canadadude Posted July 18, 2008 Report Posted July 18, 2008 I know exactly what you are saying C-Dude,that's where the whole question of ethics comes in, and you know all too well there are alot of unethical anglers out there man ,one can argue that the "group" would hypathetically be allowed 20 fish between them for example, the question would be who really caught them...it's like the rejects in our area that catch a limit of fish, call up someone on thier cell phone to come and pick them up, a vehicle rolls up, grabs the bucket or bag of fish, peels off leaving the idiots fishing for another bag full, these guys know exactly what they are doing wrong...same as people who claim thier kids caught half the haul of fish for the day..I hate that crap man Exactly right but what your describing is not only unethical but completly illegal. I know ethics come into play big time when fishing aswell as anything else in life. I'm in no postion to judge others ethics, but I will speak up and notify the authorities if I whitness illegal practices. I'm not god and I'm sure my opinions on what I may think is ethical fishing practices and what others think will probably differ. The only real position I can take is if the law is being broken then it is my duty as an angler to report it. Heck I may think someone is unethical if they whitness a crime and do nothing to report it.
Gerritt Posted July 19, 2008 Author Report Posted July 19, 2008 Well, there has certainly been a wide array of responses.. I just thought to myself how could I PROVE to the MNR that this is what he was doing.. it is not like I tape recorded our conversation.. I met a fellow OFC'r there, Ned (Goran's Cousin) his handle is something along the lines of looking4eyes?? He also talked with Jeff... and was given the same story.. he also thinks a slot fish was kept.. Normally I would not have issue in turning in someone that was breaking the law... but I had no way to prove it to the MNR other then his big mouth telling the camp.. next thing you know I am spending hours with the MNR giving statements etc,possible court appearances up north etc.. there is a campful of guests, a person who just passed away with that comes ambulances and the OPP etc etc etc.. it was in my opinion just not the right thing to do without having to create a situation. Had the circumstances been different, my response would have been as well. He knew how I felt about it however as I let him know what he was doing was infact not the ethical thing to be doing. G...
Greencoachdog Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Well, there has certainly been a wide array of responses.. I just thought to myself how could I PROVE to the MNR that this is what he was doing.. it is not like I tape recorded our conversation.. I met a fellow OFC'r there, Ned (Goran's Cousin) his handle is something along the lines of looking4eyes?? He also talked with Jeff... and was given the same story.. he also thinks a slot fish was kept.. Normally I would not have issue in turning in someone that was breaking the law... but I had no way to prove it to the MNR other then his big mouth telling the camp.. next thing you know I am spending hours with the MNR giving statements etc,possible court appearances up north etc.. there is a campful of guests, a person who just passed away with that comes ambulances and the OPP etc etc etc.. it was in my opinion just not the right thing to do without having to create a situation. Had the circumstances been different, my response would have been as well. He knew how I felt about it however as I let him know what he was doing was infact not the ethical thing to be doing. G... There's a CO that patrols that area well, he's stopped me the last 2 yrs. in a row. You could've called with an anonymous tip and described his boat and told them to check his limit in the boat and at camp... and that he had been bragging about what he was doing... simple!
Musky or Specks Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Doing nothing was not the right thing to do. I understand your trepidation but if we all do nothing idiots jus keep doing it. CO's can come in and search his cottage, his car, his fridge they do not need a search warrant. Im sure they could get the guy. By doing nothing you encourage this behavior. Its akin to watching someone stealing something in a store and not doing anything.
StrealHeader Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Sounds like someones feeling a little covetous. J/K Gerritt I personally see nothing wrong with it ethically, but as stated previously this is in the eye of the beholder. As long as the fish were not going to waste or being sold I don't see the issue. Sounds like the slow fishing the rest of the lodge had made up for his over harvest anyways. Funny how mother nature has its way of working things out.
Gerritt Posted July 19, 2008 Author Report Posted July 19, 2008 I have called the MNR... Yes they answer the phone @ 1am on the TIPS Line.. I explained to the officer the situation and he infact said what he was doing was illegal. I gave the officer the required particulars and will let the MNR deal with it.
