wormdunker Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Questions for Saltydawg & others What should the strapping spacing be? Can you walk on the steel roof without damaging it? Should the old shingles be removed? Might be a silly question - but is it absolutely necessary? What guage metal do you advise? Very good info here. Thanx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 I'm not trying to get into any fights with anyone......sheet metal, here's what I know. The growing trend in sheet metal is 29guage high tensile metal. It costs less and covers more(wider sheet). I personally refuse to use it and continue to use the tried and tested 28guage. I used 29guage on a buddies small lean too off his garage. It is very brittle/ shatter prone IMO . You can not walk on the ribs or they will crack, when you cut it, it is messy as far as paint chipping and burning. All of this caused from being high tensile. I asked about trees because if you had a lot near the roof I would be concerned if a branch came down on the roof. Again it's a concern with 29 gauge IMO, with 28 regular steel no concern it just seems that much more forgiving as far as it will take more abuse. Mennonite steel....... Here's what has evolved in this area.....they bought a roll former from one of the major steel sheet suppliers, fixed it up and got it ready for use. THEN they needed rolls of steel to put through their roller so they started buying the REJECTED coils from the major supplier. Both were happy, Mennonites took the rejected coils at a discounted price, and the supplier had a outlet for rejected coils. These coils could be rejected for several reasons....bad primer, pin holing, bad paint bond are the most common. Well if you buy cheaper steel, have your own roll former, and lotsa kids to help you can sell steel at a discounted price obviously. Well for this reason Mennonite steel caught on with non educated or bottom line consumer, business was booming. Then the issues started showing up, but there was no warranty. They effected the market largely, causing the major steel companies to start lowering there prices to get more competeive. Both parties had a pow wow and major suppliers said were not selling you steel any more at a discounted price here's what it's gonna cost you now. This caused the Mennonites to start sourcing to the u.s. And caused the prices to be much more in line with the majors. They had another pow wow and decided that they would all raise there prices 15% over the original long standing price. Blaa blatant blaa to be honest I'm not sure what the story is now on what the Mennonites are up too besides they sold the company around here to a regular joe. So I guess that's what I am heeding caution towards in my experience, I would recommend a 28 gauge high rib steel ( which costs about 10% more than 29 ) and something with literature on the paint warranty. The product that I use and who will deliver anywhere in ontario or further has a 25 year paint warranty. Their application sounds correct as far as strapping with 1x4 on 24" max o.c., if noise is a concern you can apply sheets of foil faced board like energy board on top of strapping then screw the metal through it to strapping. Make sure strapping is nailed to the rafters and not just the plywood. Blaa blaa blaa. Anymore questions just ask... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Questions for Saltydawg & others What should the strapping spacing be? Can you walk on the steel roof without damaging it? Should the old shingles be removed? Might be a silly question - but is it absolutely necessary? What guage metal do you advise? Very good info here. Thanx You need some air flow and a flat surface to screw the metal to, leaving the old shingles on is pretty standard, considering there is not 3 layers on there already, raising a weight concern. Each metal has a recommended strapping spacing, in general 24" max. I like 28 gauge but some consider this "old school" mainly because it costs more but that's because it's better metal IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 And once a best price is arrived at, ask for an out building to be thrown in as well. Like a boathouse or shed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leaf4 Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 I work in sheet metal and prior to you posting 28/29 ga. I was assuming 26 would be the metal used, I do agree with you that 29 ga is garbage, some suppliers make 30 gauge pipe and it's like tin foil, good info here for myself in the future though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Cliff, you may want to reconsider putting snow jack on the entire roof, yes it stops the snow from sliding, thuss it makes the snow stay on your roof, thus not letting your roof clear can add a lot of weight, given your location. Sometimes i think over the doorways and where you park your car car is sufficient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted April 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Super information, thank you so much! Just got off the phone, 40 year paint warranty in writing from the manufacturer however it is only 29 gauge. I did ask about 28 gauge and he said he has been using this for about 12 years now without any issues. He did say he could get and use 28 gauge but it is more expensive and he didn't think it was necessary but would quote us on that if we wanted. I will ask for a quote on the 28 gauge. Again, thank you so much for helping to educate me on what is good and why and what questions to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted April 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Cliff, you may want to reconsider putting snow jack on the entire roof, yes it stops the snow from sliding, thuss it makes the snow stay on your roof, thus not letting your roof clear can add a lot of weight, given your location. Sometimes i think over the doorways and where you park your car car is sufficient. I have to tell you, I really appreciate your help and advice on this, wish you were closer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 No problem, I have not heard of a 40 year warranty i would read the fine print there for sure. If interested I use VicWest metal, genarally in the supervic profife for roofs. Vicwest is probablly the largest company in canada when it comes to sheet type metal. See how there paint warranty wording compares to this products out of curousity, Im positive your installer will be aware of the VW products also. They have been around for a loooongtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 (edited) Also Cliff since you have some valleys, I would ask about a "W" valley versus the normal "V" valley. It helps slow the water from washing through the valley and up under the opposing metal. Metal roofs are trickier to seal for alot of reasons..some previously mentioned. In general ask "How do you seal the valleys? In general a tar impregnated foam tape is used vs caulking and the like. Edited April 26, 2014 by mcdougy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted April 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Will do! Should have posted on this sooner so I could have had a whole list of questions to ask. Anyone else thinking of going steel roof, here is a good place to get started! