Help 2 stroke or 4 have to decide now!

[Bernie]

The smaller but heavier 130 4 stroke sunk my boat down 4 more inches into the water Mike. It was properly propped and would push the boat 35 MPH.

The 175 2 stroke is every bit as quiet as the Honda and just as smooth.

It really doesn't matter to me what anybody buys. I'm just trying to let people know there are good options out there.

Edited February 25, 2009 by Bernie

[Mike the Pike]

That will not happen in my lifetime.

 

And yes Mike, I've had both.

 

I would put my 2 stroke up against any 4 stroke 40 in a race......I'll win everytime.

 

I know its not about speed. Its about what you get for your money. Why pay more for less??? Doesn't make sense to me.

 

We're talking a 25 here......not a 250!

 

Sinker

 

How about a long distance race see who runs out of gas first

[fishhunter]

That will not happen in my lifetime.

 

And yes Mike, I've had both.

 

I would put my 2 stroke up against any 4 stroke 40 in a race......I'll win everytime.

 

I know its not about speed. Its about what you get for your money. Why pay more for less??? Doesn't make sense to me.

 

We're talking a 25 here......not a 250!

 

Sinker

if it was a race who could run longer 20 lt of fuel you would loose to the 4storke. it will beat you in operating cost but you would win buy a min or two in speed so in the end is that winning in the big picture.

[GeorgeJ]

did you guys hear about the new proposed mandatory home energy audit required when you sell your house at the tune of $300, who ever thought this could happen. Maybe a 2 stroke band in Canada is not out of the question, the closest I have heard of lake that has a 2 stroke band is in S Carolina but there may be some closer. Even if there is a chance they could band them in the next 15 years it be too soon to spend money on a 2 stroke now. There are quite a few 20 year old plus outboards still running and doing the job they were intended to do.

[Pigeontroller]

Get the 4 stroke. You won't regret it.

[DRIFTER_016]

How much fuel do you think you'll save with a 20 4 stroke over a 25 2 stroke??

Sinker

 

 

About 50%

[DRIFTER_016]

"When you are required to operate in a "4-Stroke Only" body of water"

 

Do these "4-Stroke Only" bodies of water actually exist? Is there a single lake in Ontario that bans 2 strokes but allows 4 strokes? What about other provinces or even the states?

 

Don't try taking a 2stroke on Alaska's Kenai River in July or August you won't like the fine you receive.

[Sinker]

About 50%

 

 

I'm highly doubting that........got anything to prove it? Just curious.......

 

S.

[Mike the Pike]

I'm highly doubting that........got anything to prove it? Just curious.......

 

S.

 

I think that the 25hp there will be a little difference but I don't think 50%

 

I know when I had a 55hp Suzuki it sucked more than 50% more gas than My Honda 50hp 4 stroke.

Sinker I really did see a hell of a difference in fuel costs.

 

Last year in November in Quinte when the price of gas was around the $1 mark I spent $34 for 3 days of fishing covering 25 to 30 miles per day

[Bernie]

I have heard talk of banning 4 strokes on some northern lakes. Seems some are changing their oil right on the lake.

Hmmmm 50% better? I will grant you some % on a smaller outboard but have to disagree on 50% too.

[motion]

Go with the four stroke. I have a 100 Hp Yamaha and I love it. Had a 115 Merc two stroke and there is no comparison. Quieter, better gas consumption and you can troll with your four stroke at lower speeds. Just my $0.02..............

[boatman]

About 50%

 

Where did you get that number? Out of a hat? At wide open throttle (WOT) both 2 and 4 strokes get about the same fuel economy. Lots of published reports and comparisons on the net to prove it. You can't compare RPM's and fuel economy when you are comparing 2 and 4 strokes. That is why 4 strokes look so much more economical on paper. That isn't to say they can't be more economical, it is just that they may not be under certain conditions.

 

I think everyone needs to take a step back. He didn't ask if you prefer 2 or 4 stroke. He didn't ask about ETECs or if your boat performs better with a 135 or 175. What he asked is what is the better motor for his boat. If they were both the same horse power then we'd have a need for a discussion, but the fact of the matter is he is considering either a 25 hp 2 stroke or a 20 hp 4 stroke on a 14' jon boat max rated to 25 hp. Given these choices the answer is clearly the 2 stroke.

