Guys with Tillers

[GeorgeJ]

I'm operating a tiller powered boat for the first time and it's working out fine except that the steering effort is very high, so high in fact that after about 3 days of fishing on Baptiste my left arm was having major fatigue. I have a new 25 hp 2 stroke on a 14' Grizzly jon boat with a modified V hull. Being my first tiller I'm not sure what is a normal steering effort for an outfit like this or similar. When I steer the boat under power at a cruise speed I have to force the tiller arm right or left to turn the boat, it's more of a jerky turn than a nice smooth one due to the high effort required to move the motor. Can anyone comment on what kind of effort is required with their tiller powered boat? I have backed the friction screw on the steering pivot right out and made no difference.

Edited August 31, 2009 by GeorgeJ

[ohhenrygsr]

Since you backed the friction screw right out and still no difference then i would suggest greasing it. There should be grease nipples around the pivot points of the outboard.

[Jonny]

If you set the motor to make the boat run straight, does the boat keep running straight if you keep just fingertip pressure on the tiller handle? If not, you may have to adjust the trim tab.

[camillj]

Somethings not right ... normally the issue is that it turns toooo freely so you have to keep a hand on it at all times (which can also be a pain esepecially when you are trolling and fiddling with stuff

 

 

I think the grease idea is a good one ... but I'd be suspicious about it having been submerged at some time ... if it is NEW, I would ask the dealer to fix it ... maybe theres another adjustment (some of them have a lever in the front as well as the screw)

[GeorgeJ]

I thought I should try greasing it but being only on it's second tank of fuel I assume it should still be well greased, but it is easy enough to try so I will. The motor stays perfectly straight even with hand off the tiller arm, I think it would stay in whatever position it was left in.

[Jonny]

The motor stays perfectly straight even with hand off the tiller arm, I think it would stay in whatever position it was left in.

 

OK, definitely not the trim tab. I thought you might be fighting that.

 

That stiffness is really strange for a new motor (brand new, not new-to-you). If I had bought it from a dealer, I'd be calling first thing Monday morning to find out what's up, unless I could unearth something in the manual.

 

--

 

EDIT - You said this happens "under power". Does the motor turn smoothly and easily when it's not running? If it does, then I can't help but think that it's the angle of the motor set too close to the transom and causing the bow to dig in. A jon boat gives you a pretty square front, doesn't it? Maybe you could set the motor a notch further back (and maybe two, after trying just one) to raise the bow under power.

Edited August 9, 2009 by Jocko

[GeorgeJ]

yeah motor is brand new and has a 2 year warranty, wish I had some faith in the dealer from where it came (long story) if I did I would take it back, anyway it moves freely just sitting there on the back of the boat, feels smooth. I just went and greased it, only one fitting at the bottom of the steering neck and even though the grease fitting is at the bottom the grease only came out at the top bushing in one spot and none out around the bottom bushing, this seems a little odd.

[Jonny]

it moves freely just sitting there on the back of the boat, feels smooth

 

In that case, George, I would definitely try trimming the motor "up" a little (away from the transom). I can't think of anything else but that at speed your bow is digging in and making it harder for you to turn.

 

Trimming the motor up a bit will push your stern down a little (under power) and lift the bow.

Edited August 9, 2009 by Jocko

[GeorgeJ]

yes I will try moving the trim setting out more to see if this helps next time out, being a jon boat probably doesn't help but it does have a modified V type hull and plains out well with 2 people so I don't think it's ploughing too much in the water.

[Jonny]

One other (weird) possibility. Did the dealer sell you a short shaft outboard? The V-hull needs a long shaft.

[GeorgeJ]

One other (weird) possibility. Did the dealer sell you a short shaft outboard? The V-hull needs a long shaft.

 

Nope I have the required long shaft, motor has good power for the boat and never seems to be struggling, with two people it gps's at 45 km an hour. I'd sure like to see grease come out around that bottom bushing. Maybe things are still to tight from being new or maybe possibly a hole in the bushing is not lined up with the grease zerk fitting.

[Roy]

George, tell me the make and year.

[GeorgeJ]

George, tell me the make and year.

