Anyone know why homeless people............

[Nipfisher]

 

For the record, I don't fault wsb for his comments. Sometimes it's outta context, or ignorance, moreso than just flat out inhumanity.

 

 

 

Great responces on both posts manitoubass2. Skip your sister did some great work.

 

 

I think we need to allow WSB to respond in this thread before we bash him anymore. I believe his question/comment may have been been poorly conveyed. I don't believe he is making fun of homeless people. Rather asking why they are standing outside in the cold? Seems like a reasonable question to ask. Been about 5-6 different answers given and they all may be wrong?

[[email protected]]

Thanks Onthefly and mercman, much appreciated.

 

That awesome work your sister did there skipper (sorry for the loss as well). Many more people need to help in similar fashion IMO.

 

For the record, I don't fault wsb for his comments. Sometimes it's outta context, or ignorance, moreso than just flat out inhumanity.

 

Lots of homeless people just fall victim to bad circumstances beyond their control. And once your outta your house, it's really tough to recover. There is a serious lack of help to regain your life. It's almost impossible to retain your job, or find a job. and if you do, it's still a real struggle to continue that job when your half starved, stressed out, emotional, looking after your kids, wondering where to stay etc. All the while people are looking down on you, and insisting drugs or alcohol is what got you where you are.

 

Just imagine the mental strain? I would imagine it wouldn't take long for ones mental stability to deteriorate. I like to have a few drinks myself, when I think I'm stressed out, I gotta imagine it's sounds even better for a homeless person? A few hours away from the stress. Then in turn, that too may deteriorate your mental ability.

 

Anyhow, I just feel extreme compassion for my fellow man, and the hard times that can fall on any one of us.

 

Imagine if we responded the same way to fellow OFC members who have been diagnosed with cancer???

 

Let's just all help each other out, everyone deserves a good life or the help needed to achieve that...

 

 

One of the best posts I've read on this site, Period.

 

We all/most get so wrapped up in our own lives, and forget that others may not have EVER had the opportunities we have been fortunate to have.

 

Imagine if you never had the opportunity to get a higher education, or one at all.

 

What if your parents were drug addled, or had mental issues themselves, and you were never given a shot right from the start? Sometimes cicumstances are beyond our control.

 

Please don't respond with "get a job", as that is a very narrow minded way of thinking, and very much oversimplifying an issue of which you probably have no experience, be thankful for that.

 

Happy New Year to all, and lets try to be better humans this year, we all benefit.

[Dozer]

Mental issues, drugs / alcohol to numb the pain, etc. etc.

 

I persoanlly don't have much experience with homeless people, but from what I hear, 99% can clean up and do better, but choose not too. The 1% REALLY have had some serious issues that have made them homeless, and because of the "homelessness" they've become someone that cannnot be transformed into an everyday average citizen. This is what my friends who are street level cops tell me, its their experience, not mine.

 

These people become accustomed to a life of being homeless and thats good enough for them, in the process of being homeless, they start deteriorating and get worse and worse, beyond repair. Mix drugs and alcohol, lack of support ( not sure ), confidence, and BAM, you're spending the rest of your life on the street.

 

I know it sounds really nasty, and a lot of you will think I'm rude, I'm sorry, but I can't told that these people have it so hard, blah blah blah, no way! LIfe's a bugger, sure, not everyone has it easy and not everyone can deal with problems, but really, if stuff really hits the fan, you loose your house for instance, or whatever, and you don't have any friends to help out and support you, then there's somethng wrong with you from the start. When my friends parents both died when he was young, he starved, had no family to take him, but he realized, damn thats the way things are, life really dealt me a crap hand, and if I don't do something now, I'm screwed. He didn't give up.

 

Look at those punk rocker type skids who live on the streets, washing your windows in the summer, most of them are fully functioning young individuals, homeless, why not get a real job? Life on the street is APPEALING to these clowns. I told one of them not to clean my windsheild, he proceeded to, and when I didn't give him anything, he lifted up my wiper blade arms, lol. Errrrrr.

