leaf4 Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 Can't forget a lot of these guys are signed long term, they still gotta lock up a couple, Estrada, maybe price and I think revere I could be mistaken but the core is pretty well in tact for the next 4 or so years
lookinforwalleye Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 I think one thing you can count on is this...if the Jays struggle and are out of contention there will be major personnel changes!!!
FrankTheRabbit Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) That's such a TYPICAL Rogers boondongle. It started in the beginning with Ed Rogers bumbling around with his sights trying to fire Beeston. What an idiot...has no clue about baseball and baseball etiquette and has no respect with Beeston and his contribution to the team. Leadership starts from top down and when you have an owner as much of a goofball as Ed Rogers, it spells trouble. You have to be a real dummy to go from one of the best seasons in Jays history and literally start from zero. The players have huge respect for Alex and now that he's gone, how will you think the players will react? The stability is just not there anymore and say goodbye to Price, Estrada and any other high profile player that would come to Toronto. Alex has built a good reputation within the league and is pretty well respected. Sad to see, but this is one of the most boneheaded moves from Rogers ever. I'm saying it now, but we won't make the playoffs in another 22 years. I'm so glad to have dumped Rogers from my life. Don't need cable and don't need Rogers cellular and their spotty service and mystery charges. Edited October 29, 2015 by FrankTheRabbit
Mister G Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 The Royals revealed their flaws. Admit it or not stick a fork in them, Jays are done. Maybe in another 10-15 years they will make it to the top in the east. It wouldn't be long the Yanks and Red Sox will rise again with all the money they spend on players.
FrankTheRabbit Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) Can't forget a lot of these guys are signed long term, they still gotta lock up a couple, Estrada, maybe price and I think revere I could be mistaken but the core is pretty well in tact for the next 4 or so years Doesn't really matter how long the players are locked in for, it's more of if they care to play anymore. Having a good boss will help employees perform better...you have a bad boss, your heart just isn't in it anymore. Price and Estrada might see this as instability and they probably will move on...What a total buzz kill. All that positive build up and momentum, wiped out by Rogers. SO disappointed and Ed Rogers only persisted with his myopic "vision" to keep his ego intact. Personally, I think that the Jays Canadian market is different from the American market and I just don't believe Shapiro is the guy to understand and help the Jays succeed. Not 100% related, but look at Target...they came into Canada thinking that we would be wooed and swayed with their fancy flash and not-so-good prices and they ended up folding shop. Alex and Beeston know and understand the Canadian market and now both are not returning. You certainly need stability to build a championship team. Edited October 29, 2015 by FrankTheRabbit
fishing n autograph Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 In the first meeting between Shapiro and AA, the boss tore a strip off him for trading away all the prospects
FrankTheRabbit Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) In the first meeting between Shapiro and AA, the boss tore a strip off him for trading away all the prospects Is this confirmed? I'm curious. Regarding the trades, I'm definitely on AA's side with the trades...Bautista & Encarncion aren't getting any younger. Every time JB is on the field, he's always doing some sort of stretches. The guy is 35 and ain't getting any younger and you wonder if his HR output will be affected. Sure, he gambled away some prospects, but when those prospects mature into the majors, what kind of run production will we have in a few years from now? From my wild point of view, I'm guessing that Shapiro was brought in to make sure the Jays never make it to the playoffs in the near future. It was quite evident with Game 6 and the game changing lousy ump calls (yes, the Jays also didn't help themselves either...). Even from a numbers standpoint...the Jays brought in an extra 40% in profit...what is Ed Rogers thinking? Is he aiming to have the team bring in more than 40% to their coffers? To me, he seems like another rich privileged idiot. Edited October 29, 2015 by FrankTheRabbit
fishing n autograph Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 Seems like AA wanted total control like he had with beeston but Shapiro said no
hutch4113 Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) My biggest concern now is the Morale of the organization - not the core of team, but how this will impact everyone in the organization. I have worked for Good Companies - Bad Companies - and Good Companies that became Bad. The Bad ones all share the same thing -> destruction of employee Morale, and when that is gone, it does not come back. Staff who work for the Blue Jays have got to be wondering about things - and no matter how it is spun to the Public, will know that something about this is not right. To me this is more than AA not coming back (GM's come and go all the time - I hope he lands on his feet, but at some point all GM's are fired/hired/leave) - it is the Optics, and the seeming stupidity of Ownership that has me more concerned then ever about the direction of the Team. Edited October 29, 2015 by Tupelo
jimmer Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 Maybe he just didn't like living in Ontario. Only he really knows.
solopaddler Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 What I'm reading here about why AA left is mostly speculation. What is known is the Jays offered him a 3 year extension with an option for a 4th and a raise. He turned it down. Maybe he didn't want to be here?
hutch4113 Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 What I'm reading here about why AA left is mostly speculation. What is known is the Jays offered him a 3 year extension with an option for a 4th and a raise. He turned it down. Maybe he didn't want to be here? you are correct on that - I certainly am speculating (and like most people speculating, I am acting like it is the truth...lol. ). It was for 5 years according to Rogers. I dunno - there is just something about it that does not sit right with me. But now that I have ranted, it is time to move on. And I really hope I am wrong, and the Jays win the World Series next year - the only problem is it might interrupt my
kickingfrog Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 The higher ups at rogers stepped in it last off season when they bungled at least 2 other attempts to replace Beaston (Whitesox and Orioles). That, and AA not likely having the authority to make some moves going forward because of the new guy from Cleveland meant he'd rather move on and wait for the right situation. From his previous deals we know he's got a big set and he knows what he wants. This upper management wasn't it. Damn.