 

Roy it is a 2008 Yamaha 2 stroke model number 25MLH.

[Sinker]

Yeah, something sounds fishy there George. I have a 40 tiller and I can steer it with one finger at idle or wide open. I'd get it looked at, might be something going on in there, and your warranty should cover it.

 

S.

[wallyboss]

I don't think that it would be the trim tab either. The trim tab is only to keep the motor straight on take off, at WOT the trim tab is not even in the water.

 

When it is on the trailer and you can easily turn the tiller left and right ask someone to grab the keel and pull back on it and see if it gets harder to steer, It shouldn't. Maybe there is something loose .

Edited August 9, 2009 by wallyboss

[BillM]

Yeah, something sounds fishy there George. I have a 40 tiller and I can steer it with one finger at idle or wide open. I'd get it looked at, might be something going on in there, and your warranty should cover it.

 

S.

 

 

Sounds exactly what it's like to drive the 40hp 4stk Honda on the back of our 15' Legend.. No effort at all.

[Jonny]

I don't think that it would be the trim tab either. The trim tab is only to keep the motor straight on take off, at WOT the trim tab is not even in the water.

Are we talking about the same trim tab? The one that is mounted under the cavitation plate.

 

From what has been posted it wouldn't be the trim tab anyway, though. It sounds like there's something binding in the steering pivot.

[bigcreekdad]

I've got a 60 hp Yamaha tiller. It has a lever on it that adjusts the tension so that steering can be quite tight, or loose. I've adjusted mine so that it turns effortlessly at any speed. I take it you don't have such a lever? If not, as others suggested, I'd take it in for a look/see by dealer. I've driven dozens of tillers over the years (at fly in lodges etc. as well as my own), and have never experienced what you describe. Good luck.....you can't beat a tiller for boat control, not to mention the room it opens up over a console.

[GeorgeJ]

thanks guys for your suggestions, for sure I know now that the effort should be way less than what it is to steer this boat. Today I looked it all over again and tried greasing it again in different ways for example while turning the motor back and forth while pumping grease into the steering pivot grease zerk. I can't say this did any good till I put it into the water again but I will keep my fingers crossed. Also I don't know if this means anything but now when I tighten the screw that increases the steering tension I can still move the motor side to side compared to before I greased it when there was no way you could move it with the tension screw tightened. Hopefully I got some grease everywhere it needs to be and it will help, if not I guess I will take it to the Yamaha Dealer in Bancroft (not the dealer I bought it from) and let them have a look.

[camillj]

You should be able to turn the motor at any tension ... sounds like you may have it licked .. but if not .. not mess around too much .. dont want to void your warrantee

[John Bacon]

I suspect that the motor is binding when under pressure. This would explain why the motor is easy to turn at rest but difficult while you are underway. I would recommend having it checked out by a dealer while it is under warranty.

 

How was the fishing on Baptiste? I caught a 32" pike near Blueberry Island last Satruday.

[GeorgeJ]

John the fishing was ok considering it was our first time fishing it. We caught nice sized pike and walleye just up from the dam. It would have been nice to have had more action but the fish we caught were decent sized so that made up for it. We went off the fish finder only and don't know the lake at all yet.

[BITEME]

You say that you have adjusted the trim tab I get the impression that is ok

You also say that when the motor is not under load it is fine turns no problem but when you load it up it is very stiff

 

This is a long shot some shafts have an internal collar that the tension screw engages to stiffen steering from what it sounds like you are missing the collar and when you load it up the play is being taken up by the force of the motor and binding

If this is the case no amount of grease or tension is going to solve this

 

Just a thought

peter

[GeorgeJ]

Hey Guys looks like the extensive greasing I gave the pivot shaft did the trick, motor steers a lot easier, just goes to show you don't trust the pre delivery done by the dealer unless you know them and their quality of work real well!

[solopaddler]

when I tighten the screw that increases the steering tension I can still move the motor side to side compared to before I greased it when there was no way you could move it with the tension screw tightened.

 

Just a thought but after reading this are you sure you havn't been tightening the throttle tension?

Sounds like maybe you have in which case you need to find the steeering tension and loosen it.