 

 

I used to be nice and throw money to 'em until a few years back, this really crusty older dude used to beg for change outside of a restaurant for food, people would throw him change, some people would leave doggie bags from their dinners they didn't finish, I mean, you are asking for money for food right? When he'd collect enough change, he'd walk off and leave the food behind. See him drinking in the alley.

 

My dad was homeless when he came to Canada, he had very little money, no place to stay, no job, no friends, picked up pretty damn well.

 

But again, everyones different, and there are people who are genuinely homeless, that life just wasn't very fair too, and I feel VERY sad for them. And I do respect people who take time out of their own lives to help others, kudos to them.

 

But not every homeless person is homeless because they truely had bad experiences, I beleive most of them became homeless and didn't care to do anything about it, or during the time they were homeless, just got comfortable with that lifestyle. Wait, thats the same thing :/

 

Sorry if I offended anyone.

[Gerritt]

Mental issues, drugs / alcohol to numb the pain, etc. etc.

 

I persoanlly don't have much experience with homeless people, but from what I hear, 99% can clean up and do better, but choose not too. The 1% REALLY have had some serious issues that have made them homeless, and because of the "homelessness" they've become someone that cannnot be transformed into an everyday average citizen. This is what my friends who are street level cops tell me, its their experience, not mine.

 

These people become accustomed to a life of being homeless and thats good enough for them, in the process of being homeless, they start deteriorating and get worse and worse, beyond repair. Mix drugs and alcohol, lack of support ( not sure ), confidence, and BAM, you're spending the rest of your life on the street.

 

I know it sounds really nasty, and a lot of you will think I'm rude, I'm sorry, but I can't told that these people have it so hard, blah blah blah, no way! LIfe's a bugger, sure, not everyone has it easy and not everyone can deal with problems, but really, if stuff really hits the fan, you loose your house for instance, or whatever, and you don't have any friends to help out and support you, then there's somethng wrong with you from the start. When my friends parents both died when he was young, he starved, had no family to take him, but he realized, damn thats the way things are, life really dealt me a crap hand, and if I don't do something now, I'm screwed. He didn't give up.

 

Look at those punk rocker type skids who live on the streets, washing your windows in the summer, most of them are fully functioning young individuals, homeless, why not get a real job? Life on the street is APPEALING to these clowns. I told one of them not to clean my windsheild, he proceeded to, and when I didn't give him anything, he lifted up my wiper blade arms, lol. Errrrrr.

 

 

I used to be nice and throw money to 'em until a few years back, this really crusty older dude used to beg for change outside of a restaurant for food, people would throw him change, some people would leave doggie bags from their dinners they didn't finish, I mean, you are asking for money for food right? When he'd collect enough change, he'd walk off and leave the food behind. See him drinking in the alley.

 

My dad was homeless when he came to Canada, he had very little money, no place to stay, no job, no friends, picked up pretty damn well.

 

But again, everyones different, and there are people who are genuinely homeless, that life just wasn't very fair too, and I feel VERY sad for them. And I do respect people who take time out of their own lives to help others, kudos to them.

 

But not every homeless person is homeless because they truely had bad experiences, I beleive most of them became homeless and didn't care to do anything about it, or during the time they were homeless, just got comfortable with that lifestyle. Wait, thats the same thing :/

 

Sorry if I offended anyone.

 

I dont think I ever recall someone contradicting themselves in such a manner. Either way... you have a very ignorant view on a subject you know very little about.

 

G

[rocheleauc]

Stand OUTSIDE a Homeless Shelter when it's -28c with the WINDCHILL factor :dunno:

And don't go inside where it's nice and warm??

 

 

 

Windshield factor does exist....btw

 

 

From my work experience (I deal with homeless on a regular basis) and know a few people that work in shelters, I've learned a few things over the years.

 

Homeless shelters aren't pleasant places. A lot of them are infested with bedbugs and other things like scabies etc. A lot of these people are extremely sick and disease spreads easily. Sure some of them will go there to eat, but rather would brave the cold instead of sleeping there over night. In a lot of these places they will get robbed by others, including some of the shelter staff.

 

One homeless guy I have consistently ran into for the past few years says a shelter is the last place you will find him....this coming from someone with nothing was kind of shocking at first, until I learned more about these places. My friends that work at the shelters confirmed all of this stuff I've heard. It was a real eye opener.

