Crestliner Recall

[Radnine]

To those affected by the Crestliner recall, here is a note that my dealer sent me the other day.

I am undecided still as to have it done or not.

Jim

 

Hi Jim;

 

The winterizing season is behind us and we have now completed about a dozen of these Crestliner recalls that we discussed back in the summer.

We have learned that there is very little storage space lost on your 1600 Fish Hawk when the additional floatation is added. I have attached photos of the three areas where foam is added that impacts storage space:

1 - under the console by the driver's feet about 5" of depth is lost

2 - the depth inside the port rod box is reduced by 3"

3 - the port & stbd battery storage areas have foam added at the forward side.

Hopefully my attached photos will help to clarify this.

If you want to proceed with this, it takes us about 3 to 4 weeks to get the floatation kit. You can make arrangements with my brother John in our service department to decide when to get this dealt with.

 

 

Edited December 12, 2009 by Radnine

[mistyriver1]

Jim, having worked in the automotive industry for over 20 years when a recall was done, it was done for a reason. I now work in the heavy duty truck industry and the same goes there. I can't speak for the marine business, but the fact that your dealer went out of his way to send you pics and based on your post the minimal amount of space you're losing, I would do it. I ordered a replacement windshield for my crestliner this past summer and I've dealt with Doug, he's a stand up guy. I'd do it.

 

Jim

[irishfield]

A no brainer Jim! A big rouge wave on Erie that fills you to the brim.... level floatation will be the difference between staying with craft and swimming (or drowning)

[ohhenrygsr]

Yes it's good to see a dealer going out of there way to send you pictures and explanation of where you will loose space. I think they are doing a good job and aren't just concerned about the NMMA certification but also your safety.

[Harrison]

A no brainer Jim! A big rouge wave on Erie that fills you to the brim.... level floatation will be the difference between staying with craft and swimming (or drowning)

 

I am with Wayne, no brainer.

 

Had a tracker and split the hull on Simcoe, got ourselves to shore luckily (with help from the good ole Merc) we were full of water but atleast level.

Edited December 16, 2009 by Harrison

[mart]

I just got my Crestliner 1750 Fishhawk back with the new floatation kit added. Better be safe than sorry. Life's too short.

[JohnF]

I just got my Crestliner 1750 Fishhawk back with the new floatation kit added. Better be safe than sorry. Life's too short.

 

Has the reduced storage affected your uses in any way, assuming you use the storage areas? Or, does it still do everything (stress everything) to the same extent you bought the boat to do?

 

JF

[irishfield]

..also consider resale. You're de-valuing it at that end as well if you don't submit it to the recall.

[SlowPoke]

I would pay to have that done; if they're footing the bill, it's a no-brainer.

While rebuilding my boat this summer I could have forgone replacing the foam and nobody would know. Except me. I spent an extra $350 and countless hours for peace of mind.

[JohnF]

I'm not certain of this but I think his point isn't whether or not the work is needed for the boat's safety, rather whether he should settle for a compromise after being sold the defective piece of merchandise. Is it enough to just fix their problem when the fix possibly alters the utility of the product?

 

JF

[irishfield]

No the thought of litigation is the other thread John!! This one is strictly should I or shouldn't I ! Come'on .. keep up! lol

[JohnF]

No the thought of litigation is the other thread John!! This one is strictly should I or shouldn't I ! Come'on .. keep up! lol

 

Mea culpa.

 

JF

[Radnine]

I'm not certain of this but I think his point isn't whether or not the work is needed for the boat's safety, rather whether he should settle for a compromise after being sold the defective piece of merchandise. Is it enough to just fix their problem when the fix possibly alters the utility of the product?

 

JF

No the thought of litigation is the other thread John!! This one is strictly should I or shouldn't I ! Come'on .. keep up! lol

 

 

You are both right, kind of. I made the original post to assist like owners that are not as fortunate as I am, to have an excellent dealer.

