Looking for some Concrete advice on a major issue.

[Sinker]

Man Sinker you can be harsh sometimes. I was taught if you don't have anything nice to say about someone shut your mouth.

Maybe so, but i say what needs to be said, not what people want to hear.

 

The contractor messed up bigtime. I wouldnt settle for less than what i asked for.

 

S.

[ratherboutdoors]

I am trying to visualize the 6" and the 10'... assuming the underside of the concrete in the middle (or top of granular base) as 0 and the base is flat, then you have 6" concrete in middle, is the intent to have 10" high on the outside so you can grade the sod away? if that's the case then your contractor could dowel in a curb around the outside top edge of the pad allowing you better grading away from the slab. Its not monolithic but it would likely work well for you.

[BillM]

Maybe so, but i say what needs to be said, not what people want to hear.

 

The contractor messed up bigtime. I wouldnt settle for less than what i asked for.

 

S.

 

Bingo.

[John Bacon]

I sent an e-mail asking for 5 year warranty oddly no response. I am sure they are checking with legal for options.

 

If they decide no. Then no Money.

 

Such a hassle you hire experts to work for you and they let you down.

If you do settle for five year warrantly, don't pay them right away. Pay them in installments over the five years. That way, if there is problem, they will have to actually honour the warranty in order to get full payment.

[ch312]

Agreed the 10" at the side was just to act as a curb and push water away from the pad. If the water made it to the pad and buckled I would be "PO'ed" but accept it as a drainage issue.

 

My problem is with the 6" I lose the Curb appeal and I requested 10".. So if it buckles is that because it was 6" or because the drainage ;(

 

I'm in charge of prepping the base and placing/finishing concrete for jobs ranging from 4 to 6 digits in value and am still not fully understanding what you're describing. Did you want this:

 

A) |___________|

 

or

 

___________

| |

 

 

 

As for spending money and doing it right, many problem areas can be remedied by installing weeping tile with multiple weepers to allow water to leech into the surrounding soil rather than sitting below the slab. If the ground is clay they should have excavated a minimum of 18", packed clay with a jumping jack, installed landscape fabric, 12" of B gravel, followed by A gravel to final grade being sure to add only as much material as their plate tamper could adequately pack per lift. A huge problem we often see is some people think tossing 12" of gravel in a hole and packing it with their little plate tamper is sufficient when in reality their tamper is only rated for 3-4" lifts.

 

Some jobs require base preparation which greatly exceeds the cost of concrete and labor to place/finish it. You run into problems when neither the contractor or customer refuse to accept this.

[Old Ironmaker]

I as well can't understand this 6" centre and 10" curb to help with drainage. Drainage is from below the slab, a slope stops pooling or going to the homes foundation wall but not much to stop ice from heaving below. Spalling maybe but not lifting.

 

ch312, what do you mean by A gravel and B gravel? We always referred to type of stone for ASTM strength, crusher run size and screened or not.

Edited June 17, 2017 by Old Ironmaker

[G.mech]

ch312, what do you mean by A gravel and B gravel? We always referred to type of stone for ASTM strength, crusher run size and screened or not.

 

OPS Granular A & B are specifications for the size and constitution of granular fill materials. A gravel is finer than B gravel. For heavy duty applications, B gravel is usually used as a base with finer A gravel compacted on top. Often for sidewalks and slabs, the native material or topsoil is removed and replaced with compacted granular A.

 

 

Granular A

Ontario Provincial Standards Specifications 1010, granular base material. Mixtures of sand and crushed gravel, crushed rock, blast furnace slag or nickel slag, reclaimed Portland cement concrete, reclaimed asphalt pavement (RAP), crushed post-consumer glass, and/or crushed ceramic material, produced within specific gradation bands, 100% passing by mass through the 26.5 mm (1 inch) sieve. Limits on fines of a maximum of 8% (10% for quarried material) and a requirement for a minimum of 50% crushed particles.

Granular B

Ontario Provincial Standard Specifications 1010, granular subbase material. Mixtures of sand and gravel, crushed rock, blast furnace slag, or nickel slag, reclaimed Portland cement concrete, reclaimed asphalt pavement (RAP), crushed post-consumer glass and/or crushed ceramic material, produced within specified gradation bands, 100% passing by mass through the 150 mm (6 inch) sieve. Granular B Type I does not require crushing. Granular B Type II is 100% crushed and hence may only be obtained from quarried rock, blast furnace slag, or nickel slag. Maximum size of Granular B Type II may be 150 106, or 75 mm. Granular B Type III is similar to Type I except it does not allow the use of uniform or poorly graded fine sands.

Edited June 18, 2017 by G.mech

[LeXXington]

I as well can't understand this 6" centre and 10" curb to help with drainage. Drainage is from below the slab, a slope stops pooling or going to the homes foundation wall but not much to stop ice from heaving below. Spalling maybe but not lifting.

 

ch312, what do you mean by A gravel and B gravel? We always referred to type of stone for ASTM strength, crusher run size and screened or not.

 

The 10" was to be at the side of the house.. 10" 6 inch above 4 inch below. It was to act as a curb and deflect the water to the side.

 

Right now its just 6" above with nothing below grade. Meeting the president of the company on Monday LOL

[Sterling]

I know quite a bit about contracts and this confuses me.

 

The company doing the work didn't get a copy of the contract? How can they do work without a copy of the contract? Seems they just came over and did work for free? How did they know to pour 6" or whatever went in?

[Old Ironmaker]

The 10" was to be at the side of the house.. 10" 6 inch above 4 inch below. It was to act as a curb and deflect the water to the side.

 

Right now its just 6" above with nothing below grade. Meeting the president of the company on Monday LOL

I'm sorry I still don't get what you are talking about.

 

CH312 and G. Mech we called that A and B mix "aggregate mix". The aggregate used primarily in the concrete for the Sky Dome was pelletized Blast Furnace Slag from Stelco E Blast Furnace supplied by National Slag. Cinder blocks back over 100 years were made with a mix of BF slag and concrete.cast from the "cinder notch". Thus the light weight and strength of a "cinder" block. If the Sky Dome cracks and heaves you can blame me.

[Mister G]

A wooden deck would have avoided all this Bull.........

 

Over time this patio is going to heave and crack with the way it was done or the way you wanted it done, PERIOD.

 

You got half a job for what you paid for.........negotiate this deal as PAID IN FULL with what you already paid them and enjoy the summer on your new patio.

[G.mech]

CH312 and G. Mech we called that A and B mix "aggregate mix".

 

 

Gran A & B are not used in concrete, they are a mixture of the specified granular sizes used for sub-grade bases. Normally, only screened and sized aggregates are used in concrete.

 

Sorry to the OP for minor hijacking.....

Edited June 19, 2017 by G.mech

[Old Ironmaker]

OK. I would never use any amount of Blast Furnace slag in a sub base for concrete or anything, Steelmaking slag yes, it has much more Iron in it, BF Slag should have zero Fe. Some out here will get loads from the plant for a driveway etc. and after a few years it's just sand you are traipsing into your vehicle and homes . It eventually will break down over time until it becomes sand which it basically is.

[chris.brock]

 

A small claim is only a drive to the courthouse and $75 away so don't sweat it.

[LeXXington]

Well the meeting with the president was interesting. The realize they can't fix the issue but have offered to put a solution in that will fix the issue and be better than the 10" curb.

 

I think they are costing out a fix now compared to the money I still owe them. They seem more interested in making it right than walking away but we will see.

[Musky Plug]

They're probably concerned about their rep at this point. Things like this can be a nightmare for some companies. It's good to hear they offered something in regards to dealing with the problem. I would get everything in writing and signed.