 

Just my $.02

Edited January 4, 2012 by CJR

[[email protected]]

"I persoanlly don't have much experience with homeless people", but I'll continue to talk out of my

 

 

Fixed your post.

 

 

"I know it sounds really nasty, and a lot of you will think I'm rude"

 

 

At least you got one thing right in your post.

 

Grow up

 

 

Quoting Dozer, damn phone.

Edited January 4, 2012 by frenchriverkid

[Guest ThisPlaceSucks]

i'd report dozer's stupid post, but i'd prefer it to remain to show how ignorant he is. i know early in the thread i sort of joked that they were smokers, but that was because smokers and ice fisherman are the only two groups foolish enough to just stand around in the cold.

 

 

you know nothing about mental illness, addiction, or the homeless. you should read a book.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Dr. Salvelinus

[Skipper D]

How can it happen to people , heres a little insight for those who may wonder . First your born to parents who are a bit off if you know what i mean , then a few years later while you are still under six years old the athority step in and remove you from your parents and family .......ding two , then you get raise by some people who just don't care , ding three , if your lucky you get raised by nice people , then you go thru school as the kid with no parents ...ding four , too young to under stand why this is happening to you , you shut the world around you out ..... ging 5 , your head is messed up so you can't learn like every one else .. ding 6 need i go on , but it go's on thru your hole life ..ding 7 ,8 , 9,10 , either you get smart and pull your self back together with the help of some good people , and where do you find those ???????? , AND IF YOUR NOT LUCKY , you end up at the bottom on the street . I hope i said some thing here that answers how some people get to be where they get . I an cool ...... if your cool .

[Dozer]

I dont think I ever recall someone contradicting themselves in such a manner. Either way... you have a very ignorant view on a subject you know very little about.

 

G

 

Sorry Gerritt if I had contradicted myself, I didn't mean for that. Thought my idea of why these people are homeless was clear.

[Grimace]

Michigan is a mess. With all the job loss and foreclosures the count of homeless students attending school has jumped 40 percent to 31000 students. It is exploding.

 

"About 100,000 Michigan residents -- roughly the population of Livonia -- were homeless at some point in 2010. The notion that they are mostly addicted single males is a destructive myth. In actuality, 53% are children and families. The average age of a homeless child is 7." Sally Harrison - Director of rental assistance and homeless solutions Michigan State Housing Development Authority

 

 

 

http://www.freep.com/article/20111218/NEWS06/112180464

[Dozer]

Look guys, I"m saying that there atually are people who HAVE HAD it so bad that they genuinely couldn't do anything about, but from what I'm told most of them can clean up but choose not too. Ahh, now I regret posting

[limeyangler]

Mental issues, drugs / alcohol to numb the pain, etc. etc.

 

I persoanlly don't have much experience with homeless people, but from what I hear, 99% can clean up and do better, but choose not too. The 1% REALLY have had some serious issues that have made them homeless, and because of the "homelessness" they've become someone that cannnot be transformed into an everyday average citizen. This is what my friends who are street level cops tell me, its their experience, not mine.

 

These people become accustomed to a life of being homeless and thats good enough for them, in the process of being homeless, they start deteriorating and get worse and worse, beyond repair. Mix drugs and alcohol, lack of support ( not sure ), confidence, and BAM, you're spending the rest of your life on the street.

 

I know it sounds really nasty, and a lot of you will think I'm rude, I'm sorry, but I can't told that these people have it so hard, blah blah blah, no way! LIfe's a bugger, sure, not everyone has it easy and not everyone can deal with problems, but really, if stuff really hits the fan, you loose your house for instance, or whatever, and you don't have any friends to help out and support you, then there's somethng wrong with you from the start. When my friends parents both died when he was young, he starved, had no family to take him, but he realized, damn thats the way things are, life really dealt me a crap hand, and if I don't do something now, I'm screwed. He didn't give up.

 

Look at those punk rocker type skids who live on the streets, washing your windows in the summer, most of them are fully functioning young individuals, homeless, why not get a real job? Life on the street is APPEALING to these clowns. I told one of them not to clean my windsheild, he proceeded to, and when I didn't give him anything, he lifted up my wiper blade arms, lol. Errrrrr.

