Nippissing Limits

[JimC]

As a long time, loyal supporter of Lake Nipissing Tourism, through my 30+ years of renting a cabin and boat n motor at an established, family oriented, Lodge ... I was shocked to see this knee-jerk reaction by the MNR, on this important and sensitive subject.

 

I would be ok with this latest quota reduction, IF the Stakeholders ideas of 'significant restocking efforts', and 'Cormorant culling' had also been embraced with equal enthusiasm, by the MNR and the Hon Michael Gravelle, MPP, Minister in charge; however, the (apparent) total lack of a response by the Minister to those who are acting as good Stewards of the lake makes me wonder if this is just incompetence, or also political, given the loss to (PC) Vic Fedeli, in the last Ont. election? Hopefully not (political), but it sure makes ya go 'hmmmmmmm ... '

 

I hate the idea of gill netting, spearing in spawning beds, and so on as practised legally (or not) by NFN; however, given the world we live in, I feel that this is the reality, and it is better to take the high road and partner with like minded members of NFN who truly do care about the future Lake Nipissing Walleye fishery, in such a way that the renegades, WHO IGNORE THE RULES AND QUOTAS, will be shunned in their own community, and the community at large, and diminish in numbers over time.

 

Of course there is no quick fix to declining Walleye stocks, but if we take the positive approach, write to the Hon. Minister (as hopeless as it may seem), letters to the editor, blogs, forums, whatever, hopefully, good things will eventually happen? or maybe I'm just being naive again? Lets Go Fishing!!

Edited December 16, 2012 by JimC

[Muskieman]

Happy to see that this thread has remained civilized and unlocked ...good on you all.

Hoping that Vic's letter will help ... But probably won't ... the decision made is an educated one ... based on studies and surveys , it's a preventative measure that is needed right now ...

More info to come ...

[Rockview]

Happy to see that this thread has remained civilized and unlocked ...good on you all.

Hoping that Vic's letter will help ... But probably won't ... the decision made is an educated one ... based on studies and surveys , it's a preventative measure that is needed right now ...

More info to come ...

 

 

Sorry Randy but that's the problem the decision they made was a political one made based on the perception that it would help not it's effectiveness. The MNR's studies and surveys don't support this management action but it is the easiest decision - financially and politically.

 

From http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/fisheries/management/myths.html “On any given day, 95 percent of walleye anglers harvest two or fewer walleyes. This generally holds true on every walleye lake in Minnesota and across the U.S.” I’m extrapolating this to Ontario but I suspect that it holds true – an informal survey of other resort owners in the area supports it. If this is even close to correct for Ontario/Lake Nipissing then a reduction from 4 to 2 Walleye on Lake Nipissing will make almost no difference. It’s clear that the MNR is making this change only for the sake of perception. The MNR has admitted in meetings with us that reducing the catch limit on Lake Nipissing would have NO effect on reducing the overall number of Walleye caught.

[bigugli]

THere are 5 courses of action, and all need some degree of implementation. The MNR simply chose the option with the least financial and political cost to the government.

[LNSA Join Us]

THere are 5 courses of action, and all need some degree of implementation. The MNR simply chose the option with the least financial and political cost to the government.

 

 

I have to agree with Rockview. The data presented by the MNR indicated no positive impact on the Walleye fishery by reducing the take limits. They did present ideas that their Biologist believed would have a positive impact but did not select them. Struggling to understand why. I am all for conservation, being a part of a sustainalble fishery but I think the MNR is so underfunded that the organization is broken. We believe that restocking, although not the an

swer on its own, will allow time for everyone to sit at the same table and work on a long term solution.

I would like my kids to be able to enjoy Nipissing as I have.

[Nipfisher]

I would like my kids to be able to enjoy Nipissing as I have.

 

 

Me too, but looks like they may be targeting pike, perch, bass, and musky.

 

 

This was a pretty good year for walleye on the lake but at this pace (without successful re-stocking) it won't last long. Alot of those 14-15.5" fish will be net size and without a healthy adult population there will be fewer small ones.

[moxie]

implementing slot size will be a failure. years back that was attempted on l.st clair.. from reading it seems overharvest from commercial uncontrolled industry.. why is it no goverment will take a true stand..