Mister G Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 My biggest concern now is the Morale of the organization - not the core of team, but how this will impact everyone in the organization. I have worked for Good Companies - Bad Companies - and Good Companies that became Bad. The Bad ones all share the same thing -> destruction of employee Morale, and when that is gone, it does not come back. Staff who work for the Blue Jays have got to be wondering about things - and no matter how it is spun to the Public, will know that something about this is not right. To me this is more than AA not coming back (GM's come and go all the time - I hope he lands on his feet, but at some point all GM's are fired/hired/leave) - it is the Optics, and the seeming stupidity of Ownership that has me more concerned then ever about the direction of the Team. BINGO.........you hit the ball right on the sweet spot........ Reminds me when of the Cleveland Indians when Jacob sold the team to the "lawyer" Dolan and then every player, one by one left.............now they haven't competed since the team was sold..........HUH, who would of thought.......
Mister G Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 He's Canadian What's the point you're trying to make ? ? ? The money is even greener south of boarder........Eh ! ! !
fishing n autograph Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 The issue is most likely that Shapiro is a total control guy and wants to do the president and GM duties yet makes someone else do the work. AA is keeping his mouth closed about what happened. He will be a GM somewhere by Christmas
fishing n autograph Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 What's the point you're trying to make ? ? ? The money is even greener south of boarder........Eh ! ! ! I was replying to another comment
Mister G Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 I was replying to another comment OK............
Acountdeleted Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 This is so Toronto. This is why we can never have nice things. AA has worked miracles. Getting Donadlson for nothing, bringing in Martin. That was before the trade deadline. I'll be honest, at the trade deadline I was screaming for AA's head. I liked a lot of our prospects and now they are gone, but he made a believer out of me. He took an opportunity and he ran with it. Looking back now, he made the right move. You need a guy like that who is going to take risks, make moves and put his job on the line. I bet Shipiro won't even consider signing Price because it was one of AA's 'mistakes'. This team will slump back to a .500 club and a golden opportunity will be lost. Being a die hard Toronto fan is hard.
FloatnFly Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 The Royals revealed their flaws. Admit it or not stick a fork in them, Jays are done. Maybe in another 10-15 years they will make it to the top in the east. It wouldn't be long the Yanks and Red Sox will rise again with all the money they spend on players. What flaws are you talking about? a depleted bullpen due to the injury to Cecil and Loup having to take care of his family? I think its pretty clear by know that the royals have an edge somewhere, they know EXACTLY what pitch is coming. there is no way that a team consistently hits so well against other teams ace pitcher that consistently, Im not just talking the jays, talking Keuchel, McHugh, Price, Stroman, and now deGrom. deGrom especially, a pitcher like that rarely gives up 8 hits in a game, let alone 8 hits in a single inning. you watch the batters, none of them are fooled by anything. its almost as if they have a guy in the back room with a camera talking in their ear. As for AA, yes he did great things THIS year, how about other years? not so great. however, when you are named the top executive, and then the incoming guy says you're taking a lesser role next season, thats a kick in the nuts. I think he had his mind made up early, he was offered a 1 year, and then a 2 year. turned them both down. he probably did a lot of research on Shapiro to find out what kind of operation he runs, and then the Shapiro telling him how disappointed he was with AA for trading prospects BEFORE he even takes over as president. thats a little too much Bull
Acountdeleted Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 As for AA, yes he did great things THIS year, how about other years? not so great. See, I didn't have a problem with with AA did before this year. He took a big shot when he brought in Dickey, Burhle, Reyes, and Johnson. It didn't work out but he took a huuuuuge shot then. What I was so impressed with him was the fact that after that shot was taken, it didn't take 5-8 years of recovery. He was able to load up and take another big swing just 3 seasons later (2? I don't remember now). The fact that he can 'go for it' more then once over a couple of years is a sign of how well the team has drafted and the minors were organized.
Mister G Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 I think its pretty clear by know that the royals have an edge somewhere, they know EXACTLY what pitch is coming. there is no way that a team consistently hits so well against other teams ace pitcher that consistently, Im not just talking the jays, talking Keuchel, McHugh, Price, Stroman, and now deGrom. deGrom especially, a pitcher like that rarely gives up 8 hits in a game, let alone 8 hits in a single inning. you watch the batters, none of them are fooled by anything. its almost as if they have a guy in the back room with a camera talking in their ear. So are you saying that the Royals were somehow cheating ? ? ? If so where is this "back room".....LOL
FloatnFly Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 So are you saying that the Royals were somehow cheating ? ? ? If so where is this "back room".....LOL no one will say anything now, but willing to bet 10-15 years down the road, there will light shed on it. kind of like how Lenny Dykstra suddenly became so good......he blackmailed umpires to give him favourable calls. paid a team of private investigators, and spied on the umps behaviours outside of baseball with wireless technology the way it is now, could have a camera anywhere zoomed in on the catcher, having it feed to a laptop or tablet, then that person, where ever they are in the stadium, bench, trainers room, clubhouse, owners box, relay the info to the batter via a tiny wireless ear piece
Mister G Posted October 29, 2015 Report Posted October 29, 2015 no one will say anything now, but willing to bet 10-15 years down the road, there will light shed on it. kind of like how Lenny Dykstra suddenly became so good......he blackmailed umpires to give him favourable calls. paid a team of private investigators, and spied on the umps behaviours outside of baseball with wireless technology the way it is now, could have a camera anywhere zoomed in on the catcher, having it feed to a laptop or tablet, then that person, where ever they are in the stadium, bench, trainers room, clubhouse, owners box, relay the info to the batter via a tiny wireless ear piece Do you like Mel Gibson........if so watch Conspiracy Theory if you haven't already. I'm sure you will enjoy it.
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