[Sinker]

I'm sure a 4 stroke is better on fuel. Im sure they're better for the environment. I'm sure they run smoother and quiter. I know all this.......

 

The question here was a 25 2 stroke, or a 20 4 stroke on a 14ft duck boat rated for a 25.

 

I still say get the 25 2 stroke.......its a small boat, with no gadgets on it. No need for the charging system, no need for the extra weight with less power. Max power is the best you can do.

 

If your worried about the difference in gas.......you got issues.....we're talking a 25 HP........you'll prolly only need to fill the tank 3-4 times a season!!! You'd spend more on beer for one weekend!!!!

 

EDIT: Boatman beat me to it.....he knows his stuff!!!!

 

Sinker

Edited February 25, 2009 by Sinker

[fishhunter]

Where did you get that number? Out of a hat? At wide open throttle (WOT) both 2 and 4 strokes get about the same fuel economy. Lots of published reports and comparisons on the net to prove it. You can't compare RPM's and fuel economy when you are comparing 2 and 4 strokes. That is why 4 strokes look so much more economical on paper. That isn't to say they can't be more economical, it is just that they may not be under certain conditions.

 

I think everyone needs to take a step back. He didn't ask if you prefer 2 or 4 stroke. He didn't ask about ETECs or if your boat performs better with a 135 or 175. What he asked is what is the better motor for his boat. If they were both the same horse power then we'd have a need for a discussion, but the fact of the matter is he is considering either a 25 hp 2 stroke or a 20 hp 4 stroke on a 14' jon boat max rated to 25 hp. Given these choices the answer is clearly the 2 stroke.

clearly 20 hp 4 stoke with out any question.

http://www.deepscience.com/articles/engines.html have a look at this i think it will give you all you need to make your own mind up hope it helps and another http://smalloutboards.com/4Stroke.htm

Edited February 25, 2009 by fishhunter

[boatman]

clearly 20 hp 4 stoke with out any question.

 

How so? The 20 hp will have less hole shot, less top speed, more strain underload. Fuel economy will be negligible. So why is it better?

[boatman]

clearly 20 hp 4 stoke with out any question.

http://www.deepscience.com/articles/engines.html have a look at this i think it will give you all you need to make your own mind up hope it helps

 

That only explains why some motorbike guy likes 4 strokes better than 2 strokes. Doesn't explain why the 20 hp is better than the 25 hp on the poster's boat.

[fishhunter]

ever gone slow on a nice day with a 2 stroke then have have the wind pick up slow at your back and enjoy the nice smell of 2 choke smoke. start a 2 choke up in the morning and be siting in a cloud of smoke. try and enjoy a talk with your friend while your trying to talk over the motor. none of this happends with a 4 stroke and like i said before so you get to your spot 2 min before me what did you gain other then to say your beet me. i had a smooth ride with very little engine wine. cost me less to get to the spot. and when i get there and troll around i dont have to smell 2 stroke smell. guess for me having had both its a no brainer. if your still not sure go down to the boat lauch in the morning on a nice day watch boats fire up watch and listen the the motors the ones with smoke all around the boat is a 2 stroke and the one purring is a 4 stoke. again just my 3 cents

[jwl]

....I have had absolutely zero issues with my 40 -2 stroke, it's not silent to the effect that you wouldn't know the motor is on unless it was peeing water and beeped when you turn the key , but it's not all that noisy.

 

It's decent enough on gas, you don't get choked out with fumes,planes out really quick which is great, my kids like to tube, and a couple people I know have ski'd and wake boarded behind my boat.

 

As far as oil fouling things up like the plugs....I have never had one issue with that, still the original plugs in it from new in 2003.

 

I use it 12 months a year with no issues at all in the cold either.

 

If I where to buy a new motor for my smaller boat-14 footer rated for a 15, I currently run an old 9.9 2 stroke on it, I would definately go with a 2 stroke for a new purchase if I replaced my motor I use now. Weight would be a big factor as it is what they call an ultra lite utility boat and in comparison the 4 strokes look too big and heavy for the boat let alone the portablity aspect of having the tinner in the first place as a "pop in the water anywhere" boat for me....2 guys can pick it up and throw it in the water anywhere, load up the motor and gas and gear and off ya go

 