Musky or Specks Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Great Job Gerrit. I thank you for helping to protect ours and our childrens resources.
jace Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 The rules on this are different depending on where you live. Some places allow boat or party limits so some people bring young kids and grandparents out on trips. I know of some charter people affected by this because ordinarily they would allow the clients to keep their own catch as well as their deckhand's limits, but they've had to cut that out in the last year or so. Another interesting rule about possession in some areas is the fish comes off your possession the moment it reaches a certain level of processing that allows for long term storage. In such areas, the fishermen will literally can their fish right on site. roll up metal cans and pressure cook them over propane burners. Being vacuum packed and freezing is also sufficient and this type of meat hunter will have motorhomes with either a huge battery bank or run massive power inverters for home sized chest freezers. To get it straight, this is usually in areas where hunting and fishing for all your fish/meat for the year in one shot is common and no different from the ontario hunter who fills a freezer with moose and deer in the fall to last all year.
Carp Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 If this guy was bragging about catching & keeping limits for his entire family and then catching more & giving them away, I'll bet he had more fish in his possession than he was letting on and some illegal slot fish too. If he's gotten away with it once, the second, third, ....hundreth time, etc., comes easier for him. Sounds like this wasn't the first time he's done this. You did the right thing Gerritt. MNR officers will get the truth from the family if they investigate. I'd like to see him serve a day in jail for every fish he took over his limit (12+++) along with a $100 fine for each fish over the limit ($1200+++), $100 fine for any fish in the slot limit, forfeit his gear and lose his fishing priviledges for at least 3-5 years. But hey, I'm just a big softie. Of course, a real judge would probably come down hard on "Jeff". A "real" judge would settle for a much smaller fine, no jail time, and let him keep his gear so he continue raping our natural resources. " Jeff ", will learn his lesson and just be more careful not to open his mouth next time he's fishing illegally, which will be as often as he can because the penalties and chances of getting caught are minimal. I'll also bet that if he does get busted, next time someone asked if he caught anything, he'll be much more evasive and his answer will be "no", or "just a couple", no matter how many fish he has. What a dumb !!!
ChrisK Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Guys, I know Jeff and he has been a good freind of mine for a long time...He goes up to the lake in July with his family every year and has been for the past twenty years. He has two boys and a wife and they all partake in fishing especially walleye. He knows and follows the MNR rules very carefully. Yes he may be a meat hunter of sorts but his family does enjoy eating the walleye they catch and I can guarantee that you could check his freezer in the cabin while up there and you will never find he is over his legal limit and when he leaves camp the fish are transported exactly to MNR code. Is this treading on the edge of fishing unethics.....perhaps but it is his familys legal right to take home their possesion limit reguadless. Jeff can fish all he wants after their limit is filled but he must release all from that point. I have fished with Jeff over the years and showed him walleye fishing techniques that will take fish when everyone else is getting skunked and he has got quite good at it. Also he is quite a personality while in camp and sometimes folks tend to get a little ticked off. Anyways I guess what I'm saying is,not all may seem as you see it up front. Cheers !!!!
Chris Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Do any of you guys ever rat on people you see speeding in their cars??? Far more dangerous to society than someone keeping a limit of fish for his family. I saw a thread about driving on here one time where everyone was bragging about how fast they drive. That unethical too and against the law. But being a lot of people that post here do it, I guess it's ok right....double standard????
danbo Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Sounds like Carolina Riggin'! Bottom-line is MYOB.. then ya won't get in trouble, or fights or a heart-attack from boiling blood!!
solopaddler Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Guys,I know Jeff and he has been a good freind of mine for a long time...He goes up to Lakair in July with his family every year and has been for the past twenty years. He has two boys and a wife and they all partake in fishing especially walleye. He knows and follows the MNR rules very carefully. Yes he may be a meat hunter of sorts but his family does enjoy eating the walleye they catch and I can guarantee that you could check his freezer in the cabin while up there and you will never find he is over his legal limit and when he leaves camp the fish are transported exactly to MNR code. Is this treading on the edge of fishing unethics.....perhaps but it is his familys legal right to take home their possesion limit reguadless. Jeff can fish all he wants after their limit is filled but he must release all from that point. I have fished with Jeff over the years and showed him walleye fishing techniques that will take fish when everyone else is getting skunked and he has got quite good at it. Also he is quite a personality while in camp and sometimes folks tend to get a little ticked off. Anyways I guess what I'm saying is,not all may seem as you see it up front. Cheers !!!! Well this is an interesting turn of events, small world.
