The body of evidence just builds and builds for global warming

[danbo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUcVqG0AF50...&playnext=1

 

Polar shift of Earth's axis,etc..

[bigfish1965]

Are there seriously people that do not think the earth is getting warmer? I'm not talking about the cause, but people who seriously think it isn't happening?

 

BTW they could tell how old the ice was on the pole by the thickness and layers. Kinda like a trees rings. You could also carbon date any frozen life forms found inside.

[hammercarp]

I have done a little reading about this and the only thing I know for sure is that Canada produces about 2% of the total world CO2 emissions. So unless the U.S., Russia, China, and India do something our contribution either way is just a drop in bucket. I also believe that the world has been a lot colder than it is now and warmer as well.

Their is also this, that carbon is the basis of all life on this planet and the amount available to life on this planet has steadily been declining. I gets locked up in the earths crust in stuff like limestone, gas and oil and coal. And the real threat to all life on this planet is that fact. All though it will take a long time to do it.

[Guest gbfisher]

looks like Simcoe melting on a sunny day.....dam thing will never melt..

[danbo]

Luckily my Guardian Angel protects me from all harm.....

 

[Greencoachdog]

Whatever happened to the coming ice age that was forecasted in the 80's?

 

 

It'll be in Canada in a couple months Cliff...

[keram]

It'll be in Canada in a couple months Cliff...

 

 

Glen, you can drop in even earlier. We can manage the cold, but forget about bringing pickled eggs this time. You know( I hope), we are little bit picky about the pollution.

[cram]

the world has gone through cycles in the past, but none of them were because of us. Many of these rapid cycles also culminated in major extinctions and ecological change.....so those of us saying "its okay because its a natural cycle" need to think about what "okay" means.

[timmeh]

It is true that the world has seen natural shifts in temperature from cold to warm periods and vica versa - just look at the ice ages that have occurred in recent history. The real problem here is not that the earth is warming. The real problem here is how quickly it is occurring. Perhaps the real issue to think about is that even if every nation on earth agreed today that something needs to be done how long would it take to reverse the problems we've created?

 

The earth has "recovered" from climate shifts in the past likely because they were the result of slow, constant process - not the rapid changes we are seeing today (ie. it took thousands of years for the ice caps to melt from north america and europe 10 000 years ago, yet the arctic ice caps have have shrunken so quickly in the last 50 years).

 

However some politicians around the world actually view the loss of arctic ice as a good thing. It will open the nothern passage way for ships, limiting shipping costs. Again money talks.

[danbo]

Yep Dinosaurs went extinct too!!

[holdfast]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUcVqG0AF50...&playnext=1

 

Polar shift of Earth's axis,etc..

 

 

I like Davis Wilcock, his song Laying pipe and the Grind are excellent.

 

But seriously folks this GREEN SHAFT oops I mean shift will fade once the economy goes down again. All you Green Shifters (Shafters) come out of the woodwork when the Economy is doing great and then it peters out when there is less spending. As far as loosing some ice up North, great for our economy as it may open up another sea port or two lets say, Churchill. Anyways we got too many Polar Bears theyre starting to become a nuisance. If your so worried, stop driving its simple. But tell that to the USA, China, Russia, India and every other stinking industrial country out there. OH by the way, it wont be long and the Magnetic North will be in Russia.

[cram]

I like Davis Wilcock, his song Laying pipe and the Grind are excellent.

 

But seriously folks this GREEN SHAFT oops I mean shift will fade once the economy goes down again. All you Green Shifters (Shafters) come out of the woodwork when the Economy is doing great and then it peters out when there is less spending. As far as loosing some ice up North, great for our economy as it may open up another sea port or two lets say, Churchill. Anyways we got too many Polar Bears theyre starting to become a nuisance. If your so worried, stop driving its simple. But tell that to the USA, China, Russia, India and every other stinking industrial country out there. OH by the way, it wont be long and the Magnetic North will be in Russia.

 

hilarious

[Greencoachdog]

I have done a little reading about this and the only thing I know for sure is that Canada produces about 2% of the total world CO2 emissions. So unless the U.S., Russia, China, and India do something our contribution either way is just a drop in bucket. I also believe that the world has been a lot colder than it is now and warmer as well.

Their is also this, that carbon is the basis of all life on this planet and the amount available to life on this planet has steadily been declining. I gets locked up in the earths crust in stuff like limestone, gas and oil and coal. And the real threat to all life on this planet is that fact. All though it will take a long time to do it.

 

 

holdfast Posted Today, 05:23 PM

 

But seriously folks this GREEN SHAFT oops I mean shift will fade once the economy goes down again. All you Green Shifters (Shafters) come out of the woodwork when the Economy is doing great and then it peters out when there is less spending. As far as loosing some ice up North, great for our economy as it may open up another sea port or two lets say, Churchill. Anyways we got too many Polar Bears theyre starting to become a nuisance. If your so worried, stop driving its simple. But tell that to the USA, China, Russia, India and every other stinking industrial country out there. OH by the way, it wont be long and the Magnetic North will be in Russia.

