I'm having problems with Salmon...

[Mark.O]

Heya all,

 

Hope everyones doing good. Me and a buddy went fishing for salmon today at Lake Ontario at around 11 p.m. Got there and decided to use glow in the dark cleos from shore. Everything was going well till...boom, fish on. I was very excited for it, since i've never caught a salmon before. I start fighting with it, letting the drag out, reeling it in. Then boom, it's gone. Bad luck...since it took my lure as well. I tried once again. This time I saw the salmon break the surface after the bite. It was huge. I couldn't believe it. I was fighting with it for a good 15 minutes and no progress at all. I decided to tighten the line a little and I still kept fighting with it. When it was in a good distance from the shore, the line snapped again. I was devastated. But I thought I'd give this one more try...and sure enough I got another fish on. I fought with this one for a good 10 minutes when I turned the tension up a little. I had no problem reeling it in and it was close to being mine when it began to swim up to the surface and then it snapped my line. 3 cleo's down the drain...and 3 monster fish lost...

 

Now, that was my first time fishing for salmon. I went with JP DeRose to BPS for the shopping spree when I won the WFN contest and he told me I should get 8 pound line, but he assumed I was going river fishing. Should I be using a stronger line? I just feel like there's no reason I should be losing these fish, especially when the fish feel exhausted and it feels like I just have to reel them in. Maybe 16 or 18 pound line is the solution? I'm very confused and sad at the moment...I'm not sure what to do. Judging from the size of the fish, they looked atleast 20 lbs. What am I doing wrong?

 

Thanks.

 

-Mark Orszulak

Edited September 10, 2007 by Angler Mark

[DT10Sam]

Sounds like the line you are using is light for salmon and is good for rainbow fishing. I generally use a heavier line in the river. You can get 12 or 14 lb test that is thin enough to use and it will work better for you. Sounds like you are having fun hooking the salmon.

 

Regards,

Sam

[muddler]

Well I'd go a bitt heavier with the line weight. You could still land them on 8LB test line though.

From your decription of loosing fish because of a broken line, ther's a few thing I'd be checking out.

 

1. If the line is breaking at or very near the knot, then your knot may not be of the best strenght..Try a different knot. Orvis knot is my choice for 10 lb and less, Palmar Knot for 12 lb and more.

 

2. If the line is breaking somwhere in the middle then check your guides. Run a piece of panyhose (explain that to your wife/girl freind first) through each guide and chech if it snag on anything in the guide. If so it may be cracked or scored (replace it). It also may just need to be cleaned (soap and water and a q-tip)

 

3. Then there's always the zebra mussel. If your line rubbed the botton of the lake, you may have nicked the line on a zebra mussel. They're like razor blade. Not too much you can do about it.

 

4. Bad batch of line. It happens, try a different brand.

 

Good luck...muddler

[Bob]

Bear in mind that most fish are able to pull at least double their weight so a 20lb fish can concievably break a 40 lb line. I usually use 10 or 12 lb line fishing salmon from shore but have taken a 32 lb fish on 6lb line. Long fight and huge runs. Worst mistake you can make is fiddling with your drag tension while in the middle of a tussle. If you have your drag preset correctly before you start to fish, then leave it alone. Only time I'll tighten up on a fish is if I see my line down to a few wraps on the spool and it's still going out. Rather lose the fish than have one dragging a hundred odd yards of line around behind him.

[BITEME]

$20.00 per lesson

[Uncle Buck]

I'd throw 30lb power pro on the reel if i were you...

 

I've never been broken off with it... the odd time the fish will spit/straighten the hook though...

but if you're in an area where there are lots of snags it could pose a challenge

[Whopper]

Should have chased him down in your new boat

[Headhunter]

You should not have a problem with any Salmon on 8lb line... question I have is, what size/type of rod are you using? A standard 7 ft. medium rod is not going to cut it! You need a very long rod and PATIENCE! I've seen guys fight salmon for hours on light line! They will beat the fish, if they have the patience.

As Bob said, set your drag, pull up a chair and fight it out!

Your obviously doing something right, your getting hook ups!

