O'Leary Calls out Wynne - NF

[Dara]

Really they ask if for your sexual preference at the polls?

 

Me thinks no...

 

 

Oh yeah..I been asked a few times...my wife kicked her the heck off our doorstep

[manitoubass2]

 

 

Oh yeah..I been asked a few times...my wife kicked her the heck off our doorstep

Really? Wow thats voilating a persons rights for sure!

 

ask some random that on the street and I bet it ends up with a punch or slap!

[cram]

Wynne is awful, there is no question. She is probably the worst politician I can remember in my lifetime. But the notion that the PC party is any better with money is not accurate.

 

Between 2006 and 2015 Steve added $127.02 BILLION dollars (in 2011 dollars) to the national debt, and yet I hear guys on here saying our grandkids will be paying for Wynne's debt. Clearly, they have both run up a bill that we can't afford, yet some people here bought the con propaganda.

 

 

Dutch...I'm not a big fan of Harper, but a massive chunk of that was stimulus spending following the '08 crash. You can't hang that on him.

 

Further - TD says that Trudeau is on course to burn through 150B in the next 5 yrs....http://www.theglobeandmail.com//news/politics/liberal-spending-could-add-150-billion-to-national-debt-td-economists-say/article28964092/?cmpid=rss1

 

 

[cram]

Further, Harper LOWERED taxes from what i remember. Wynne has raised them a few times.

[Dutch01]

 

Dutch...I'm not a big fan of Harper, but a massive chunk of that was stimulus spending following the '08 crash. You can't hang that on him.

 

Further - TD says that Trudeau is on course to burn through 150B in the next 5 yrs....http://www.theglobeandmail.com//news/politics/liberal-spending-could-add-150-billion-to-national-debt-td-economists-say/article28964092/?cmpid=rss1

 

 

This is a fair criticism, however I was told that the Liberals forced Harper to overspend, which is not the case. Flaherty directly contradicted that assertion. They also ran five consecutive deficits in the subsequent five years.

 

Forecasts are guesses. Why don't we wait and judge Trudeau on what he does, not what someone else says he will do?

Edited March 1, 2016 by Dutch01

[Dara]

This is a fair criticism, however I was told that the Liberals forced Harper to overspend, which is not the case. Flaherty directly contradicted that assertion. They also ran five consecutive deficits in the subsequent five years.

 

Forecasts are guesses. Why don't we wait and judge Trudeau on what he does, not what someone else says he will do?

He did after the fact...first budget didn't have the excessive overspending...but, whatever

[Dara]

Really? Wow thats voilating a persons rights for sure!

 

ask some random that on the street and I bet it ends up with a punch or slap!

 

 

I was kidding

[Dutch01]

He did after the fact...first budget didn't have the excessive overspending...but, whatever

My point was you can't claim you were forced to do something, then later take credit for it being your idea.

[Big Cliff]

This is a fair criticism, however I was told that the Liberals forced Harper to overspend, which is not the case. Flaherty directly contradicted that assertion. They also ran five consecutive deficits in the subsequent five years.

 

Forecasts are guesses. Why don't we wait and judge Trudeau on what he does, not what someone else says he will do?

Well, can we at least judge Wynne on what she has done already?

[Dutch01]

Further, Harper LOWERED taxes from what i remember. Wynne has raised them a few times.

He did lower taxes, but he didn't lower spending by a like amount. All he did was raise the bill for our kids and grandkids, the very thing being complained about above.

[manitoubass2]

 

 

I was kidding

Was deflected by my tinfoil hat??

[Dutch01]

Well, can we at least judge Wynne on what she has done already?

Absolutely, I've repeatedly been very clear about the terrible job she's done. Did you miss it?

[Roy]

I would love to know what % of Wynnes votes came from the gay community, not because they thought she would be good at the job but because she came out saying she was a lesbien. (just for the record I don't have any problem with anyone's preferances as long as they don't try to impose them on me.)

I don't think so Cliff. Somehow I just can't see you being a lesbian.

