irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 (edited) In all my years of wrenching on engines (since I was 13 years old) I've never had this happen (and why I always put antiseize on plug threads). Working on getting my JD350 dozer going so my son can grade his lot and of course the one plug (out of 3) that wasn't firing was seized in place. Couldn't turn it with a 3/8 ratchet.. so of course I hit it with the 1/2" and broke it off. Looks like about 1/2 inch of thread section left in the head. I've sprayed some penetrating oil at it... and thought I'd come here and ask the mechanics what their plan of attach would be! I'm figuring maybe an EZ-out.. but with it being about 3inches recessed I don't know.... Thanks! Edited June 10, 2011 by irishfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aniceguy Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 thats a tough one dont think and easy out will work you might be stuck drilling it out and having to re tap the hole, but risk enlarging it..go have a beer and think it through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 That's the delema... can't drill it without putting chips on top of the piston. If the EZ-out slips.. same deal. Sure don't want to pull the head on this old beast. The recessed hole is so damn tight that I had to taper grind the end of my thin walled 13/16 plug socket even! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 could you hammer in just the right size chisel or screwdriver into it and unscrew it any room to add a spot wield to it and the chisel once it's hammered in tight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 There appears to be a lot of material on the wall of that plug Wayne. I think I would apply some penetrating fluid on it, let it soak in for a day or two. I might hit it with the torch to break the thread rust-locked to the block. Then use an easy out. I like the Snap-on tapered easy outs for spark plugs. Haven't had one yet I couldn't get out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 I figure it was so rusted in I couldnt' turn it and going bigger broke it off. I heard this happens a lot with some Ford engines, hoping Bernie jumps in soon.. I sent him a PM. I'm afraid of the extra pressure of an EZ-out hammered in expanding it and making it even tighter to get out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misfish Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Wayne If you can,try to turn it back down using an ezyout. If not,drop a few drops of tapping fluid to the threads and let it soak abit. Give the fluid time to seep in. Then use the ezyout to get it out.(Up, down, up, down)Im sure it,s just some rust thats built up . What ever you do,DO NOT TRY TO DRILL IT OUT AND RETAP.Im sure I dont have to tell you why and what will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 And there he is! Thanks Bernie... thought about hitting it with the torch as well. That's the only way we ever get juniors lug nuts off his Ford Focus... otherwise the studs snap. I have a set of Snap on EZ-outs... I'll spray again before going to bed and try it tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misfish Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Did we all type at the same time.LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Thanks Brian and Terry.. Louis.. Anyone else that stumbles in post post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 If you need to drill (sometimes we need to) Put it at the top on compression stroke. We made an adapter that fits on the end of a vacuum cleaner that reduces it to a thin wall hose that fits into the cylinder and vacuum it out. Then we verify we got it all with a borescope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Okay thanks Bernie.. I have a flexible borescope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinnimon Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 In all my years of wrenching on engines (since I was 13 years old) I've never had this happen (and why I always put antiseize on plug threads). Working on getting my JD350 dozer going so my son can grade his lot and of course the one plug (out of 3) that wasn't firing was seized in place. Couldn't turn it with a 3/8 ratchet.. so of course I hit it with the 1/2" and broke it off. Looks like about 1/2 inch of thread section left in the head. I've sprayed some penetrating oil at it... and thought I'd come here and ask the mechanics what their plan of attach would be! I'm figuring maybe an EZ-out.. but with it being about 3inches recessed I don't know.... Thanks! Ive been there before , but you have easy access to it. You will need a left hand drill bit, one that cuts in reverse for starters( one thats about 1/16 to 1/8 of an inch smaller than the max diameter of the plug) . A shop vac, and reduce the hose end to reach inside the cylindar bore. You already have a guide at the plug. A thin magnet. A can of Liquid Torch. A very good small sharp pointed chisel and a small hammer( just in case). Ive been lucky on a few cat. detroit 55 and 60 series, cummins and volvo engines with the same issue, except they were fuel line fittings seized in the head. Most times the heat generated from the left hand bit frees them up As for easy outs, I find most of them expands what your trying to free up. Snap on has the best Ive used.If it moves then use the easy out. Just my 1.9238 american cents worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBCregal Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 putting grease on the drillbit helps with trapping the shavings as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ketchenany Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 I' m not the sharpest tool in the shed, but could you not drill into it and 'lock' . . . glue etc. the bit, after it sets try to nudge it out? Hope all goes well Wayne! I did a snow blower two years back almost with the same PITA and after 2 days it was freed. Didn't snap it but it was close. hate to have to take it apart. A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 About the only thing I don't have in my arsenal, of multiple roller cabinets, is left hand bits Vince. I always mean to grab some one day.. but it never happens! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffBornFishin Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 That's the delema... can't drill it without putting chips on top of the piston. If the EZ-out slips.. same deal. Sure don't want to pull the head on this old beast. The recessed hole is so damn tight that I had to taper grind the end of my thin walled 13/16 plug socket even! Here's an old school trick. Put the problem cylinder at bottom dead centre. Next take some small diameter hemp rope or equivelant and fill the cylinder with it to the base if the plug hole after soaking the rope in water. Now you have two options. Carefully drill the thing out and now you don't have to worry about cuttings going into the cylinder. If that's a no go heat the broken portion with oxy/aceteyne. Once its nice and hot use a wide blade heavy duty slotted screwdriver, chisel or eazy out with plenty of non flammable liquid wrench. Then carefully try removing the stubborn broken off plug. You get better results if drill the bulk of the broken off piece out first then try heating/removing the leftover. It will tend to split and come apart easier. The rope keeps crap from getting into the cylinder. Once you get the stubborn piece out, take a shop vac and put it over the hole and draw out the rope. Don't worry about damaging the threads in the head too much, a heli-coil kit works wonders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Sometimes if it's accessible with a die grinder I use a small bit and cut a slot almost to the block threads. This will reduce the pressure of the plug thread to the outside. This also allows the use of the easy outs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Thanks everyone... I'm gonna have an El Dorado Silver Deluxe or three ... and get on it in the morning! A broken plug wasn't what I needed after 6 hours of working on it in the woods to finally get it to fire (while being eaten alive the whole time) and then running enough to at least move it to the hangar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinnimon Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 (edited) About the only thing I don't have in my arsenal, of multiple roller cabinets, is left hand bits Vince. I always mean to grab some one day.. but it never happens! If theres an auckland granger store around, im sure they will have it. usually open till noon on saturdays. ps those bits are extremely expensive. Edited June 10, 2011 by vinnimon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Thanks! And many wonder why OFC is the most successful/busiest "fishing" forum on the net! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Cliff Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Wurth has a product that freezes things to -40 or something close to it. I have used it to undo bolts that I didn't think would ever come undone. I wonder if it would work for you in this case. Give them a call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misfish Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Sometimes if it's accessible with a die grinder I use a small bit and cut a slot almost to the block threads. This will reduce the pressure of the plug thread to the outside. This also allows the use of the easy outs. Good call Bernie. That will allow the thread to collapes abit and allow for a much easier take out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aplumma Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Just had to do this one on a bolt. Soak it with a light lube and then a 1/4 extention chucked up in a hammer drill. Run it in reverse for the vibration factor for a few minutes a few times. Wash off with brake cleaner to remove the oil then try to see if you can stick weld an piece of square stock on the top of the plug base. Vacuum any spatter and re apply the oil then put the square stock into a socket and use the hammer/hand impact extractor. Don't mess with it till Saturday so it has time to soak. Art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PERCHER Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 If you have the room take a mig welder and weld a bolt to it>then heat the plug and remove it with a socket. Just an idea. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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