Greencoachdog Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 (edited) Well this is an interesting turn of events, small world. I knew that Muckiestubb was a no-goodnick the first time I saw him!!! Associating with Poachers an' Rednecks an' Admin an' the like!!! Edited July 19, 2008 by Greencoachdog
Terry Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 I am still not sure if he kept more then his limit in a single day and thought it was ok to keep more because he gave them away all during the same day which is illegal or if it was over the duration of his stay and never kept more then his daily limit giving them away at the end of the day and fishing the next day for his limit because he has no fish in his possession , which would be legal as for ethics, that has nothing to do with the law and is always a personal opinion, so I try not to discuss ethics
Cory Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 I just ignore Jeff when we are in camp at the same time, some people just have to make up for certain things by being louder and more in your face than others..... I just wish you wouldn't have shown him my good spots Chris....and keep that lindy to yourself
wallyboss Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 (edited) Jeff can fish all he wants after their limit is filled but he must release all from that point. If his limit is filled he is supposed to stop fishing for that species of fish. It would be the same thing as Closed season. You can't fish a certain species when the season is closed even if you are releasing them. After a persons limit is filled the season is closed for him until he does not possess those fish anymore unless it's his daily limit. then even if he eats or gives away those fish he legally shouldn't fish for that species anymore. Some will say that he can't know what will bite on his line. But during closed season for walleye if you are caught fishing with a bottom bouncer and a worm harness even if you don't have any fish in the boat they can still charge you for targetting out of season fish. Same thing for after reaching your limit. Edited July 20, 2008 by wallyboss
Gerritt Posted July 19, 2008 Author Report Posted July 19, 2008 While I am pleased others know him and therefor understand his personality. He pretty much weirded my wife and Ned's wife right out LOL! That said I know what was being told to me in very much a bragging manner about how HE caught his entire families limit and how if he caught more he was going to give them away... Hell even the girl tending the snack shop told me to talk to him for this reason, as he seemed to be the only one in camp on fish I understand he is you're friend Chris. But I feel as though what I did was right and after talking to the MNR I feel better about it, as they said it was not legal. If he did not break any laws he has nothing to worry about right? Perhaps it is his personality that has him in this position now. G..
mkeyes Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 I can't see keeping any more than I am going to eat that day or the next. If I want to keep fishing then I just release. I have been known to go ashore, cook up what I have caught, eat that and then catch more for dinner. Does it count when it is in your belly???
Gerritt Posted July 19, 2008 Author Report Posted July 19, 2008 I can't see keeping any more than I am going to eat that day or the next. If I want to keep fishing then I just release. I have been known to go ashore, cook up what I have caught, eat that and then catch more for dinner. Does it count when it is in your belly??? Yes... they count towards you're daily catch limit... G
Sugarpacket Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 I'm sure had you said something "jeff" wouldn't listen and not care, but if you got his address call the MNR and have them do a freezer search his attitude will change about his family limit since my guess is he has more than that in there. Also I would just release my fish if I was at my limit I'd rather not fish out a lake and fill my bucket if not called for.
Terry Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 mekissa yup, they count in your belly, in a friends belly or in the garbage....they count
Dano Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 What does the death of a complete stranger have to with it, or your feelings toward the lodge owners? All "anglers" should feel it is their duty to report poaching or other illegal activities, if you dont, you are just as guilty as the poachers.
Canuck2fan Posted July 19, 2008 Report Posted July 19, 2008 Do any of you guys ever rat on people you see speeding in their cars??? Far more dangerous to society than someone keeping a limit of fish for his family. I saw a thread about driving on here one time where everyone was bragging about how fast they drive. That unethical too and against the law. But being a lot of people that post here do it, I guess it's ok right....double standard???? Ratting is something one crimminal does on another to get a better plea bargain. What Gerritt did was uphold the law!!!!! Yes speeding is dangerous and if you or anyone on here sees someone going well over the speed limit I would hope they would call it in too. No double standard here. And don't even get me started on how I deal with people who have had one too many and try to get behind the wheel since you seem to want to throw apples and donuts together I thought I would too. LOL.
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