Ontario to spend $7-billion on sweeping climate change plan

[lifeisfun]

So it's okay to do nothing and let 6-9 million people per year die, because it will be 44 years from now, and because you hate Wynne?

 

It's a good thing you don't run the government, it seems you're under the mistaken impression that this is an either/or scenario. There is enough money for all our needs if it is properly managed (which it currently is not).

 

Also, I find it interesting that you think we will be able to afford reduced wait times with millions more people needing treatment because we did nothing about air pollution. Can you explain the math on that one?

Give your head a shake,

it is sad that people like you are actually running the government now. If you are in debt like this

http://www.debtclock.ca/provincial-debtclocks/ontario/ontario-s-debt/

you can't afford to buy latest Tesla model car and SUHD TV because they are not reasonably priced yet. If you think that that would be leader ship, and great example for your kids that's just crazy.

You have take care of priorities first, buy reasonably priced, proven, and reliable, if you need to buy immediately at all.

Here is what the billions spent on new technology got you so far:

http://www.ieso.ca/

And today is sunny and windy so this is the max you'll get out of it right now.

 

The estimated numbers you quote over and over (and conveniently omitting that this is world wide estimate over the next 44 years) can't be influenced by throwing money on the problem here in Ontario. In mean time people all over the world are dying from hunger, poverty, and disease. Every 15 seconds a child dies of hunger. Now count those kids over 44 years. This is actually something that can be influenced by Canadians.

 

BTW indoor pollution is just as big if not bigger problem then outdoor, especially here in Canada.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Lifeisfun

[dave524]

There is nothing wrong with this line of thinking if, as has been said above, you acknowledge that you are only thinking of yourself (a common trait in humans).

 

If you have children, or care at all about the future of the species' on this planet, then you cannot argue for the status quo.

 

My kids and grandkids have had it far too easy compared to my youth, they could use some adversity in their lives , might get them off the social media.

[Canuck]

So it's okay to do nothing and let 6-9 million people per year die, because it will be 44 years from now, and because you hate Wynne?

 

It's a good thing you don't run the government, it seems you're under the mistaken impression that this is an either/or scenario. There is enough money for all our needs if it is properly managed (which it currently is not).

 

Also, I find it interesting that you think we will be able to afford reduced wait times with millions more people needing treatment because we did nothing about air pollution. Can you explain the math on that one?

Obviously can't sway your view. You have drunk the Koolaid and are happy with government incompetence wasting your money. Or maybe you think it's the "governments" money.

 

I am all for clean air and adopting rules and technology to ride the environment. But he money has to be spent and not wasted. And we should adopt technology when it is cost effective and ready. Not be early adopters at an enormous cost. Spend some money to truly incentivize Canadian companies and universities to develop clean tech that is economical and then when it's ready roll it out with programs.

 

For the rest of you reading this. Rise up. Spread the message. The liberals are going to cost Ontario untold misery. We cannot compete for capital investment and jobs if we have the highest energy costs in the world. We will become even more of a have not province than we are.

[scuro2]

You have drunk the Koolaid...

 

.

 

 

Speaking of having drunk the Koolaid there are incredible number climate change is a hoax believers on this thread, just saying!!

Edited June 10, 2016 by scuro2

[Dutch01]

Obviously can't sway your view. You have drunk the Koolaid and are happy with government incompetence wasting your money. Or maybe you think it's the "governments" money.

"Obviously", you can't read. I have repeatedly called Wynne corrupt and incompetent. I have made one argument only on this thread - we need less air pollution.

 

It's clear from the vitriol in here that many here actually support air pollutIon. Why else would you all have such a blind and dogged determination to ignore all reasonable arguments to the contrary?

Edited June 10, 2016 by Dutch01

[scuro2]

 

 

 

YES!!!!

The planet is badly over populated as it is.

20 or 30 million a year would probably help better though.

A large reduction in the population will do much more than a few billion dollars to reduce global warming, green house gasses and pollution. Not to mention the strain on the oceans fish stocks.