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 (edited) Theres never a dumb question only dumb answers.... Any self respecting contractor will spend the time to answer all concerns....especially if hes getting paid by the hour!!!! Edited April 26, 2014 by mcdougy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 tone z71 Posted April 26, 2014 Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 Will do! Should have posted on this sooner so I could have had a whole list of questions to ask. Anyone else thinking of going steel roof, here is a good place to get started! steels sitting in the driveway ..strapping's in the garage ..waiting on a few half decent not so windy days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted April 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2014 steels sitting in the driveway ..strapping's in the garage ..waiting on a few half decent not so windy days 28 gauge I hope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormdunker Posted April 28, 2014 Report Share Posted April 28, 2014 Thanx Cliff for starting the post. Lottsa good info from the pros. Not only am I a fisherman, now I'm educated two!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted April 29, 2014 Report Share Posted April 29, 2014 I'm in Hamilton and will be buying a new roof and shingles/or whatever. I have saved up the money. Anyone have a reputable rec here in Hamilton? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowanjo Posted May 4, 2014 Report Share Posted May 4, 2014 Interested in the outcome Cliff how did it all go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted May 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2014 Well, after considering all the information I received here and talking to Jason @ Elite roofing and several of his customers we decided to go with him on the 29 gauge. I would have prefered the 28 gauge because of what was recommended here but it was going to be about $800.00 more. I realize that there is a concern if someone was to walk on our roof and step on ribs or if there were large branches that could land on it but there is no reason for anyone to be up on our roof and no large trees nearby. I also talked to several people reguarding the product that he was using and not one of them had anything negitive to say about the quality of the product and I couldn't find anyone that had ever had a warrenty claim (hope I'm not going to be the first LOL). Jason was very well organized and very professional, he and his crew showed up and went to work, they had a bit of a delay because of high winds and rain but as of Friday night they had it all done. I was really pleased with the time they took installing trim and drip guards etc.. They really seemed to care about what they were doing. The other thing that impressed me was that everyone else I talked to wanted money up front, Jason didn't want a cent until all the work was compleated to my satisfaction. I asked him why and he told me he had never had any problems getting paid for a job because he always made sure that the customer knew what they were getting and he made sure things were done properly. The most important thing is that Sue is happy, I have a new roof that should last for a very long time, and I got it for a very reasonable price compared to other quotes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lew Posted May 4, 2014 Report Share Posted May 4, 2014 Jason didn't want a cent until all the work was compleated to my satisfaction. Good to hear everything worked out for you Cliff and it sounds like you found a great guy to do the work. One thing I've noticed alot since moving to the country is the different attitude of the contractors compared to the ones in the city. I had a skylight installed 3 weeks ago and they didn't want any type of down payment either and other than a call from the boss on completion of the job to be sure I was completely satisfied, I've never even received a bill from them yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted May 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2014 Funny how that works isn't it Lew; I always worry when a guy doesn't want to give me a written quote (got burned on that once) or wants 50% (or more) up front. Word of mouth is so important to any business especially in an area like this! Glad to hear your job worked out too! If I ever need a skylight installed, I know who to call! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ketchenany Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 Cliff, this gentleman has a good business plan, keep your clients happy and they will come back and refer more. I have a cousin who does Reno work and new projects, he built his business on references, hard to do, but honesty is the best way to go. met an honest small engine repair person just like you on the weekend good advice and the price was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdougy Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 I'm glad it all worked out for you Cliff. Being the fifth generation licensed carpenter in our family business I can attest to clients surprise when they find out no money "up front" is required. Workmanship and professionalism speak for themselves. TRUST is what I appreciate most, I'm doing work on someone's home and understand it is their investment of finance and pleasure. They do not want someone messing with that. The gratifying part is when the job is done, how happy and most often life changing you have just made your new friend. Just like I'm hearing you speak of your contractor. There are many of us that DO know what we are doing and saying. Our business is purely referral work as well, we are not in the phone book/ internet at all. It makes it nice when you can also ask someone about a potentional customer via referral. Working for strangers is a bit nerve racking for my financial interests also, so it's nice when we all know someone in common. But if we all trust each other and stand by our words, it has always worked out. We have never been burned thankfully, nor had a dissatisfied client. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted May 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 And that my friend is what it is all about! Again, I want to thank you so much for taking the time to help me make an informed decision! When I had my business going I always said that I never wanted to be embarrised in meeting one of my customers out in public or at a party. I am not going to say that I was perfect but I always tried my best! Perhaps that was the secret to our success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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