 

BINGO!!!. These measures are implemented when stocks are dwindling and unable to sustain themselves aren't they? As long as there are certain groups who are given special dispensation its only a band aid and only until political will (Pipe Dream) is demonstrated to make the necessary changes to benefit all involved is there a chance to remedy these issues. How about we lobby the government to raise licencing fees to, lets say, $??? Just another colossal Governmental failure. At least they're consistent.

[capt_hooked]

It's ALL the MNR's fault...!

 

Before the 1920s there were no yellow walleyes in Lake Nipissing....

 

Then the MNR had to go and release millions of walleye fry.. and there went the neighbourhood...!

 

 

And now look at the mess we have to deal with...! sheesh...!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[glen]

So you are telling me the gillnets are put out for a fish that was not even there before the 1920s. Why are people aloud to gillnet walleye then?

[Muskieman]

At one time Nip was in worse shape than it is now ..it would be nice to have a lake full of Blues though , like about 100 years ago . History is repeating itself. .

Edited December 16, 2012 by Randy from Sturgeon

[Roy]

its only a band aid

 

I find your choice of words ironic and perhaps even a little unfortunate.

 

Sorry, back to our regularly scheduled programming.

[LNSA Join Us]

Me too, but looks like they may be targeting pike, perch, bass, and musky.

 

 

This was a pretty good year for walleye on the lake but at this pace (without successful re-stocking) it won't last long. Alot of those 14-15.5" fish will be net size and without a healthy adult population there will be fewer small ones.

 

 

It was a great year for Walleye fishing apparently there are three strong year classes in the lake and what surprised everyone is the MNR announced that this years FWIN indicated another strong year class. When we asked where did these fish come from if the adult population is so low, the MNR answered, we have no idea.

If every year we ensure a strong year class, then sports fishing will be good.

[Nipfisher]

So you are telling me the gillnets are put out for a fish that was not even there before the 1920s. Why are people aloud to gillnet walleye then?

 

 

Glen, take this as you like but having talked with many native netters here on Nipissing, there choice fish to net is White Fish.

 

The recieve $x per walleye but $x per pound for White fish. So a 5 lbs. White fish pays the same as 4-5 walleye.

Now....the Whities are down 25-40 feet in this lake so they are difficult to net. The walleye cruising in 8-15 fow are much easier to target.

[Nipfisher]

LNSA, Rockview Cottages, Captain, and Randy I REALLY appreciate your comments and efforts.

[Billy Bob]

So you are telling me the gillnets are put out for a fish that was not even there before the 1920s. Why are people aloud to gillnet walleye then?

 

This is a very good point I never thought of...how can it be a native Canadian tradition if there were no walleyes in the prior to the 1920's.... ...if this is true.

[Muskieman]

There were Walleye in Nip they were the now Extinct Blue Walleye... She was fished out , worse shape than today, the Yellow Walleye is the specie selected to replace the depleted Blues .

[Billy Bob]

There were Walleye in Nip they were the now Extinct Blue Walleye... She was fished out , worse shape than today, the Yellow Walleye is the specie selected to replace the depleted Blues .

 

Those are two completely different fish but related.....Lake Erie also had what were referred to as "BLUE PIKE" in the Buffalo area...a smaller and tastier fish compared to the "YELLOW PIKE" or better known as our WALLEYE...and your Pickerel...So this is basically like comparing a northern pike to a chained pickerel...both kind of look alike...the chain pickerel rarely grows past 5 lbs...and again both are completely different fish but also related.

[Headhunter]

There were Walleye in Nip they were the now Extinct Blue Walleye... She was fished out , worse shape than today, the Yellow Walleye is the specie selected to replace the depleted Blues .

Exactly my point Randy. We seen this before and it happened for the same reasons. I fear that we will not have learned anything from the past and that greed will again, destroy the lake for an entire generation.

HH

[LNSA Join Us]

This is a very good point I never thought of...how can it be a native Canadian tradition if there were no walleyes in the prior to the 1920's.... ...if this is true.

 

 

Prior to 1920 the Blue Sauger was the most common fish in Lake Nipissing. Apparently it is a smaller member of the Walleye family. (Looks almost identical but is blue in colour).

