would say yes. We never set a price but left it up to the homeowner, but it seemed we were always happy with what we got.

 

Same as the summer time, we'd wander the streets cutting grass or trimming hedges and when it was too hot to do that, we'd set up a lemonade stand in front of the house and make a bit of money that way.

 

We'd go to the local park in the evening where there was organized baseball and be the "bat-boy" for the teams. We'd run out and grab the bat after the ball was hit then run back to the dugout with it. We'd get a quarter a game and they'd give us all the broken bats that we'd take home and nail & tape back together.

 

We'd make lots of $$$$ at Christmas time cause a whole group of us would go door-door singing Christmas caroles. I don't think we were very good but the neigbors seemed to like it anyways and always payed us what they could afford.

 

When my kids were small, they did the exact same things as I did and were always out hustling for some extra spending money and used to do quite well at it.

 

Now today, I can't remember the last time I had kids at the door singing Christmas carols, or cutting my grass or offering to shovel my driveway for a few $$$$ and I doubt if any of them have any idea what a lemonade stand is cause I haven't seen one in years.

 

It seems like their all very good at banging on my door looking for free money for school or hockey or a handout at the local CTC, but it's been years since heard a kid say "hey mister, I'll gladly shovel the 6" of snow from your driveway if you'd be kind enough to donate a few dollars to my hockey team"

 

I guess we can blame alot of todays parents for that, but it seems to me there's too much of "gimme for nothing" rather than "could I please do something for you in exchange for something you could do for me"

 

Liike a said though, that's just another slant on things from my perspective.

[huntervasili]

Ok well... I wasn't going to get involved here but not too many people have ever been on the "other side" being the age that I am I am still involved with some youth activities, particularly The Royal Canadian Air Cadets. I have spent 6 years there and can tell you that as a FREE youth organization it helps out alot of kids in more than one way. Regardless of if their parents are on welfare or pulling in hundreds of thousands a year, if they have come from halfway around the world or have always lived just down the road, they are all treated the same. It gives many of them friends they would otherwise not have and even the most unsocialable of people find someone to talk to. There are no designer clothes, fancy rings and jewelry, cell phones and items which will distinguish those with money with those who don't. It removes that barrier which is very important for everyone there. Anyone with any desire learns how to become confident and disciplined, and learn many skills useful in the real world. The whole reason for this is likely the fact that it is free and any child may join regardless of how much money a parent makes. It gives them a chance to go to camp for free, where they get everything payed for on a military base, and issued clothes again removing that wealth factor which often doesn't allow people to quite fit in. When your 12 and even when you are older what more could you ask for, regardless your walk of life? you get to join an organization which removes the bias people have and spend 2 or 3 or 6 weeks at a camp with people your age learning skills that will last a lifetime. Although the Summer Training is payed for Local headquarters training is only partially funded. Our squadron building is missing many ceiling tiles, has mold on the walls and carpeting because of the leak in the roof we cannot get fixed... The thought of having to move out because of ever increasing costs, and decreasing money. So why is fund raising important? So that we can afford to continue to educate and discipline young people. People continuously rant about disrespecting children, it is usually of course the cause of the parents but by joining a program such as the Cadets, you are taught self discipline. I for one, although I absolutely hate it, go to every fund raising event I possibly can get to between school and work, not because I couldn't afford to pay the fees which would be otherwise associated but because I know that because we do this it allows any youth to join this wonderful program. You may think well the hell with it, they are just doing it for themselves and their parents should pay... and it is ultimately your decision. But as cadets we march in the local Christmas parade you likely love to watch with your children, we sell poppies in memory of the fallen and in support of the ever declining amount of veterans we have, we pay our respects on all night vigils on Remembrance Day, and march in that parade too and pick up the garbage people drop carelessly onto the on ramps of highways and our local roads. All of this and much more, for no more than a thank you, and we don't ask for any more. All we ask is for is when we do our fund raising, mainly selling tags or selling lottery tickets, that you consider supporting us. As I said I don't enjoy it and although I could be working at my normal job making money, I am helping those who cannot afford to pay fees, and to me that is truly worth all 6 years and countless hours of community work and fund raising I have done. Maybe this will give you a new perspective and if it doesn't maybe you will at least learn that those of us who fund raise, don't necessarily enjoy it, but do it because it is necessary. Of course you have the right to walk on by, or avoid looking at us as if we don't exist, you can tell us you will get us on the way out and go out the back door, but look deeper than that. By all means don't give to all charities and organizations but at least treat us like human beings, we have feelings too and a smile and no thank you, or even a smile and hello or good day is a respectable act of kindness. It doesn't cost you a cent or even your time. But if you have some spare change or have some of your budget left for this kind of thing and feel so inclined give.

sorry for the length I guess I kinda got caught up in the moment. Hope you have a somewhat new perspective or atleast have understood one more thing from my words.