I think that it is important to keep in mind that the boat is not without foam or flotation. It's got loads of both. It is a situation (after some chatting with people in the know) where, under an extreme set of circumstances like at full weight (max motor, max fuel, covered in snow, live-well full of muskies, etc.) it fails the level flotation test which says that a boat that is swamped should float level with about six inches of side board showing (or something like that). It doesn't sink or flip or anything extreme, and the value attempting to be reached is theoretical to start with. In other words I think one could be forgiven for taking a pass. That being said, I too have thought about resale values etc (like anyone has ever asked "Has this boat met all factory recalls?" when looking at a used boat), which is why I am exploring all options and keeping an open dialogue with my dealer and the factory.

I agree with others that this is a showing by a fantastic boat company and an outstanding boat dealer to rectify an unusual situation. I am confident that we will be able to come up with something that suit everyone when it is all said and done.

I will keep you posted.

Jim

Edited December 20, 2009 by Radnine

[blarg]

I've only tried to email them so far, they've simply ignored me.

[JohnAB]

I have the same boat as Radnine. I phoned my dealership way back when the recall notice came out. Have heard nothing back since. Also contacted Crestliner and asked if i would be reimbursed for my lost wages and travelling to get this done as I live 2 hours from the nearest Crestliner dealership. They were very arrogant and beligerent over all of it. Lost a lot of respect for Crestliner. Their problems should not cost me. They sold me a boat that was advertised to meet all the safety requirements. The boat does not. They should foot the bill for this not I.

[mart]

John there isn't any storage or space reduction in my 1750 Fishhawk. It has the same storage and usage as before the kit was added. Just knowing it meets all marine standards is peace of mind for me.

Edited December 17, 2009 by mart

[blackdog_2]

I had the additional floatation put in my 1600 Fish Hawk back in October. Don't really notice a difference in the port rod locker. The battery storage areas will not hold anything larger than a group 24 battery. Also, I used to be able to tuck a tackle box (soft sider with 4 x 3600 Plano boxes) under the console. No room for it now.

[marine5068]

Three good points made about this topic.

Like "IRISH" said, a rogue(correct spelling) wave can kill you if it sinks you.

A hull breach can also do that if you have inadequate flotation.

Plus the resale value will be compromised if you go to sell and the buyer is educated on this fact.

Hope the new flotation let's you sleep at night now.

~Marine

[lew]

I have the same boat as Radnine. I phoned my dealership way back when the recall notice came out. Have heard nothing back since. Also contacted Crestliner and asked if i would be reimbursed for my lost wages and travelling to get this done as I live 2 hours from the nearest Crestliner dealership. They were very arrogant and beligerent over all of it. Lost a lot of respect for Crestliner. Their problems should not cost me. They sold me a boat that was advertised to meet all the safety requirements. The boat does not. They should foot the bill for this not I.

 

Really surprised to hear of the attitude at Crestliner John.

 

I bought a new Crestliner back in '99 and in the fall of '02 I noticed a soft spot developing in the floor at the rear of the boat. I contacted their head office and they told me to take it to a nearby dealership.....which was only 10 miles away.....at the end of the season when I was done with the boat for the year. They arranged for the dealership to de-rig my boat, winterize the motor and store it inside for the winter....... All at NO cost to me.

 

The boat was then loaded on a truck and shipped to their factory in the States.....Wisconsin I believe.....where the entire floor was removed & replaced along with all the carpet.

 

The boat was then shipped back up here to the Crestliner dealership in April, re-rigged and was already for me when the fishing season opened again in May. Again, absolutely no charge to me for anything at all.

 

Probably the best service I've ever received from any company, anytime !!

 

Hope it all works out OK for those of you dealing with them now with this recall issue.

[Roy]

I've contacted Crestliner via email and asked that a qualified spokesman register here to fix this problem. We'll see where that goes. I'm sure they'll look after it.

[Jer]

Thanks Roy, I'm still on the fence regarding having the kit installed on my '04 1600 Angler.

