Nipfisher Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 O.k, just learned some disturbing news. I have been well aware that Nipissing First Nation placed a ban on gill-netting during the spawn "spring spawn netting moratorium that has been in place for several years will continue and is already scheduled for April 1 through May 10". There were still offenders caught netting during the spawn last year. However, I was not aware that they continue to allow spearing during the spawn. There is a limit of 20 fish per boat PER DAY and that is just a recent ammendment. They recently added no night spearing to the regulations as well. Here is the link to the Nipissing First Nation Resources Newsletter for Spring 2012. NFN Spring 2012 Now, let me make this clear. I am not calling out NFN for netting and spearing as I feel they have that right. I am dumbfounded by the quota #s for such a fragile fishery and to permit the NFN fisherman to spear 20 spawning walleye per day. More then 40 days of spearing during the spawn could ammount to 800 walleye per fisherman. Here is a recent article from the North Bay Nugget with quotes from Clayton Goulais (Crosshairs) whom I have had several good conversations with. He is an enforcement officer with NFN. Walleye spawn beginning on Lake Nipissing Admin on Apr 13, 2012 in Local News | 0 comments By DAVE DALE The Nugget - The walleye in Lake Nipissing have started moving into spawning grounds. And Nipissing First Nation is bolstering its monitoring program to enforce the community’s moratorium on gill netting which began April 1 and continues until May 10. “It’s just, just starting and there’s not much activity going on,” Clayton Goulais, Nipissing FN’s resource management enforcement officer, said Thursday morning. Goulais said six monitors will be scouting the lake and boat launches on-and-off reserve to cut down on unauthorized commercial harvesting. Other authority agencies will also be patrolling the lake to enforce water safety laws. Nipissing FN revised its resource management law last year after not meeting a reduced harvest quota twice and fall walleye index netting studies showed a sharp decline in spawning age fish. Spearing is now being restricted to 20 walleye per boat and banned after midnight. Goulais said he knows three people who have gone out spearing and each only harvested four or five walleye, illustrating the early stage of the spawn. “The water is still cold,” he said, adding that rain early this week probably warmed up the creeks and turned on the smelt run, with warmer weather and rain possibly doing the same for walleye. He said a person can usually tell which walleye are females and “conservation-minded” spear harvesters try to focus on males. Goulais said the public can call him at 705-498-3823 if they want to report gill netting activity. Nipissing FN organized a Lake Nipissing Summit April 3-4 and the presentations were recently posted to thewww.lakenipissingsummit.ca website. A plan to study and address environmental and fishery issues is expected to come after stakeholders review the input of summit participants. I know this debate opens a can of worms every time so lets stay on track with this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike rousseau Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 they fill coolers every night in my area spearing walleye... and thats their "right" i guess...unethical...i would say so... not all take advantage... one of my best friends is first nations... and hes disgusted by this practice... i have a question for those who know... are first nations allowed to spear spawning walleye off of their reservation areas...? cause where i live they spear a river that is way outside their reservations boundaries...but nobody does anything...mnr watches them do it all the time... and just so there is no confusion... im ok with first nations not having to follow the same seasons and catch limits as the rest of north america.... as ridiculous as that is...as long as its with a rod and hook... this whole spearing em while they are spawning is a disgusting practice and should be stopped...or at least a reasonable possession limit put in place...i understand this is how some get their fish for the year... but really....how many walleye can one family eat? i dont mean any offense to anybody...im just concerned about how much damage is done by this spearing every year.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecmilley Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 i am still trying to figure why there is two sets of rights for canadians, one set for natives and one for everyone else, don't agree with it at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headhunter Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Well, at least Nip is still beautiful area to spend some time... not necessarily fishing.... HH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 I've had this debate with many people over the years. First off, let me say, all my children and my girlfriend are first nations. It is lawfully their right to harvest fish in a reasonable manner when they chose. But, My kids still fish within the seasons just like me. I just feel better about doing it that way, and letting the fish spawn when it's their time to spawn, I enjoy my fishery very much, and look forward to doing so for the rest of my days, as well as theirs. I fish with many other natives, and they also follow the regulations. I very seldom see anyone in my local abusing the resource. Two times per year, I see one net get set for two days. It gets pulled out ever few hours, and the fish are filleted. The reserve hold a fish fry for the youth and the elders of the reservation. I'm totally fine with that, because IMO it's within reason, and not done in a spawning time. In fact, I've even participated as a volunteer to cook for the youth/elders. As far as the rights that are "handed" to first nations, I don't necessarily agree with it, but I don't agree with how many of the Natives have been treated either. But, if it's the law, I respect that. And there are certain things I myself will take advantage of, like free dental and free schooling for my children. All in all, I'd like to see things equal for all CANADIANS. But it is a complex situation... MM, it is my understanding that the right to harvest is within the reservation boundries that are local to that reserve/band. That was how it was explained to me by a CO. So one band member cannot harvest above normal limits while in another reserve boundry, or totally outside of a treaty area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 and I've never even heard of anyone spearing walleye???? I'm not even sure how I feel about that? One thing I know MM, is that first nations do have laws to follow as well, but in some areas are different then others, so it's tough to comment on without knowing for sure. But, I think MNR is hesitant