 

Bill

[muskymatt]

Time fer me to Jump in.

 

I just watched a spiel on the news this morning about an organization that ensures a lot of little children get a breakfast in the morning (in Toronto) so the kids can concentrate on their studies in class instead of being ..hungry.

Anyone who cannot afford to feed their children shouldn't have any.

 

Too many people have children that should'nt. They can barely support themselves, let alone the poor innocent children they drag into the world.

 

As another poster in this thread mentioned, too many single mothers wouldn't have a life if it wasn't for the children they had. The government jumps in and provides assistance. It should jail the mother and put the kids up for adoption with people who are established, educated and able to provide a nurturing and caring environment away from the welfare cycle.

 

 

So let me get this right ....you want to jail single mothers and take away their kids .

No matter how they got to be single moms....what about widows, abused women, deadbeat dads...???

 

 

Stop drinkin the ceeement pond water Clamp-it, it'll affect your brain.

[Terry]

I think from this thread I can pick the NDPers, the Liberals and the conservatives

 

and the commie pinko sots too..I guess sots = a child born out of wedlock. starts with a bas and ends with a tard

Edited February 6, 2008 by Terry

[huntervasili]

I think from this thread I can pick the NDPers, the Liberals and the conservatives

 

and the commie pinko sots too

 

lol some comments have been somewhat uncalled for... I hope this thread doesn't go downhill though. Everyones gotta get out and go fishing Cabin fever has some side effects

[Danubian]

Most of us pay taxes through the nose, and still can see all these kids "greeting" you at the doors of many stores, or having the tellers at the grocery stores asking you to make a charity donation.

Nothing wrong with being charitable, but what tickles me really bad is tax money spent away on poor deals. Remember that Chicoutimi submarine that burned and killed an officer on its "maiden voyage"? (Well, not quite maiden, since it was bought second hand from the British fleet...) I could come with some more examples, but you got my point.

Those money could have funded a lot of kids' trips to Europe, sport clubs, poor kids' breakfasts and so on... Go rattle your pans to Ottawa!

[Joey]

Time fer me to Jump in.

 

 

As another poster in this thread mentioned, too many single mothers wouldn't have a life if it wasn't for the children they had. The government jumps in and provides assistance. It should jail the mother and put the kids up for adoption with people who are established, educated and able to provide a nurturing and caring environment away from the welfare cycle.

 

Geez, and I was always under the impression that it took two people to make a baby

 

Must be divine intervention or something

 

 

Anyhow, I have a feeling alot of the responses here are changing the original intent of this thread that Roy was trying to make, so I'm not going to chime in any further.

 

Joey

[TennesseeGuy]

Yeah Joey, many of the fathers are nothing more than sperm suppliers and never contribute anything toward raising their child. Deadbeat dads should be put to work digging holes for Dawg in the summer and shoveling snow for Bunk in the winter.

 

We'd do well to educate people to produce a product to support their life style rather than asking for handouts. The giverment ruins incentive by rewarding failure.

 

Down here we're now seeing crack babies growing up and giving birth to crack babies of their own. The rest of us are footing the bill for their "fun".

 

We're getting into a complex problem that doesn't have a simple solution.

[capt bruce]

Joey I feel the same , I hear the words ,"SINGLE PARENT FAMILYS" , (in the case of the death of one parent yes this term is correct BUT) IT takes TWO 2 , people to make a child . ALL CHILDREN HAVE(had) 2 PARENTS .These people that have children they cant afford , dont have the time for , AHHHHHH!!!!!, makes me think Clamp-it might have the right idea , some one should be punished NOT the children they bring into the world .It would be a cold cold day in hell before I ever bought a beer ,had a smoke etc., before anything my children needed was gotten .

[Kirk]

Hey Terry,

 

I buy my kids stuff as well, only because he's not at the age yet that he can sell stuff on his own and when that time comes, I'll buy the chocolates as well, cause I wouldn't want some ______ to bad mouth him, BUT like I said, a smile and no thanks works just as well, as opposed to getting off on 'winning' an argument with a child or insulting and name calling kids with slurs like 'panhandler', thats classless, makes you wonder who has the brains, the kid or the 'adult'.

 

And I don't see the difference between a kid asking for you to buy a chocolate bar and posting the same sort of request on a message board. Same sentiment and it might result in the same 'panhandling' slur by other's.

 

I guess what it comes down to is being able to politely interact with children...and if ya can't...just smile and nod (most anyone should be able to do that without ranting LOL)

 

This threads a joke anyway based on the initial content...