If you want to understand why the Natives can commercial fish, you need to read cases from the Supreme Court of Canada, (Glandstone, Commanda and Sparrow are just three). The MNR's hands have been tied as far as I can tell.

Very difficult problem and hard to aurgue when people say that restocking is only a bandair solution. The depth of the political issues are beyond our small group and there is no point throughing up your hands and saying nothing will change, we intend to continue trying.

[spinnerbaitking]

Prior to 1920 the Blue Sauger was the most common fish in Lake Nipissing. Apparently it is a smaller member of the Walleye family. (Looks almost identical but is blue in colour).

If you want to understand why the Natives can commercial fish, you need to read cases from the Supreme Court of Canada, (Glandstone, Commanda and Sparrow are just three). The MNR's hands have been tied as far as I can tell.

Very difficult problem and hard to aurgue when people say that restocking is only a bandair solution. The depth of the political issues are beyond our small group and there is no point throughing up your hands and saying nothing will change, we intend to continue trying.

 

Seems fitting to put this here too.

I'm not an expert but the people making the decision likely aren't either, take a look at the Saugeen River, different fish & everything but the Stocking done by the Lake Huron Fishing Club & the Ontario Steelheaders have made that an amazing fisheries, so I would think if the stocking is done with the right size of Walleye & the habitat is there it shouldn't hurt & it surely could help, doing nothing definitely won't, people need to jump on board by joining these club to give them any & all the help they need, Numbers talk so lets make these groups bigger so the MNR have to listen to us, could be time to crap or get off the pot.

Just My .02 worth SBK

PS: Pay & you have a right to your say don't & nobody is going to listen to a small Group

[Bernie]

Concessions have been made over the past few years.

Reduction from 6 to 4. Didn't help.

Slot size introduced. Didn't help.

Restocking programs, still the numbers are less.

Now the limit reduced to 2. Think it will help?

 

It's time other options are presented. You all know what they are.

[sandybay]

Here is a question that I have heard a few times.

Can the MNR change the regulations without a sitting Parliament?

What I'm saying are the new limits valid?

Edited December 16, 2012 by sandybay

[Roy]

Here is a question that I have heard a few times.

Can the MNR change the regulations without a sitting Parliament?

 

I'm sure they can but they might not want to exercise that option if keeping their jobs is important to them.

[kickingfrog]

This article was discussed here almost 3 years ago, but didn't notice if someone else had brought up this aspect of the fishery.

 

http://www.nugget.ca/2010/02/05/somethings-fishy-on-nipissing-photo-gallery

 

 

Something's fishy on Nipissing

 

By DAVE DALE, The Nugget

Saturday, February 6, 2010 10:37:12 EST AM

 

Lake Nipissing walleye may have become hooked on a fat-rich diet of smelts, a theory that explains a disappearing act this past fall, as well as ice fishing complaints and a recent explosion in the perch population.

 

Richard Rowe, Nipissing First Nation biologist, told The Nugget Thursday that "lower-than-expected catches of all size classes of walleye" were found in the annual netting survey.

 

Rowe said the fall walleye index netting results conflict with harvest success - the commercial quota was reached early - and the upward trend of spawning fish documented over the past five years despite similar pressure.

 

"The 2009 FWIN results are puzzling," he said, explaining how the results from the past 12 years made sense when compared to harvest data and estimates for both natives and non-natives.

 

"This year is a bit of an anomaly," he said, suggesting it serves as a "wake-up" call for an expanded study.

 

"It's not uncommon to have the odd 'off year' in a long term data set. Having said that, we cannot take that chance . . . The 2009 results cannot be ignored by managers."

 

Rowe recommends a detailed study involving a partnership of stakeholders to test his "ecosystem change" theory, combined with an independent trap netting exercise in the spring to validate or add to the FWIN results.

 

He said the annual FWIN study documents other species at the same time, "showing perch numbers trending way up, with herring trending down."

 

Native harvesters, Rowe said, are reporting many more smelt in the lake and they are forming a significant part of the walleye diet.

 

"These trends in perch and herring, as well as what anglers are saying about walleye not biting, (combined with) a recent increase in walleye growth rate, are all consistent with an increase in smelt," he said.