Also, as suggested, check your line frequently... zebra mussels will make quick order of your line, with even the slightest rub on the bottom. And mono is far more forgiving then no stretch on those long runs.

HH

Edited September 10, 2007 by Headhunter

[Toronto_Angler]

I think you might be better off getting a heavier braided line. 8 pound test would take a loooong time to bring a big boy in and increase your chances of a snap off. 30lb braid minimum would work well I think.

[mikeymikey]

Yes,,,

 

get yourself a 20lb or 30lb braided line.

 

and i want to fish where you fished at... hooking into 3 fish is great night!

[Fang]

I'll be the first to disagree. 8-10 lb mono should be fine as long as you've got enough of it. 200+ yards as a minimum for pier fishing. You did not mention what reel you are using and my first concern would be you're drag based on the sequence of events.

Set the drag up and use your index fringer for any added pressure. On some reels 2-3 click adjustment can be way too much.

 

I use a Pro Qualifier 4000 on the pier and it seems to handle most fish.

 

If you don't have a very smooth drag a big chinook will pop any pound test if the reel can't keep up when they run. I've had downrigger reels not behaving right and pop 20-30 lb test just as if it where 8lb.

 

Another thing that happens now is the males start developing a neat set of canine teeth. You can run a heavy flouro leader - 14/17lb to avoid those teeth.

 

Oh and by the way, Great going on hooking up with 3. They are fun fish

[Mark.O]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

 

From what it sounds like, I shouldn't have a problem landing a salmon on my 8 lb line. I think my main problem was my drag. I should have fought the fish longer rather then getting excited after 15 minutes and tightening up the drag. I think I did something like 2 or 3 clicks tighter, which apparently makes a huge difference from what it sounds like. Next time I'm going to keep the drag at where it is, and let the fish tire itself out. But it's amazing at the fight they give. I've never fought a fish that big before. The biggest fish I've ever caught was a 4 lb bass so going up to salmon that weight 20-30 lbs is ridiculous.

 

I'm going to post up my rod / reel set up and maybe someone can further help me out.

 

Those cleo's are also amazing. They just attract the fish like crazy. I was amazed at the fact that I had 3 fish on in only 2 hours.

 

Thanks for all the tips guys. And once again, i'll post up my set up for critiquing.

 

-Mark

[Headhunter]

Here's another thing to consider with respect to your drag. The tension on the spool changes significantly based on the amount of line on the spool at the time. For instance, if you set your drag before you cast out 150ft of line, the amount of strength required to pull out drag will be X, but the amount of strength to pull out the drag with 150ft of line out will be significantly different. Remember, with line out, the spool becomes "smaller" and therefore requires more pull, to get the drag to release! Man, I don't know if I made any sense there!LOL

HH

[douG]

Sure, it makes sense, HH. As the line goes out, more torque is required to turn the smaller spool. This means that your drag effectively tightens itself as the run continues to strip line from your reel.

[Headhunter]

Thanks for un-complicating my convoluted post douG!

HH

[Uncle Buck]

And that's the reason why Doug is a Rocket Scientist!!!

[gforce]

where were you if you do not mind me asking?

[Canuck2fan]

You are lucky no doubt winning the WFN thing and then hooking up 3 salmon in 2 hours pier fishing is pretty good in anyone's book.

 

Couple of things to keep in mind that haven't been mentioned yet. Firstly, Don't get down if the next 4 or 5 times you go out you don't hook a thing. Because just as losing fish the odd time is part of what pier fishing is all about so is getting skunked. Lastly it could be the snapping strength of the line for a better word. Meaning the line might be rated for 8lbs and not break if you gently put 8lbs of stress on it. It might snap though at 2 or 3lbs with a sudden force being put on it. I had this problem with some 5lb leader material in the spring. I had 3 break-offs opening week and all in the middle of the leader. I thought abrasion from a nick maybe as were fishing in some areas with zebra muscles. Then I gave a pre tied leader to a buddy who was having trouble tying in the dark one morning and he took the line wrapped it around both hands and snapped it taut. The line broke like 2lb test. So I checked the spool and there were parts of it that none of us could snap and break like that but a HUGE amount of the spool you could break just by letting it go slack about 6 inches over a two foot length and snapping it taut. Which is what tends to happen even with a long rod, absorbing a lot more of the shock of such sudden movements, a large fish surfacing then tightening the line can still wreak havoc on spool of bad line. Although 8lb test should be plenty if your rod is over 10 ft or so.

