Big Cliff needs a hand, can you help?

[Old Ironmaker]

See Big Cliffs thread " I hate to ask but." I'm sure there are 10 guys with good backs to help this man that has a heart of gold. You all know he would be there for us if asked in a minute.

 

My body isn't up to laying interlock but I will be there to do what I can if we can get 10 or so more volunteers.

 

Everyone loves Big Cliff here, he needs help, what do you say folks? I'm in, what about you guys?

 

A great excuse to have a OFC get together too!

 

Johnny D

[Big Cliff]

Johnny, thank you for the kind words but it looks like we might be ok. One of my neighbors found out yesterday that I was having trouble finding helpers and he talked to a couple of other neighbors, he just dropped in on his way to work, looks like I might just have most of the people I need.

 

Besides you'd spend more time driving here and back than the job would take, we only have about 250 sq ft and one small set of steps to put in. Most of the gravel is already in place, a few shovels for rough leveling and then the sand is all that is required now. Then it is laying the pavers and finishing.

 

(mind you, a couple of strong young men wouldn't be turned away LOL there is going to be lots of heavy lifting involved).

[Old Ironmaker]

I'm glad to hear you have it covered. When they are done there send them down here I have a few things I need done. I'm at that time in life where all my pals are the same age as me and just can't do the heavy lifting. Locally there are a few young bucks that we would pay $15.00/hr for general labour plus lunch and a pop after putting away the tools. Plus picking them up and driving them back home, kids without an education can forget about having a car today. Called one kid this spring and he informs me they want $25.00/hr. cash. "Good luck on your job hunting kid" I told him. The other kid called me and said 20 was fine, no way, now I'm a little put off. Like you said it's tough to get good help today.

[Big Cliff]

I hear you Johnny, most of my friends are in their mid to late 60s too, I am one of the lucky ones, I can still put in a good day of work, I might hurt like heck after but I can usually get it done. Can't handle the heavy stuff anymore, anything over about 25 kg is a real struggle for me. Oh well it is still better than most my age LOL, be thankful for the little things!

 

One young local fellow called me up wanting work, I offered him $13.00 an hour, he told me he doesn't get out of bed for anything less than $18.00 an hour cash, I don't get paid that for driving truck LOL. Guess he can sleep in again this weekend!

[grimsbylander]

$18 cash for general labour? That's like making around $24 in a registered job. Things have changed, if I needed money I would have gotten out of bed for damn near anything per hour. I guess that's the answer, they don't NEED anything.

[DanD]

My family has been (or use to be) into tobacco farming for over 50 years.

During the 60's,70's and most of the 80's we always had local help; during harvest we'd board the crew and their wages grew to better then $150. per day/kiln.

The last couple of decades it became harder to find reliable locals to show up every morning, let alone them wanting to stay in a bunk house. Most of the locals that use to work harvest were either high school or university students; the kids today are not willing to get dirty working on a farm; regardless of the wage.

My brother had too bringing in Jamaicans or Mexicans for harvest; not because they were cheaper employees but because they were hungry for work and for them to get a contract with a Canadian farmer, was like winning the lottery for them.

 

Here at my shop I wanted to hire a helper for the months of July and August; just a pair of hands to help out while we were rotating though our summer holidays.

I was offering $15.00 an hour; I called some of the Coop kids that have come through here via their school. They weren't interested even thou the hours here, would apply towards an apprenticeship; when/if they found a full time position?

Their reasons, wanted the summer off or got a job telemarketing; where they could sit on their ass for the summer.

I did have one of the kid's uncle show up and ask for the job; but after shaking his hand I had to say no thank you to him. He smelt like the catch drain at the Labatt's brewery and it was only 10:30 in the morning?

Point being people who have a good work ethic are working and their employer is making sure to keep them. The sponges that don't are doing what you said Cliff; sleeping in.

 

Dan.

 

[Sinker]

They dont NEED anything, but WANT everything these days.