 

FYI I'm a proud conservative party member, I just don't feel the need to put down kids to make myself feel superior.

[Terry]

LOL ..I don't bad mouth the kids....as most don't and I see that as part of the problem

I believe it is why the Jehovah witness now bring kids with them most times when knocking at doors...because people will restrain themselves when kids are around..........

but when I say no thanks and the kid gives the pouty look and says ah come on don't you like kids and what not..that is too much and it is that kind of begging I don't like.....

 

and it's not just kids in my books

 

here in Bradford the fire department bocked off the main road and had big firemen boots held out to the cars to get a donation....I was 15 minutes late for an appointment because of them.....how dare they......................

[lew]

here in Bradford the fire department bocked off the main road and had big firemen boots held out to the cars to get a donation....I was 15 minutes late for an appointment because of them.....how dare they......................

 

Terry, Fire Fighters across North America have been raising funds to fight musclar dystrophy for decades and have raised millions upon millions of dollars to fight the disease and are historically the largest fund raiser of any other organization.

 

It's something the firemen across the continent took on a long time ago and they will go on soliciting funds until the disease is conquered.

 

Sorry you were late for work because of it, but I figured if you knew the probable reason for the delay, you wouldn't feel so angry.

 

Now if they were raising money for a hocky game, that's a different story

 

And BTW, I agree with you about the Jehovas Witnessess and their tag-along kids !!

[Joey]

This threads a joke anyway based on the initial content...

 

Wow that's harsh

 

Find a solicitation on the back of your cereal box this morning Kirk

 

Alot of interesting points have been made here. Lets keep it civil.

 

Joey

[capt bruce]

Kirk I never said I call the kids panhandlers (tho I agree that what this amounts to )I am allways polite when I turn down their requests . When my children got older I did incourge them to earn their own money , BY WORKING FOR IT . I dont think this selling of things AS WORK and would NEVER ALLOW my child to do it . Why do you think its so easy for some kids today to just park them selves on the sidewalk and beg . Matbe Its because I work at KING and JOHN streets and have to step over people to get into the building to go to work that makes me so jaded . but its like we have become a society of BEGGERS everyone has his hand out for this for that me me me give me some give me some , buy my newspaper its for a good cause buy my choclate , give give give. HOw is it that i raised four children and lived these 57 years WITHOUT ASKING ANYONE TO buy give whatever !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Cory]

LOL ..I don't bad mouth the kids....as most don't and I see that as part of the problem

I believe it is why the Jehovah witness now bring kids with them most times when knocking at doors...because people will restrain themselves when kids are around..........

 

Do what I do...answer the door naked, with my big black lab....they go away pretty quick.

 

PS...Anybody know a good muskie guide or muskie fishing show?

[Terry]

well I don't think they or anyone else has the right to block a road to solicit or anything in the world.......

 

they block the beer store to do the same thing and I can live with that but not a road...the main road and the only road through town........

 

it may be a great cause, but the squeeze kids they their cause is great too.......

[Kirk]

If you can dish it out you should be able to take it.

 

I stand by the accuracy of my opinion.

 

There's just too many 'adults' trashing kids these days, without justification.

 

And why would you think I'm in a bad mood when I'm just enjoying what I'm doing???

 

If I were to rant it would be the 8-0 footbal game score against the Buds.

[ecmilley]

boy your all getting testy today, i knows it still 94 days till open water eyes but i am sure that there is better things to beat up each other over.

[hawkeye]

I for one would just like to go shopping without someone begging for money for whatever

[douG]

Education funding was cut under previous conservative governments. Maybe that was a good thing. That is one reason that schools are sending out the troops to canvass.

 

If you ever remember doing this sort of thing as a kid, you know that they are working hard for all money that they raise. I choose to support them and encourage the things they are doing with the small amount of money they raise.

[Jason Vernooy]

There is nothing wrong with a hockey team doing something civic minded...raking leaves, shovelling snow... when they have these chocolate drives the only winner is the orginal chocolate maker. Many "charitiable organization have executive directors making big momney for little effort.

The school system is a joke......the education system thinks that they need to provide a program for special needs students. These programs are often based in core schools, where parenting is suspect at best and home discpline is never thought of. If the education system where to clean up its act, and have the guts to place some of the accountablilty back on the parents, several, not all, of these programs could be discontinued, resulting in extra gov't funding for other organizations

By the way, many call centres, ie. Shirner, Firefighters, Police services, Circus telemarketers are able to retain 45% of any thing they sell. Always be careful with them

[Lostchild]

I think everyone on this board would "give" or "hand-out" when the situation calls for.

 

I have seen it first hand time in and time out!