 

 

I'm doing what I can on the US side... I've cut my breathing down to half, and only eat butterbeans and okra 3 times a week instead of 5!!!

[hammercarp]

I'm doing what I can on the US side... I've cut my breathing down to half, and only eat butterbeans and okra 3 times a week instead of 5!!!

May I suggest cutting down the polital stuff down to 3 or 4 months every four years. Over the past year and a half enough gas has been liberated to leave a carbon footprint the size of Texas.

Edited September 4, 2008 by hammercarp

[Lowe Rider]

I think George Carlin said it best.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eScDfYzMEEw

[scuro]

Simply I wanted only to bring to your attention to a climatic event that hasn't happened in over 125,000 years...perhaps longer. That was it, and I asked for no comment. But if we are discussing this then let me add my two cents worth.

 

It is noteworthy if an event happens once in a lifetime. For instance the most powerful natural explosion in recent Earth history happened a hundred years when a meteor exploded above Tunguska Russia. The resulting explosion was estimated to be 1,000 times greater than the atomic bomb dropped over Hiroshima. Scientists estimate that such a meteor will strike the earth every 100 years. Now magnify that time frame by 1250 percent out to 125,000 years. What would be the biggest meteor to strike the earth in that time frame? I'm guessing it would be a much more noteworthy and spectacular event. So the north pole is an ice island for the first time 125,000. Can this be explained by other possibilities?...sure but there probably is a reason this happened. Now how about if all the ice melts over the north pole? That hasn't happened in 50 million years. Can that be explained away. Well, it would get more difficult and for sure there has got to be a reason. How about if we have other climatic measurements which are just as noteworthy? Now you have a real problem explaining them away with climatic variables. There really has to be a catalyst for that. How do they build the case for global warming? They take these unique events such as the north pole being an ice island for the first time in 125,000 years, and they show there is significant change happening. They have done that and the theory which best fits all the change happening around us is global warming.

 

 

Can you believe I actually did a science project on the coming ice age? I advanced to the regionals with that beaut. How did they make their case for that theory? That theory was based on patterns. The earth goes through natural warming and cooling phases. We are long overdue for a major cool phase. The pattern told us an ice age was imminent. Yet, there was no unique and significant climatic events to support this theory. See the difference?

Edited September 3, 2008 by scuro

[StoneFly]

I think the more alarming concept is 'Climate change' and associted poor air quality vs. Global warming. Around 15 years ago when I was studying topics like this in University, it was generally only accepted on a 'Fringe' Scientific basis. Now, worldwide it is accepted as fact. Even the Auto manufacturers and big oil have condeded and they are the main reasons it wasnt politically accepted in the past. Nearly similar to how big tobbaco finally admitted that smoking causes cancer etc.

 

Much more evidence exists for climate change occuring at a rate up to 1000 times faster than nature dictates. We do have long term global warming and cooling and change due to natural cycles, this is well documented. The rate and unpredictability of current change is what is cause for alarm and anyone who has lived 20, 30 or 40 years or longer shold be able to attest to this even in Ontario. It is well documented and proven a direct link to what humans have done in the past 100 years or so, to dramatically affect these changes. Just my opinion, although it is also widely accepted fact.

 

Perhaps one good thing to come out of artificially rising oil prices has spawned renewed big interest in alternative energy, options that have been around awhile. Sadly the biggest barriers to implementation was change in infrastrcutre, big oil and politics in bed, as well as consumer intollerance to change and higher everday costs atleast in the shortterm. The price of oil is now 3x what it was 5-6 years ago so now alternatives especially to oil are much more cost feasible.

 

Alternative, sustainable energy such as wind, solar, geothermal, bio fuel and biogas from waste products etc. etc. will over the next 10-20 years become a major source of energy on our planet, it has already started and is accelerating rapidly. Whatever you want to call it, climate channge or global warming, the human induced factors through emissions alone of which there is no denying also are a very major contributor to negative health effects on all animals including humans.

 

What everone can do is keep issues like this in mind when it comes to voting and your choice in purchases.

 

Just my $0.02

Edited September 3, 2008 by StoneFly

[hammercarp]

I think the more alarming concept is 'Climate change' and associted poor air quality vs. Global warming. Around 15 years ago when I was studying topics like this in University, it was generally only accepted on a 'Fringe' Scientific basis. Now, worldwide it is accepted as fact. Even the Auto manufacturers and big oil have condeded and they are the main reasons it wasnt politically accepted in the past. Nearly similar to how big tobbaco finally admitted that smoking causes cancer etc.