in dealing with First Nations when it comes to hunting and fishing, because it's a slippery slope. Also, it might not even be that, it might be that even the CO's are unsure of what the actual laws are in these regards (sounds silly I know, but Native laws can be incredibly confusing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 It's those that have the "rights" but not the "reason" that are the problem. I totally agree Sinclair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike rousseau Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 MM, it is my understanding that the right to harvest is within the reservation boundries that are local to that reserve/band. That was how it was explained to me by a CO. So one band member cannot harvest above normal limits while in another reserve boundry, or totally outside of a treaty area. thats what i thought as well... but it seems everyone walks on eggshells in fear of mass protests shutting down the local economy... last issue in my area was border officers(office was on reservation land) carrying firearms... the first nations people protested this and shut down the bridge rerouting thousands of vehicles through other border crossings...devastated local businesses for quite some time...couple months if i remember right... and cost TAXPAYERS loads of money due to the fact that they had to abandon the border office and build a new site off of the reservation... all because the criminals(the few giving others a bad wrap) running tobacco products across the bridge didnt want to get shot at... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike rousseau Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 and I've never even heard of anyone spearing walleye???? I'm not even sure how I feel about that? yup...they go at night with flashlights... a spear...and a cooler... they go right to the gravel bed that was paid for with fishing license dollars to help the walleye spawn better...but in the end it concentrated numbers making it easier to spear... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 thats what i thought as well... but it seems everyone walks on eggshells in fear of mass protests shutting down the local economy... last issue in my area was border officers(office was on reservation land) carrying firearms... the first nations people protested this and shut down the bridge rerouting thousands of vehicles through other border crossings...devastated local businesses for quite some time...couple months if i remember right... and cost TAXPAYERS loads of money due to the fact that they had to abandon the border office and build a new site off of the reservation... all because the criminals(the few giving others a bad wrap) running tobacco products across the bridge didnt want to get shot at... I've witnessed similar issues near my home as well on another reservation. Just last year actually. The highway runs through a reserve, and the reserve protested something(can't remember what?) so they put up a road toll right in the middle of the highway on after a sharp corner and just before the Causway bridge. It was very dangerous too. The truckers etc really didn't like it, and it let to quite the racial battle between hat reserve and my hometown. Alot of racism on both parts and things got ugly, alot of people showed their true colors. Shorlty after, it was taken down. I can't recall how the disput was resolved??? yup...they go at night with flashlights... a spear...and a cooler... they go right to the gravel bed that was paid for with fishing license dollars to help the walleye spawn better...but in the end it concentrated numbers making it easier to spear... Yeah, see that's not acceptable IMO. I guess things are different in your area for the reservations/band members. In my area those things just don't really happen too often. Even the band members would be putting a stop to that really quick where I'm from. Then again, we do have a few reserves in the area that I'd imagine things like that happen in. Ask Aaron Shirley if he remembers getting golf balls hit at him in NW Bay while trying to film his fishing show, lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cram Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 I think they absolutely have the right to do it. Pretty sure they would have been picking up walleye on the spawn when europeans came here. But, I also think it's very short-sighted of them if they want to preserve a fishery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 I think they absolutely have the right to do it. Pretty sure they would have been picking up walleye on the spawn when europeans came here. But, I also think it's very short-sighted of them if they want to preserve a fishery. Good point, but the Natives of old were incredibly smart when it comes to nature/harvesting. I've seen fashioned dip nets that were used along time ago, so they could release spawning females. Can't do that with a spear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nipfisher Posted April 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) My concern and reason for posting this is from all reports including NFN the walleye index counts are down 3 straight years now. NFN has lowered their netting quotas and still can't reach their # of 60,000 tonnes (from 90,000). SO, why target spawning walleye with nets or spears? Like my o.p. 1 native fisherman can spear 20 walleye per day from April 1- May 10. That is more then 40 days of spearing and potential harvest could be 800 walleye. I believe there are only about 18 registered comercial fisherman within NFN but this srearing right is given to all with status. I agree with many posters here and not all natives use their rights to harvest fish as/when needed, but if even 1 native netted 200 spawning walleye (5 per day x 40 days) it would be (is) devistating to the fishery. Gee, I woneder why they can't meet their netting quotas??????????? What happens on May 11th? What about walleye that were late to spawn? Edited April 16, 2012 by Nipfisher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 My concern and reason for posting this is from all reports including NFN the walleye index counts are down 3 straight years now. NFN has lowered their netting quotas and still can't reach their # of 60,000 tonnes (from 90,000). SO, why target spawning walleye with nets or spears? Like my o.p. 1 native fisherman can spear 20 walleye per day from April 1- May 10. That is more then 40 days of spearing and potential harvest could be 800 walleye. I believe there are only about 18 registered comercial fisherman within NFN but this srearing right is given to all with status. I agree with many posters here and not all natives use their rights to harvest fish as/when needed, but if even 1 native netted 200 spawning walleye (5 per day x 40 days) it would be (is) devistating to the fishery. Gee, I woneder why they can't meet their netting quotas??????????? Yeah, thats