 

Eugenics is the answer!!! Why mix the good seed with bad seed? Why burden the productive members of our society with the poor?

 

....er wait we tried that already here in Canada...and they say it went horribly wrong in Germany.

[Dutch01]

Give your head a shake,

it is sad that people like you...

People like me? Stopped reading right there. Buh bye.

[dave524]

 

 

Speaking of having drunk the Koolaid there are incredible number climate change is a hoax believers on this thread, just saying!!

 

Climate change is not a hoax, we have in fact be getting warmer for several hundred years, long before any CO2 emissions from human activity could add to the trend, there is data out there that suggests that over the last few millennia that climate change and CO2 levels don't even track together.. Lots of other factors can contribute to warming .

[Dutch01]

 

Climate change is not a hoax, we have in fact be getting warmer for several hundred years, long before any CO2 emissions from human activity could add to the trend, there is data out there that suggests that over the last few millennia that climate change and CO2 levels don't even track together.. Lots of other factors can contribute to warming .

Dave, I don't disagree with you. I believe climate change is real, but I am not certain it is caused by man. I'm also not certain it isn't.

 

Let me ask you a separate question. Do you believe air pollution is real, or a hoax? If your answer is that it's real, do you propose we do A-nothing, or B-something?

Edited June 10, 2016 by Dutch01

[rufus]

Wynne's "do something" unfortunately is to offer up the people of Ontario for sacrificial immolation much like a mother putting her family on a starvation diet hoping it helps solve the obesity problem in western societies.

 

 

Do you believe air pollution is real, or a hoax? If your answer is that it's real, do you propose we do A-nothing, or B-something?

[Dara]

"Obviously", you can't read. I have repeatedly called Wynne corrupt and incompetent. I have made one argument only on this thread - we need less air pollution.

 

It's clear from the vitriol in here that many here actually support air pollutIon. Why else would you all have such a blind and dogged determination to ignore all reasonable arguments to the contrary?

Dutch, you keep saying that people on here don't believe climate change is real but I haven't seen anybody say that.

They just say that your government is taking the wrong approach to the problem

 

Your Love for Kathleen and the Liberal government is clouding your judgment.

You are acting like the little boy in the playground hitting the girl because he likes her.

You call Wynne incompetent and then back everything she does

[Dutch01]

Dutch, you keep saying that people on here don't believe climate change is real but I haven't seen anybody say that.

They just say that your government is taking the wrong approach to the problem

 

Your Love for Kathleen and the Liberal government is clouding your judgment.

You are acting like the little boy in the playground hitting the girl because he likes her.

You call Wynne incompetent and then back everything she does

Dara, I've tried to be respectful up to now but you are out of line.

 

Show me one quote ever by me supporting anything by or about Wynne. You can't do that. I guarantee it.

 

The fact that you keep taking about "my love for Wynne" tells me you haven't read anything I've posted. That is truly disrespectful.

[Dara]

Dara, I've tried to be respectful up to now but you are out of line.

 

Show me one quote ever by me supporting anything by or about Wynne. You can't do that. I guarantee it.

 

The fact that you keep taking about "my love for Wynne" tells me you haven't read anything I've posted. That is truly disrespectful.

Pulling your chain Dutch

 

But you do back her plans and we really can't afford it right now

[Dutch01]

Pulling your chain Dutch

 

But you do back her plans and we really can't afford it right now

I don't back her plans at all.

 

I simply asked if you believe we should do something or nothing.

 

That's an important question to me. It's easy, there are only two choices, something or nothing.

 

Yet most bypass the question and just go on the attack.

[Dutch01]

Wynne's "do something" unfortunately is to offer up the people of Ontario for sacrificial immolation much like a mother putting her family on a starvation diet hoping it helps solve the obesity problem in western societies.

 

 

I re-read my question and didn't see anything about Wynne in it. I suggest you re-read it. It was not about Wynne or global warming or even climate change. It was about air pollution.

 

The options were do something or do nothing.