[cram]

This is a fair criticism, however I was told that the Liberals forced Harper to overspend, which is not the case. Flaherty directly contradicted that assertion. They also ran five consecutive deficits in the subsequent five years.

 

Forecasts are guesses. Why don't we wait and judge Trudeau on what he does, not what someone else says he will do?

You're the one who brought up Harper!

 

As for Trudeau...he seems like a good dude, but his "forecasting" leaves a lot to be desired so far. Wasn't he emphatic just a few months ago that he'd be running a 10B deficit? (and it now looks a lot more like 30-40).

[John Bacon]

Wynne is awful, there is no question. She is probably the worst politician I can remember in my lifetime. But the notion that the PC party is any better with money is not accurate.

 

Between 2006 and 2015 Steve added $127.02 BILLION dollars (in 2011 dollars) to the national debt, and yet I hear guys on here saying our grandkids will be paying for Wynne's debt. Clearly, they have both run up a bill that we can't afford, yet some people here bought the con propaganda.

 

 

This is from a post I made on a previous thread:

 

My question for you is this: If every PM, PC or Liberal, adds to the debt every year as proven above, how can you argue that it is the Liberals who will bankrupt this country?

 

The way I see it, Canadians, will ALWAYS, ALWAYS get screwed by our politicians, because they sell a narrative of "us versus them" to low information voters who buy in without checking facts.

 

Full disclosure: I voted PC provincially and Liberal federally in the last election, in the interest of transparency.

 

I think that a very key point here is that McGuinty/Wynne ran up more debt for just Ontario than Harper did for the entire country. And they did that with higher taxes and higher transfer payments from the federal government.

 

Harper ran up debt, but he did it with lower taxes and without cutting transfers to the province (Chretien cut federal health and social transfers by 34%).

 

 

 

Edited March 1, 2016 by JohnBacon

[Big Cliff]

I don't think so Cliff. Somehow I just can't see you being a lesbian.

Oh I've been told several times that I could make a very good lesbian

[manitoubass2]

Oh I've been told several times that I could make a very good lesbian

Fishing related in a political thread???

[jimmer]

I don't know if to cry or laugh at some of these posts. I do know that we're in trouble when politicians talk about millions and billions of dollars like it's pocket change.

[manitoubass2]

I don't know if to cry or laugh at some of these posts. I do know that we're in trouble when politicians talk about millions and billions of dollars like it's pocket change.

Imagine if the IMF just up and called in its debts

[Dutch01]

 

I think that a very key point here is that McGuinty/Wynne ran up more debt for just Ontario than Harper did for the entire country. And they did that with higher taxes and higher transfer payments from the federal government.

 

Harper ran up debt, but he did it with lower taxes and without cutting transfers to the province (Chretien cut federal health and social transfers by 34%).

I agree only to a point. That's like arguing do you want to burn the house down with 20 gallons of gas or 30 gallons. Either way the house is burned down!

 

I feel like I am being painted as a Liberal here, but all I have really said is that neither Liberal nor PC have done a good job, but I will judge people on what they do, not what they haven't done yet.

 

To summarize:

 

1) Harper = bad

2) Wynne = real bad

3) Trudeau = don't know yet

Edited March 1, 2016 by Dutch01

[Big Cliff]

I don't know if to cry or laugh at some of these posts. I do know that we're in trouble when politicians talk about millions and billions of dollars like it's pocket change.

Ya, they are actually spending it like it isn't even their money, go figure!

[John Bacon]

Wynne is awful, there is no question. She is probably the worst politician I can remember in my lifetime. But the notion that the PC party is any better with money is not accurate.

 

Between 2006 and 2015 Steve added $127.02 BILLION dollars (in 2011 dollars) to the national debt, and yet I hear guys on here saying our grandkids will be paying for Wynne's debt. Clearly, they have both run up a bill that we can't afford, yet some people here bought the con propaganda.