[Roy]

Thanks Roy, I'm still on the fence regarding having the kit installed on my '04 1600 Angler.

 

Feel for you Jer, Let's see what thay can do. I'm sure they'll be as good as the others who have helped out members in the past.

[Roy]

Ok folks, here is a copy of the note I sent to Crestliner on the 20th December:

 

Date/Time: Dec 20 2009 06:48

Name: Roy Boudreau

Email: [email protected]

Organization: Ontario Fishing Network

Phone: 450 655-****

Subject: Media Request

Message: I'm an administrator for the Ontario Fishing Network Community. We have one of the most active fishing websites in North America with 30-40,000 hits a day. Recently, a problem with Crestliner floatation has been signalled on our board. Some people are unhappy with the support (or lack of) provided with this issue. We know how these situation tend to fester and get out of hand. I ask if someone from your organization would be so kind as to register on our site and say something on Crestliner's position with all of this. Here is a link to the thread in question. http://www.ofncommunity.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=38499 Thank you for looking after this. Roy Boudreau

 

 

 

Just a short while ago I received this reply from Gary Bourassa of Crestliner.

 

 

Roy Boudreau,

 

Thank you for your cordial notification of this posting.

 

You certainly do have an active website that serves as a link to many outdoor enthusiasts.

I do wish to visit with you regarding this flotation issue as well as our plant's stance concerning addressing items such as this on any web-based forum.

I am attaching a FAQ sheet concerning this recall campaign for your review and I wish to follow it up with a phone conversation with you. I will plan on contacting you Friday, Jan 8 about 1:00 PM central time at the following number: 450 655-****.

If a different time or number would be more advantageous for you please let me know at this email address.

 

Thanks again Roy

Gary Bourassa

Crestliner & Triton Aluminum

Quality Systems & Continuous Improvement Manager

[email protected]

320-631-5718 - office

320-632-2127 - fax

 

 

 

And here is a copy of the FAQ that Gary Bourassa sent.

 

 

 

Crestliner Flotation Recall Frequently Asked Questions

 

• Why are boats being recalled
  

a. We recently discovered that some of our models do not meet a United States Coast Guard (USCG) requirement for level flotation. Under the Federal Boating Safety Act, we are required to recall the defective units and bring them up to or beyond USCG regulations.

 

 

• What is Level Flotation
  

a. A flotation system that will keep a swamped boat and a specified quantity of the weights of its maximum: engine, equipment, passengers, and total options; in specified locations within the boat floating in an approximately level attitude.

 

 

• What is Basic Flotation?
  

a. A flotation system that will keep a swamped boat from sinking when its passengers are in the water clinging to it, provided that the aggregate weight of the engine, passengers, and equipment carried in or attached to the boat does not exceed that boat’s maximum weight capacity. With basic flotation, the swamped boat may float at any attitude.

 

 

• Is my boat going to sink?
  

a. No providing you have not exceeded the posted maximum weight capacity on your vessel’s capacity plate. All Crestliner units have passed USCG and ABYC Basic Flotation standards.

 

 

• Is my boat safe to use?
  

a. Yes. However, we strongly recommend scheduling the recall service to ensure Level Flotation requirements are met.

 

 

• How did this happen?
  

a. For many years, Crestliner determined foam flotation needs by using American Boating and Yacht Council’s (ABYC) calculation method. While performing a proactive, internal audit on a prototype a few months ago, we discovered the boat did not have enough foam in the proper locations it needed to pass the test. We then subjected the prototype and all Crestliner models to flotation tests to evaluate whether they met the Level Flotation requirements. Out of 171 models that Crestliner has built over the last 10 years, 16 were found to not be in compliance.

 

 

• Do I have to have the foam kit installed in my boat?
  

a. Yes.

 

 

• I’m the second owner of this boat – will this installation be covered under warranty?
  

a. Absolutely, regardless of which owner you are, the kit installation is covered by warranty.