[Headhunter]

Does anyone else find it ironic that this same government that insisted on building gas plants across the province has now decided, a scant 5-6 years later that gas plants are bad? The amount of wasted money is mind boggling.

Dutch, if it means anything to you, I have not ever seen you, in any post, praise Wynne or her government. That is one thing that I am pretty sure about you.

HH

[rufus]

I re-read my question and didn't see anything about Wynne in it. I suggest you re-read it. It was not about Wynne or global warming or even climate change. It was about air pollution.

 

The options were do something or do nothing.

I suggest you re-read my response as it said nothing about global warming or climate change. It applies to air pollution - and Wynne's "blogger mommy" solution.

 

It is not an A or B choice as you suggest.

Edited June 10, 2016 by NWO Fishing

[dave524]

Let me ask you a separate question. Do you believe air pollution is real, or a hoax? If your answer is that it's real, do you propose we do A-nothing, or B-something?

 

Of course I believe in air pollution, I lived in the Hammer from 77 to 84 and worked in the steel industry there for over 30 years. I've seen the yellow haze over the city when cresting the mountain on Centennial Parkway 35 years ago, its gone now. We haven't been " doing nothing "since those days, the situation in my lifetime is dramatically improved, I agree with doing something, what I do disagree with is going overboard " cutting off your nose to spite your face " policies. I have COPD and my wife has emphysema, believe me, air quality is an issue for us, but also is the financial ability to heat our house in winter and air conditioning is mandatory for us in summer. Financially crippling policies , based on questionable science, when we are a minor player, possibly carbon neutral, when looking at the rest of the world's nations track record, gets me going .

 

edit: The last 30/40 years haven't been a do nothing period as you seem to suggest.

Edited June 10, 2016 by dave524

[KLINKER]

If a lawn mower pollutes more than a car but is = to about 1 to 1.5 K miles a year on a car. A subsidy of $14,000 at 12.5% of cost would get you 272 electric lawn mowers taking about the = of 418K car miles of the road each year at the = of subsidizing one electric car.Ms. Wynne should be subsidizing lawn mowers not cars.

[Dara]

I don't back her plans at all.

 

I simply asked if you believe we should do something or nothing.

 

That's an important question to me. It's easy, there are only two choices, something or nothing.

 

Yet most bypass the question and just go on the attack.

Everybody says we should do something, and we have done something.

We have eliminated coal fired plants and built gas plants to replace them

We have also built solar and wind plants to replace them. At great cost but I can accept that we need to develop the technology.

I think we are at the point that the wind turbines we have are enough to study and develop. They are not yet at a point where it makes economic sense to continue building inefficient wind turbines. Do you have any idea of the cost to change the oil in the transmissions of these turbines. And what is done with the used oil. We have 200 ton cranes on almost constant rental to the wind farm for maintenance..

 

You say do something or nothing. Please give us your idea of something

[Dara]

If a lawn mower pollutes more than a car but is = to about 1 to 1.5 K miles a year on a car. A subsidy of $14,000 at 12.5% of cost would get you 272 electric lawn mowers taking about the = of 418K car miles of the road each year at the = of subsidizing one electric car.Ms. Wynne should be subsidizing lawn mowers not cars.

Please don't confuse her with facts

[Dutch01]

I suggest you re-read my response as it said nothing about global warming or climate change. It applies to air pollution - and Wynne's "blogger mommy" solution.

 

It is not an A or B choice as you suggest.

I asked an A or B question, you declined to answer it. Let's not pretend anything else happened here.

[outllaw]

so ok were all good we make clean air. but were sucking air from every other country that's polluted. gee whiz makes sense to me..i think I will go down to the lake get a drink to subside my headache,. after all we have an endless drug supply in our waters also.

[rufus]

You offered a false choice. Black / white thinking. I responded appropriately. Let's not pretend otherwise.

I asked an A or B question, you declined to answer it. Let's not pretend anything else happened here.

[Dara]

I asked an A or B question, you declined to answer it. Let's not pretend anything else happened here.

I answered with "do something" which I'm sure you agree with.

I also expanded the question to ask what your idea of "something" is