I even asked the guy at the dealership how the weight difference may affect the max horsepower rating just because I thought that the 4 strokes looked too big for the boat...being as the boat was new in 2003 and the market was not quite dominated by the 4 stroke bandwagon, they looked into it for me in the specs according to the 2008 booklet, the conclusion I got was the horsepower ratings didn't get affected but the max load for people/ motor/ gear is different

 

I am just giving an example.....you can always get some great advice from a fishing forum, but don't beat your head against the wall too long, there are always going to be huge differences of opinion...just like brands of motors,boats, cars, beer..ect......people like what they like and some will always say that thier choice is the best and everyone elses sucks don't get caught up in all the hype..in the end do what you think will give you the most of what you want out of your boat/motor combo

[Sinker]

You guys make 2 strokes sound like all they do is blow smoke. Sure, there is a little smoke, but good gawd....nothing like you fellas make it out to be. Run some decent oil, and learn how to mix it properly. The smoke out of mine looks like steam........and I like the smell!!!

 

This isn't a 2stroke vs. 4 stroke discussion.

 

Its about what engine best suits a 14ft jon boat rated for a 25.

 

25hp yammy 2 stroke.

 

S.

[bushart]

Really are you guys reading the same thing as me?

 

Lots are talking about speed and hole shots----IT"S A 20-25 HP!!

 

Either of these motors are point A and B transportation not racing.

 

Speed in boats is something that at times you'll always want more but that trail leads to new boats with 300hp

 

I watch most boats flying by me with my 50 (Cause they are running 150+) and I can live with that---What I cannot live with is backtrolling into the wind and the air is colourized for your breathing enjoyment.

 

Yes if your in the 100 horse range you can have the hole shot debate but at 20 horse??--must be me??

 

Bushart

[boatman]

At Yamaha's 100:1 mix there will be very little smoke. Use synthetic oil and there will be half as much smoke. Synthetic marine oil is also biodegradable.

 

Even my antique outboards which run at 24:1 don't smoke so bad that you "choke". I use synthetic oil and you only notice the smoke at start up when its cold.

 

I have two newer Yamaha 15 hp 2 strokes at work and they barely smoke. They also troll right down and don't rattle a lot. You can't compare the old 2 strokes to today's. New ones are engineered so much better.

 

Actually, Bushart, hole shot is important for any planing hull boat regardless of hp.

Edited February 25, 2009 by boatman

[Fisherman]

I wouldn't think twice about a 25 2 stroke. There is nothing wrong with 2 stroke engines.

 

I have a 40 2 stroke on my boat. A 40 4 stroke is almost 100lbs heavier......and just friggen massive. I raced a guy with a 40 4 stroke and just smoked him.

Sinker

 

"Smoked him", in more ways than we like to choke on.

[Fisherman]

Really are you guys reading the same thing as me?

 

Lots are talking about speed and hole shots----IT"S A 20-25 HP!!

 

Either of these motors are point A and B transportation not racing.

 

Speed in boats is something that at times you'll always want more but that trail leads to new boats with 300hp

 

I watch most boats flying by me with my 50 (Cause they are running 150+) and I can live with that---What I cannot live with is backtrolling into the wind and the air is colourized for your breathing enjoyment.

 

Yes if your in the 100 horse range you can have the hole shot debate but at 20 horse??--must be me??

 

Bushart

 

Amen, Holeshot , get outa bed 10 minutes earlier and you'll make it to your "hole" on time, as for enjoying the smell and breathing the 2 stroke stink whether it looks like steam or not, , ya, you can filter out the pollutants for the rest of us.

[jwl]

a "newish" guy to the board asks for some advice on a motor for a new boat he got and it turns into some sort of arguement

 

that's really cool folks

[Bitsmith2k]

i'm not a mechanic, nor do i know a heck of a lot about motors, just can speak from experience..

 

i went from a yammy 25hp 2-stroke to the f20 late last year..

 

i noticed a big difference in fuel consumption, but the 25 was fairly old, and something was buggered with it (hence it finally blowing up)..

 

the f20 was brutal at first.. finally got the proper pitch prop and its golden now.. the only thing i've noticed is if i get a big 2nd guy in the boat it takes a while to plane out (it wont plane with 3 of us) whereas with the 25, i'd get it up on a plane fairly quickly (still wouldnt plane with 3 of us)..

 

i'm not going to enter it in any races, but it gets me from spot to spot just fine.. its quiet, super easy to maintain (if i can winterize it, it's gotta be easy because me = dumb)..

 

mike