 

I worked for everything I have. My parents didn't leave me a choice. I jumped at any chance to make a buck when I was a kid.

 

S.

[bushart]

A little throwin hay bales in 99 degree hot sun will make the simple stuff seem like a paid holiday

 

I can remember being like 13 trying to sling bales that weighed more than me

 

And the loft on those days was a pleasant 110 degrees...and not dusty at all

 

Now even today's farmers are not havin to do it with the round bales

 

Called this one "Field Work"

 

 

 

[AKRISONER]

jeez, im only 26 and i still remember when it was a big deal because i got a raise to $8.10 an hour driving a tractor on a farm. That was a huge deal for me and it was only 8 years ago!

[fishnsled]

They dont NEED anything, but WANT everything these days.

 

S.

 

So very true, really sad as well.

 

Should have read this post first as it seems you have your crew Cliff, great news.

[Old Ironmaker]

I wouldn't put all of the kids in one basket. As an employer I found the young girls willing to do almost anything for minimum wage.

 

Now why would a kid need to go to work when he can hang with his buds all night playing video games until dawn, hit the sack until 1 PM, get up and his single Mom working 2 jobs has a meal ready for him to put in the microwave and 30 bucks on the table for his beer and cigarettes and the other crap they smoke? I know a slew of these kids, they are my nephews and friends as well as some friends boys. One kid of a pal is 35, living in the basement and only comes upstairs to grab his food then slither back down to his nest. Makes me want to slap him and strangle his mother and father. So who is at fault, the lazy kid or the idiot parent(s)?

 

Then I come to find out this year most are collecting a disability pension from you and I. They have issues you know and have to deal with things we didn't. Like what working for a living? A nuclear holocaust, maybe being sent to Vietnam, I was a kid in the states in the 60's, too young but.

 

I need to go clean my car, truck and boat I earned. The home is another story, my wife owns it, what a freeloader I am.

Edited August 14, 2014 by Old Ironmaker

[Rod Caster]

depends where you are and who you talk to. I can find cheap labor here no problems. In fact I have one guy (35 yrs old) who'll do any labor for $10/hr he's got a few skills too... and there have been several local ads in kijiji asking for work.

 

 

Good luck, hope you get your interlock job completed soon.

[davey buoy]

Look at the life long skills they can get when they have thier own place,Kids don't think like that,but getting paid to learn something that will most likely benefit them is priceless.That's how I thought when I was 13 or so.

Should add my grandfather built his own plane and it was still running up to 15 years ago,he's been gone 30 years now.

I was the only grandson,and he wanted my help for anything.Great life skills for sure.

Edited August 14, 2014 by davey buoy

[Big Cliff]

Life skills are what it is all about, learn everything you can, experience can't be bought.

 

I have never done interlock before and I am 68 but I am willing to learn! This job might not turn out as well as someone that has being doing it their whole life (although sometimes I find we set the standard higher for ourself than someone that does it every day) but it will turn out and when I am done I can add "doing interlock" to the list of many other things I have tried. Haven't succeded at everything (hang gliding was a disaster LOL) but I did try!

[HTHM]

Cliff use grade pipes to set grade. Compact the everloving &*(^()-9 out of the base, lay down ~1 of sand or screenings, level that out and with a string line set the line to a known height above desired finish grade, get a straight piece of lumber and screet out the sand or screenings and lay your stone on that flat surface. Oh, fill in the gap left by the pipe (1/2"conduit works well), as you are going. Easy peasy.

I have done interlock more than a few times and found this to be the easiest method for setting grade.

As well, I strongly suggest using an aluminum edge restraint.

[Old Ironmaker]

Big Cliff Albert knows what he is talking about, I don't do it exactly as he does but there are always more than one way to skin a Catfish. With his family background from the Netherlands and landscaping and my Italian decent and brickwork we would make a great pair for this. Except for me being right. You know what they say about the Dutch, wooden shoes, wooden boat, wouldn't listen.