exactly it. I can totally understand where your coming from. My guess would be a lack of knowledge on the subject, because, well obviously this is just an ignorant way to do things, it makes no sense at all. The quotas are totally messed up too, and lawfully should be re-written IMO. 20 fish per day is obsurd, even with 10 children in a household that is too much. And the quotas should incorperate no fishing during the spawn, or at the very least the release of all females during the spawn. There is 8 people in my household, we have a big family. We keep enough fish for a few meals per year (probably anywhere between 4-10 limits per year), but it takes 4 fish, 4 potatoes and a bag of veggies to feed are whole household for an evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nipfisher Posted April 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) The quotas are totally messed up too, and lawfully should be re-written IMO. 20 fish per day is obsurd, even with 10 children in a household that is too much. And the quotas should incorperate no fishing during the spawn, or at the very least the release of all females during the spawn. He said a person can usually tell which walleye are females and “conservation-minded” spear harvesters try to focus on males. The quote in the article indicates that the spearers can target males not the females but how many are conservation-minded? Edited April 16, 2012 by Nipfisher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headhunter Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Not to mention the collateral damage caused by netting Nip… but I guess that the more things change, the more they stay the same… I would like to hear from Crossfire on this though... he has shown a willingness to discuss this issue in the past and I hope he is willing to do so again... as long as we here remain respectful...toward him. HH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Bob Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 and I've never even heard of anyone spearing walleye???? I'm not even sure how I feel about that? This was a big issue in the State of Wisconsin a few years ago....I really don't know how it ended but here's what I remember reading.. Native Americans were spearing walleyes during the spawn...they cited treaties from a hundred years ago or more that guaranteed them that right as this was their traditional way to harvest these fish at this time of the year...OK....but they were using modern equipment/methods to do it....they were spearing at night using metal three prong pitch fork spears while wearing high powered head lamps to spot the fish and using electric trolling motors to move about....nothing traditional in this kind of fishing even with the most liberal minded person..... I know many sportsmen clubs were up in arms there but I never heard how this was resolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 He said a person can usually tell which walleye are females and "conservation-minded" spear harvesters try to focus on males. The quote in the article indicates that the spearers can target males not the females but how many are conservation-minded? Yeah, I seen that. Don't believe it for one second though. If you can see the fish, the only way to "guess" which are females would be size, and it would be exactly that, a guess. Maybe I'm wrong, but I've never met one person that could decipher the difference while the fish is in the water. I certainly could'nt do it, thats for sure. I just can't wrap my head around spearing the fish??? If I had to harvest solely for the purpose of feeding my family, I'd be looking at the best method available not only for catching the fish, but also maintaining the fishery. But anyhow, if they choose this method, I'd be willing to bet the majority are not conservative minded. If they were conservative minded, would they not look at a more effective method? Thats just my train of though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarg Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Its just the way it is, and there is no one with the political will to change it, ill accept they have the right when they admit that their concern for the environment is just propaganda, a sham, I care more about the environment then most natives do, I care more about conservation then most natives do. Im tired of the 'noble savage' Bull, and most natives I know would tell you the same, but those in charge are playing us with this Bull, its insulting to their own people, they are no different than I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) Its just the way it is, and there is no one with the political will to change it, ill accept they have the right when they admit that their concern for the environment is just propaganda, a sham, I care more about the environment then most natives do, I care more about conservation then most natives do. Im tired of the 'noble savage' Bull, and most natives I know would tell you the same, but those in charge are playing us with this Bull, its insulting to their own people, they are no different than I am. I'd say that's off topic. This isn't a race issue IMO. It's ignorance and the effect it will have on the fishery. Many people of all races and colors overharvest fish worldwide, legally and illegally. Edited April 16, 2012 by manitoubass2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Keep it respectful please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nipfisher Posted April 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Keep it respectful please. Roy, I understand this is a touchy subject. I had no intentions of making this about race or politics. Just frustreated with the declining walleye #s being reported but then they target the spawning walleye? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 Sure it is. A white guy and a native are wading through spawning walleyes with pitch forks and headlamps when a conservation officer shows up... How does the night end? Thats a lawful issue, not a race issue. The thread is about the fishery and overharvesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 But it is, since the laws differ depending on race. And by that thought process, everything is correlated to race. The rights that Native Americans have were given to them by the Canadian Government. So whether or not you accept it, it's a issue with how the fishery is being handled by OUR Canadian government. I get what your saying, but thats an issue you should take up with the correct channels. and where I live, given the example you gave, both guys are in jail and facing charges for resource abuse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillM Posted April 16, 2012 Report Share Posted April 16, 2012 They've been spearing walleyes in the spring forever. Isn't the walleye population on Nipissing actually on the upswing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now