 

"Walleye on a smelt diet could potentially change their activity patterns making them much less active, which could partially explain low FWIN catches as CONTINUED FROM A1

 

well," he said.

 

"There also appear to be changes at the zooplankton level of the food web, which, if confirmed, may be the mechanism for an increase in smelt, among other things," Rowe said.

 

"It's all circumstantial evidence, but it's really starting to pile up for some type of ecosystem change."

 

The Nugget's inquiry about the FWIN results came before Rowe finalized the results and held a data-sharing meeting with North Bay District Ministry of Natural Resources staff and other parties.

 

Rowe said he intends to discuss the issue with the Lake Nipissing Stewardship Council later this month.

 

Phil Hall, acting district supervisor, confirmed the MNR biologist involved with Lake Nipissing is on parental leave and a replacement hasn't been named.

 

Hall also said winter creel data is still being collected by staff during the week and a contract worker every weekend.

 

But Hall, speaking as a private citizen who fishes every winter with an ice hut off Deepwater Point along the south shore of Lake Nipissing, said his experience coincides with what many people are saying.

 

"We're not getting too many walleye and the perch are way, way up," he said, adding that everybody also says "the walleye fishing was great this summer."

 

Bill Richards of Billy Bob's Bait at Lakeshore and Pinewood Park drives said he thinks the lake is in "excellent shape" because walleye fishing is "great in the spring and great in the summer."

 

Those who fish successfully in winter, Richards said, are not sitting in their huts on Saturday and Sunday afternoons.

 

He said many of his customers who fish early in the morning and early evening are pulling up one to three walleye and about a dozen perch each time out.

 

If anything, Richards said, people are getting frustrated catching too many "slot-size" fish 40 to 60 centimetres long. Walleye this size are considered prime spawners and must be released back into the water.

 

His son called him from the lake recently via cellphone, Richards said, asking what to do with a 70-cm walleye.

 

When told to release it, he said his son refused, saying, "I just threw the last six back."

 

Carl D'Amour, a retired MNR conservation officer and part owner of Grump and Grumpy's ice fishing bungalows, said Rowe's smelt theory isn't far fetched.

 

D'Amour said smelts hang out in large schools suspended well above the floor of the lake.

 

Lake Nipissing ice fishermen commonly bounce their jigs off the bottom.

 

Josh Savoie, Ben Laplante and Patrick Corriveau were heading out to "Perch City" Thursday afternoon, a collection of ice huts east of the Manitou Islands.

 

Savoie said they've been catching tasty perch steadily for weeks, but only caught two walleye.

 

Laplante, however, caught an 11-pound ling, a species of freshwater cod that is making a comeback in Lake Nipissing.

 

Corriveau, a seasonal construction worker laid off for the winter, said he get as much fishing in as possible before he gets too busy in the summer.

 

"I enjoy the outdoors, even if I don't catch anything all day," he said, with Laplante saying they caught 80 perch the other day, including 35 keepers for a fish-fry that night.

 

"It was good eating."

 

[email protected]

[Bernie]

When I was a kid growing up through the 60's and 70's all the tourist camps were full of fishermen on the South Bay.

Nipissing lodge, Tom Rae Lodge, Promised Land Camps, Pipers camp, Rockview, plus the ones around the corner from me, Sunlit Bay, Bear Creek Cottages.

You often had difficulty navigating across the bays for boats. They caught fish.

Now, there is a bit of a rush opening weekend, but after that, it's nothing compared to what it once was.

There were fish huts back then too. Most were avid fishermen and the huts were in use most every weekend. Often with their wives and kids. Still, the fishing remained good.

Now, many of the ice huts remain unoccupied and if they are, it's an excuse for a party.

Yes there are still some serious fishermen as well in them.

 

I hated fishing when I was a kid, did it all the time as mom and dad loved it. They still do.

When I got the fishing bug again through the 1980's and 90's I never had any difficulty catching pickerel.

Had two or three favorite places to go and never had a problem.

 

Then it happened.

When the pickerel population was lowered in the French River, the nets started appearing up at this end of the lake.

Guess what.....

Ya, had to go further and fish longer to get a feed for the plate.

Now it's good if you happen to run across three or four. Many times skunked.

Edited December 16, 2012 by Bernie