 

Depending on the soil I might or might not use edging, aluminum is expensive, pressure treated 2X4's will do it again depending on what soil you have. Don't need it with the clay we have around here. I don't like to rush interlocking, it should take more than 1 day no matter how small. I water the packed screenings let it dry and screte a bit more, not dead level, flat yes but you need a slope to drain surface water, I like 1/8 inch per foot. I can get it like concrete before laying the brick. The laying of the interlock is the easy part. In the old days they insisted, whoever they were, to lay thick plastic over the substrate. All that does is to give a place for water to collect and freeze thus lifting the brick. The idea was weeds wouldn't grow in the joints. Weeds grow between the bricks on top of the joints, not from below. If I do help someone to do an interlocking anything and they insist they put down a membrane and I told them not to I ask why am I here then?

 

To finish I would use a mixture of powder like limestone fines with a touch of cement fines mixed in. Do this over a few days at least. Sweep in, blow dust off, water, let dry over night, blow clean and repeat until the joints are full. Power tamping now help the fines work their way too the full thickness of the brick. Watering helps the fines work all the way down to the tamped substrate. If you just sweep them in and put the tools away the fines go down an inch maybe, probably less, over time this will work down and the space left fill with dirt, then you will get weeds growing on the soil between courses of brick.

 

Big Cliff, please don't put down any plastic, they will lift and you will get more experience next year re laying them. If you don't prepare the substrate properly you will regret it. This isn't something you learn in a day Big Cliff.

 

If you don't get the right depth of packed screenings over your packed 4" of crusher run limestone the area may be too high or too low once interlocking stones are laid.

 

I think Albert should supervise this job. I'm only a phone call away. Insert smiley face and laugh out load here.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Old Ironmaker

[Big Cliff]

Well, for a base we have 6" of A gravel that has been in place for about a month now, it has been packed, rained on and packed again. One more packing again today with a heavy packer just to be sure.

 

Going on top of that will be 1" of construction sand, I am told it is better than screenings because it will let water drain away. Seems everyone has a preferance and they are all different. For sealing the cracks I have polymetric sand. For the edges I have a very heavy gauge plastic strip desigined for that purpose and 10" spikes to anchor that in place.

 

Just checked the weather forecast, yup, 100% chance of rain starting about noon, figures LOL. Well, we will do what we can and take it from there.

[Old Ironmaker]

You are good to go Big Cliff unless it rains. I bet you have gotten wet before and lived.

Edited August 16, 2014 by Old Ironmaker

[Big Cliff]

Yup, for once the weatherman was right, (for once) 12:00 almost on the dot the rain started. Now I am a sweet guy (or so I tell everyone) but I'm not made of sugar so I won't melt but those that know suggested it would be much easier to do the job if it wasn't raining.

 

2 of the people that were supposed to show up didn't but that's ok, turned out we had plenty of people. A few last minute revisions to the plan slowed things up as we had to do a bit more prep work but everything is graded, leveled (except for the sand) and compacted again, and watered and compacted again. Tomorrow comes the sand and then we start laying pavers.

[Beans]

Hey Cliff...I hope all goes well with the brick laying...I wish I was in shape to help...I was thinking of volunteering to be the dock fishing supervisor but remembered I don't have the means of getting down to your place (electric scooter not allowed on highways)...This being a one vehicle family is for the pits...LOL

[Big Cliff]

Beans, you wouldn't believe how nice it is turning out! I am going to do a proper post with pictures once it is all finished but suffice to say that Paul (manjo39) and Mike (wiskeywizard) have been so instrumental in this project, I hate to think of how it would have turned out if not for their help the last two days.

 

We ended up with Paul, Mike, Dillon, Anthnony, Larry and myself which turned out to be a perfect number of people for the work that had to be done and the space that we had to work in.

 

There is still a bit more to do but all the really tough stuff is done.