Edited September 10, 2007 by Canuck2fan

[Mark.O]

Once again, thanks for the advice.

 

My set up is as follows:

 

- Shimano Symetre 2500FI reel

- Shimano Convergence 10" rod

- 8 lb line from Trilene

- Lots of Cleo's

 

Salmon fishing appears to be alot more trickier then pike or bass fishing. I'm used to the 1-2 minute fight that bass give me but not this drawn out fighting that Salmon seems to provide. But I'm more eager then ever to just go back and try fighting them again. The fight is just amazing, never thought a fish could fight like that, but apparently a 20lb fish is incredibly strong...I was actually getting tired 15 minutes into the fight. But next time, I'm going to let that fish tire out, even if it means sitting there for a good hour or two lol.

 

I was fishing at a mouth of the Ontario river, to whomever asked me.

 

Thanks again!

 

-Mark

[JPD]

Hi Mark, glad you are getting hook ups...

 

The 8 lb Trilene XL that we set you up with actually breaks at better than 12 lbs of pressure so it should be fine if you are patient. We typically land big Kings in the Niagara running 6 pound and in rivers very often 4 lb.

I don't recommend going any heavier because the line diameter will increase thus decreasing your spool capacity.

Further, don't use any braided line for this application. It is way too stressful on your equipment with the lack of stretch and the power these fish possess. You don't need it. To make matters worse, 30 lb Power pro has a thicker diameter (0.11) than 8 lbs mono (0.10) even though it is a tiny difference it still means less line and no stretch and IMO won't cast nearly as well.

 

You have that great 10 foot rod, let the rod take the load and don't rush it. You'll figure it out I'm sure.

 

Good luck and I hope you land one on your next trip out!!!

 

JP

Edited September 11, 2007 by JPD

[stuntman]

You now have to catch 3 salmon for every one you lost.

 

OK, so you have a bunch of tips, you can never have too many; some of this is basic stuff:

 

-UV and extreme heat kills mono. Keep it off your cars rear windows ledge.

 

-a short rod is OK but you have to pay attention and be quick on the action so your line stays taught but lets out before your rod maxs out. With tension 10lbs on a short rod is the same as 10lbs on a long rod. So if you have no cash, don't worry about it, you wont land them all but it will still be fun.

 

-don't crank your rod up. 90 degrees line to rod is th max angle

 

-you did not say what your broken line looked like. Different breaks can result from different causes.

 

-you tightened your drag (you said you knew it was wrong). I set my drag while the rod has a full load, then back it off a bit to compensate for extra drag as the line gets played out, unperfect knots and other wear and tear.

 

-braided line will wear out your rod guides unless they are setup to handle it.

 

-blah blah blah...the other posts took care of just about everything else.....say, you are using a swivel.

 

-aren't there other posts on line?

 

Stuntman

[Mark.O]

lol Thanks for the recap stuntman, I actually never looked at the condition of my line. I guess that would have given me some clues as to what happened...too bad it was so dark out too.

 

Thanks again JP for the tips. The rod and reel set up you got me was awesome. Giordano was getting some decent bites with it too. And those Cleo's are just working like crazy. The line set up makes perfect sense, I figured it wasn't anything to do with the 8lb line but more so with my ill use of the drag. I'm heading back to try fishing again Wednesday night and this time, I'm going to be ALOT more patient with those monsters. Never expected to even get one of those on, let alone three in one night. Great fishing experience though. And all these tips are really helping. Now I won't be making the same mistakes as I was before.

 

Thanks everyone!

 

-Mark

[musky]

i checked the weather for wednesday... looks like itll be adequate conditions..soo the sammys 'll be runnnin' ... better pick up some cleos / the one you owe me...lebaron wednesday?