 

 

This is from a post I made on a previous thread:

 

My question for you is this: If every PM, PC or Liberal, adds to the debt every year as proven above, how can you argue that it is the Liberals who will bankrupt this country?

 

The way I see it, Canadians, will ALWAYS, ALWAYS get screwed by our politicians, because they sell a narrative of "us versus them" to low information voters who buy in without checking facts.

 

Full disclosure: I voted PC provincially and Liberal federally in the last election, in the interest of transparency.

 

There is a math error in your source data. $29 billion in 82/83 dollars does not translate into $28.88 billion in 2011 dollars. This adds ~$40 to Trudeau's final term (by averaging the conversion rates for the years before and after I estimate that the 2011 equivalent is $70.38 billion for 82/83).

 

I also think there are issues with the allocation of the deficits. Here is a quote from the site:

"Select a prime minister's name to highlight figures from his time in office. John Turner and Kim Campbell each served for less than one fiscal year; data for their tenures is included as part of their predecessors' terms."

 

Joe Clark was also Prime for less than a fiscal year and did not pass a budget. The deficit that has been assigned to him should be assigned to Trudeau.

 

I also think they have misallocated deficits for years in which a Prime Minister started in the middle of a fical year. They have assigned the deficits to the incoming Prime Minister; in my opinion it should be assigned to the outgoing Prime Minister because that's who would have passed the budget for the year. Based on this logic $77.88 billion of Mulroney's dept should be assigned to Trudeau; and $56.60 billion of Chretien's debt should be assigned to Mulroney. The revised figures would be:

 

Trudeau: $415.38 billion

Mulroney: $443.52 billion

Chretein: $51.38 billion

 

At first glance Mulroney looks pretty bad; but if interest on inherited debt was removed, I think he would look much better than Trudeau.

[netminder]

Only thing I can say is the best time to spend is while in a recession. If past history repeats the economy WILL rebound. If someone suggested running up a deficit while the economy was booming they'd be in for an awful surprise, which is what I think happened here in Ontario. As quickly as things can look up they'll end up going the other way. Even an entry level economist can make numbers dance to whatever drum they feel. If TD wants to tell us we're heading for collapse they'll have one of their economists tell us we're headed for collapse. If a bank wants it's people to spend money they'll put out a report that everything is peachy and everyone should spend like drunken sailors. I think TD is tired of low interest rates and people hording money.

[Dutch01]

 

There is a math error in your source data. $29 billion in 82/83 dollars does not translate into $28.88 billion in 2011 dollars. This adds ~$40 to Trudeau's final term (by averaging the conversion rates for the years before and after I estimate that the 2011 equivalent is $70.38 billion for 82/83).

 

I also think there are issues with the allocation of the deficits. Here is a quote from the site:

"Select a prime minister's name to highlight figures from his time in office. John Turner and Kim Campbell each served for less than one fiscal year; data for their tenures is included as part of their predecessors' terms."

 

Joe Clark was also Prime for less than a fiscal year and did not pass a budget. The deficit that has been assigned to him should be assigned to Trudeau.

 

I also think they have misallocated deficits for years in which a Prime Minister started in the middle of a fical year. They have assigned the deficits to the incoming Prime Minister; in my opinion it should be assigned to the outgoing Prime Minister because that's who would have passed the budget for the year. Based on this logic $77.88 billion of Mulroney's dept should be assigned to Trudeau; and $56.60 billion of Chretien's debt should be assigned to Mulroney. The revised figures would be:

 

Trudeau: $415.38 billion

Mulroney: $443.52 billion

Chretein: $51.38 billion

 

At first glance Mulroney looks pretty bad; but if interest on inherited debt was removed, I think he would look much better than Trudeau.

I'm no economist, but I'm willing to take your figures at face value because they support my point. The debt making machine marches on no matter whose face we put on it. I suspect Trudeau will end up being the same but I can't condemn the man until he's actually done something to condemn. Edited March 1, 2016 by Dutch01

[jimmer]

I wish I could get away with this at work and keep operating while running a deficit.