 

Much more evidence exists for climate change occuring at a rate up to 1000 times faster than nature dictates. We do have long term global warming and cooling and change due to natural cycles, this is well documented. The rate and unpredictability of current change is what is cause for alarm and anyone who has lived 20, 30 or 40 years or longer shold be able to attest to this even in Ontario. It is well documented and proven a direct link to what humans have done in the past 100 years or so, to dramatically affect these changes. Just my opinion, although it is also widely accepted fact.

 

Perhaps one good thing to come out of artificially rising oil prices has spawned renewed big interest in alternative energy, options that have been around awhile. Sadly the biggest barriers to implementation was change in infrastrcutre, big oil and politics in bed, as well as consumer intollerance to change and higher everday costs atleast in the shortterm. The price of oil is now 3x what it was 5-6 years ago so now alternatives especially to oil are much more cost feasible.

 

Alternative, sustainable energy such as wind, solar, geothermal, bio fuel and biogas from waste products etc. etc. will over the next 10-20 years become a major source of energy on our planet, it has already started and is accelerating rapidly. Whatever you want to call it, climate channge or global warming, the human induced factors through emissions alone of which there is no denying also are a very major contributor to negative health effects on all animals including humans.

What everone can do is keep issues like this in mind when it comes to voting and your choice in purchases.

 

Just my $0.02

 

A couple of questions if you don't mind. You have stated that climate change if induced by "natural causes" takes place over long periods. How do you explain the brief warm period that allowed the Vikings to settle and farm the coast of Greenland for the breif period of a hundred years or so? Also the brief mini ice age that occurred a few hundred years ago? These are documented facts as they occured during our period of written history.

Secondly if we are suffering negative health effects, how is it that our lifespans have increased over the last hundred years?

Don't get me wrong I know the climate is changing. It's that blanket statements like yours do beg for some questions.

[John Bacon]

Are there seriously people that do not think the earth is getting warmer? I'm not talking about the cause, but people who seriously think it isn't happening?

 

Yes, but the earth had been cooling between 1944 to 1977. I remember seeing movies in school about how polution was reflecting the sun light back into space and causing a new ice age.

 

I understand that the earth's temperature has been stable since 1999 and are expected to remain so for the next 15 years. This could be a blip in a long term increase; or, maybe the end of a short term increase.

[cram]

A couple of questions if you don't mind. You have stated that climate change if induced by "natural causes" takes place over long periods. How do you explain the brief warm period that allowed the Vikings to settle and farm the coast of Greenland for the breif period of a hundred years or so? Also the brief mini ice age that occurred a few hundred years ago? These are documented facts as they occured during our period of written history.

Secondly if we are suffering negative health effects, how is it that our lifespans have increased over the last hundred years?

Don't get me wrong I know the climate is changing. It's that blanket statements like yours do beg for some questions.

 

I can't explain his comments for him, but i think the warm period you're referring to lasted hundreds of years (400?). It was also considered an anomaly, as was the ice age. I'm not sure if anyone knows why they happened....lots of theories about differences in solar energy (sun spots?), volcanoes (ash in the atmosphere blocking the sun), ocean currents, etc.

 

Natural cycles do happen. And, if you're an alien biologist studying earth (or a future non-human historian) I guess you could call this (as in right now) natural as well.

 

Something i found interesting (and is kind of good news for us) -- national geographic did a neat program (think its on their website as well) called 6 degrees or something like that. Described theories on what happens to the world with every 1 degree of increased temperature. The good part....according to them Canada is basically the best place to be as temperatures warm a little (longer growing season, etc, and the last safe place on hte planet if/when temperatures get really extreme.

[oncogene]

Secondly if we are suffering negative health effects, how is it that our lifespans have increased over the last hundred years?

Don't get me wrong I know the climate is changing. It's that blanket statements like yours do beg for some questions.

 

Medicine, vaccine? health care, doctors, hospitals, all the gazillion dollars that goes into health science & medical research?

[Rich]

We're overdue for an ice age.. global warming may be the only thing saving our

[cram]

We're overdue for an ice age.. global warming may be the only thing saving our

t

Warming (at extreme levels) could oddly cause an ice age. Its weird, weird stuff....and very tough to forecast.

[Rizzo]

so what will come first, the influenza pandemic I keep hearing about that we are "due" for or the new ice age we are "due" for

[danbo]

Let's see....hmmmmm..Now if we don't destroy ourselves with Mutually Assured Destruction via Nuclear War, there's still the possibility of a Meteor strike, or a mass flood from polar icecap melting from a shift of the planet's axis..

Then there's the sub-Atlantic earthquake or the Alien Invasion..or the planet Nibiru that passes too close..or the Sun flare that cooks the Earth or..

Edited September 4, 2008 by danbo