 

 

 

 

 

• My boat is not on your recall list – does it need a foam kit installed?
  

a. No. If it isn’t listed in the recall table, it isn’t subject to the recall.

 

 

 

• Will mileage be covered to bring it in for kit installation?
  

a. No, mileage to and from the dealership is not covered by the recall. However, Crestliner will pay all materials and labor associated with the recall.

 

 

 

• Will I get a loaner boat to use while mine is getting the foam kit installed?
  

a. No, but the installation only takes a maximum of several hours to complete. By scheduling with the dealer, it will allow them to have all the parts on hand when you arrive and minimize the downtime and inconvenience to you.

 

 

 

• What do I need to do to prepare my boat for this installation?
  

a. We recommend that you remove any loose items from the boat and all storage compartments. Depending on your model, the dealer will have to access storage compartments and remove flooring for installation. By removing your loose personal items the dealer will be able to complete your boat faster and it minimizes the risk that one of your personal items is misplaced while the boat is worked on. Crestliner will not be responsible for lost or misplaced items.

 

 

 

• How will the kit change my boat?
  

a. In most models, the changes will hardly be noticeable. In certain models, the only way to bring the boat to level flotation requirements is to install foam in portions of storage areas. Utilizing storage areas for foam was done only when no other alternatives existed.

 

 

• How will I be compensated for losing storage space?
  

a. We will not be able to compensate for this loss – it is an unfortunate consequence of the recall. It is our contention that the safety of our customers takes priority over a small amount of storage space.

 

 

 

• Can I get these repairs done at my local boat dealer even if they do not carry Crestliner?
  

a. Your nearest Crestliner dealer has the materials and expertise to do the best job. In the event you don’t have a Crestliner dealer in your region, please contact Crestliner’s customer service department at 320.631.5701 to locate an alternate service site.

 

 

 

• Can I wait until after fishing season to bring boat in for this installation?
  

a. We recommend getting the installation completed as soon as you are able to.

 

 

 

• I do not want my boat repaired – I demand you to buy it back or give me a new model that meets USCG regulations.
  

a. Our obligation is to ensure we’ve sold a boat that meets USCG regulations. With the fix outlined in the recall, we are meeting this obligation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Gary Bourassa will be calling me tomorrow afternoon. If anyone has anything in particular they want to ask, please please post as soon as possible.

 

Thanks.

[TJQ]

Roy!! Our hero!!

[JohnF]

Ok folks, here is a copy of the note I sent to Crestliner on the 20th December:

 

• I do not want my boat repaired – I demand you to buy it back or give me a new model that meets USCG regulations.
  

a. Our obligation is to ensure we’ve sold a boat that meets USCG regulations. With the fix outlined in the recall, we are meeting this obligation.

 

Gary Bourassa will be calling me tomorrow afternoon. If anyone has anything in particular they want to ask, please please post as soon as possible.

 

Thanks.

 

I'm not an owner of one of these but if I was and if I bought it with the expectation and need of the storage as I bought it, I'd be suggesting to them that legally they misrepresented the product I was buying and at least I was entitled to some kind of abatement if not replacement with a unit that did what I bought it to do.

 

I could come up with lots of examples but here's a simple one. What if the boat I ordered from my dealer was represented to have rod lockers for 7' one piece rods and said so in the literature. After I got it home I discovered it had only 6' rod lockers. How many serious fishermen might be a little ripped that they couldn't store their 7 footers as advertised. That's mispresentation and is a legitimate claim under our legal system. How many of us would just say "Oh rats. Guess I gotta get rid of my one piece 7 footers or else leave 'em on deck." I think not.

 

Perhaps they have fine print in some of the documentation that says it's okay for them to screw up and not have any liability.

 

In my business that kind of misrepresentation, even if innocent, is still actionable. And one can only wonder how innocent this was. Did they know they didn't measure up and did nothing till they got called on it?

 

JF