 

 

I used to be nice and throw money to 'em until a few years back, this really crusty older dude used to beg for change outside of a restaurant for food, people would throw him change, some people would leave doggie bags from their dinners they didn't finish, I mean, you are asking for money for food right? When he'd collect enough change, he'd walk off and leave the food behind. See him drinking in the alley.

 

My dad was homeless when he came to Canada, he had very little money, no place to stay, no job, no friends, picked up pretty damn well.

 

But again, everyones different, and there are people who are genuinely homeless, that life just wasn't very fair too, and I feel VERY sad for them. And I do respect people who take time out of their own lives to help others, kudos to them.

 

But not every homeless person is homeless because they truely had bad experiences, I beleive most of them became homeless and didn't care to do anything about it, or during the time they were homeless, just got comfortable with that lifestyle. Wait, thats the same thing :/

 

Sorry if I offended anyone.

 

 

WHAT'S THAT NOISE....OH....ITS MY BLOOD BOILING!

 

 

The sad thing is i have heard some ridiculous things on this site over the years and am pretty sure you are not the only member on here who shares this misguided and frankly PLAIN IGNORANT view.

 

 

How do i claim not to be ignorant on this topic?

 

Years as a homeless person myself, 5 years working for the probation service in England, 6 years working for a Housing Association ( a non profit housing organisation for homeless) a friggin sociology degree and a further 4 years working within the addictions field....for God sake...just google "what percentage of homeless people have a mental illness or addiction" or both.

[[email protected]]

Look guys, I"m saying that there atually are people who HAVE HAD it so bad that they genuinely couldn't do anything about, but from what I'm told most of them can clean up but choose not too. Ahh, now I regret posting

 

 

 

Have you ever thought about volunteering at a shelter ?

 

1. It's good for your soul to help others in need.

2. You won't go by "what you hear", you'll go by what you've experienced.

 

Seriously, consider it. You will be a better person for it.

[Grimace]

Look guys, I"m saying that there atually are people who HAVE HAD it so bad that they genuinely couldn't do anything about, but from what I'm told most of them can clean up but choose not too. Ahh, now I regret posting

 

 

From what you are told by who? I mean, they must be a really good source if you are taking their word as truth and trust what they have told you to the point that you would take that argument to an open discussion.

[Nipfisher]

I saw alot in almost 10 years working for Children's Aid. Most of the "difficult" things I have seen are related to mental health. The medical community will rarely diagnose mental illness in a person under 18. By then some are on a bad road that has little hope to offer. Many are parents by that age. It often becomes further complicated by addictions.

[Skipper D]

Aw ...... its a tough old world for some and not so for others , Its a big place and most of us will never get to know the other guy , its a case where some of us don't want to and some of us do , it realy does'nt matter but then it does matter , one things for sure , it i'll never change , what will be will be . I'd like to say this was an interesting thread and we should leave it at that till the next time it comes up . I hope every one who took part injoyed them selves . Good night all you excellent debaiter , glad to know you's all .

[manitoubass2]

So far we've had a few OFC members chime in that were either homeless or in a similar situation. A very good testament to bad things happening to good people, or, OFC is full of crack heads, get a job people!???

 

Kinda sad to see some of these ignorant posts, kinda uplifting to see some educated input and discussion by others.

 

Some people really need to challenge their own ignorance in order to improve who they are. Enough people do that, and maybe we'll start seeing some improvements in our incredibly sick society.

 

 

 

[Gerritt]

Aw ...... its a tough old world for some and not so for others , Its a big place and most of us will never get to know the other guy , its a case where some of us don't want to and some of us do , it realy does'nt matter but then it does matter , one things for sure , it i'll never change , what will be will be . I'd like to say this was an interesting thread and we should leave it at that till the next time it comes up . I hope every one who took part injoyed them selves . Good night all you excellent debaiter , glad to know you's all .

 

 

Had a couple?

[Gerritt]

I will not go into detail... but if it were not for the help of a good friend and mentor... I could quite possibly be homeless right now.... Some bad choices, some bad luck and a messed up family... things can change in a hurry..

 

G.

[Skipper D]

So far we've had a few OFC members chime in that were either homeless or in a similar situation. A very good testament to bad things happening to good people, or, OFC is full of crack heads, get a job people!???

 

Kinda sad to see some of these ignorant posts, kinda uplifting to see some educated input and discussion by others.

 

Some people really need to challenge their own ignorance in order to improve who they are. Enough people do that, and maybe we'll start seeing some improvements in our incredibly sick society.

 

 

 

 

 

x 2..............

[Skipper D]

Had a couple?

 

 

NEVER TOUCH THE STUFF . JUST SCARED A LITTLE AND DOING THE BEST I CAN .....LOL

Edited January 4, 2012 by Skipper " D "

[Dozer]

People who have worked with homeless on a steady basis over the years, not from helping them out in shelters, but from interacting with them and getting to know them over the years. And yes, I would take them as a good source, their experiences made them come to these conclusions and they beleive that a lot of them can change. They're telling me a lot of these people become homeless, and deteriorate ( or get comforatble ) within that lifestyle. They're addicts and the addiction takes over. As the years pass by, they start becoming mentally ill, and get worse and worse.

[manitoubass2]

Another thing to consider when discussing the homeless/addictions aspect of things, there is always a story to each case. Some people are addicts before becoming homeless, for some that may in fact what caused their plummet, many I'm sure become addicts after the fact as a coping mechanism, and so on and so forth. This is where the whole categorical stereotype kind of irks me.

 

Just keep an open mind here for a sec...

 

Everyone has their vices, EVERYONE! Human behavior has alot to do with our neuro anotomy and our chemical makeup. Everything you do in a day is strongly correlated with how your chemical makeup reacts to the things you are doing, the risk/reward. Alcoholics may experience the same thing neurologically with drinking that another experiences while smoking a cigarette, or having a cup of coffee for that matter. It's all intertwined, you just normally don't realize it...

 

Now, imagine yourself homeless and on the streets of Toronto. Frustrated because you can't find a job, have no money or place to sleep and your hungry. It all sounds overwhelming, because it is, but thats not the point here. The point is, what is now your risk/reward, and stimulus for your neurotransmitters???? There really aren't any, are there? This is in large part, why I think the homeless are far more susceptible to addictions and or mental issues (their creating their risk/reward).

 

Whether anyone wants to admit it, we live to be stimulated. What happens when that is taken away???

Edited January 4, 2012 by manitoubass2

[Dozer]

Like I've stated in my original post, I feel very sorry for those people who really had it bad are are genuinely homeless because thats how life turned out for them. I do not feel sorry for those who have become homeless as a result of them becoming addicted to drugs/alcohol, or their bad decisions and as a result are homeless. I fought back an addiction myself years ago, if hadn't of made the right choices, who knows where I'd be. Could of spiralled out of control for sure.

 

Drop by the shelter in my neighbourhood, you could buy anything you want, anytime. And the police are there often. The city has really tainted my mind.

 

And I agree with Skip, we should move on until it comes up again.

[Big Cliff]

The American Society of Addiction Medicine begins their definition of addiction by describing it as "a primary, chronic disease of brain reward, motivation, memory and related circuitry".

 

I very much doubt that any of these people got up one morning and said "I think I'll go out and get myself addicted to something"! Or, I think I'll choose to live in a cardboard box over a grate and sleep on the streets instead of in a nice warm bed with clean sheets and hot food". Their thinking isn't rational compaired to what you seem to consider "normal".

 

There are many reasons that a person can fall into the traps that lead to them living on the street and once there the climb back up the ladder to what you would consider "normal" can be nearly impossible.

 

Try and get social assistance when you don't have an address, little or no identification, and you have to take drugs or alcohol just to "feel normal" or numb the feeling that you aren't "normal".

 

Compound that with possible mental issues or phobias (I know it is a big word, google it, you might learn something if you choose to).

 

As I see it, there are two important things you still have to learn in life:

 

Number 1: Before you judge someone, walk a mile in their shoes!

 

Number 2: A man has a right to look down on someone only when he is helping him to get up!