Raf Posted August 8, 2015 Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 (edited) Looking to replace my how water tank (electric) with possibly a NG unit if it makes sense $$$ wise or another electric. Any recommendations for someone in the area - we're in grand valley 20 mins west of Oville? Just looking for honest work not looking for shortcuts / hacks to save $$$. I know we have trades people on here so thought I'd throw it out there. Edited August 8, 2015 by Raf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen Posted August 8, 2015 Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 I like NG. Seems to heat faster. Don't run out of hot. Get a tank from homedepot. Put it in place. Pay just for the gas hook up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raf Posted August 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 (edited) I need to get an idea of what it would cost to retrofit to gas. Our furnace is already NG, in the same space, and we have 3 spare unused gas hookups (for lack of a better term) in that room. The furnace vents out the side of the house via black plastic pipes.. from what I understand these are no longer up to code and you need to go white. I also dont really know power vent vs 'the other' vent when it comes to NG water tanks. we also have a chimney that starts right where the tank sits but i don't know if it's correctly lined (for our woodstove). electric seems like the simple way to go but with the cost of hydro vs NG i'd rather pay a little more now and less later. plus it pains me to pay enbridge $20 a month in the summer just for the privledge of being their customer. from what i understand tankless is still not really the way to go given the high initial cost.. payback is small over a very long period of time. Edited August 8, 2015 by Raf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen Posted August 8, 2015 Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 It would be aprox 300. For hook up and power vent install. I like Power vent on hot water. I have not had any prob with mine. You need the white pipes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenboater Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 gas water heaters are great during power blackouts. as are gas stoves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leaf4 Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 Dunno what it would cost for a company to do it, but if you can screw a pop bottle lid on, you can connect black malleable pipe together. Also I would rather have a regular hot water tank as opposed to instant hot as the instant hots depending on brand can be a pain to get parts, leaving you without hot water for days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 (edited) I have a power vent NG hot water heater for 15 years now. Yes the next time I need any work done it must be changed from ABS to white PVC, no big deal at all. Rather than vent horizontally I'm told it has to up and out vertically. ABS has been found to crack at the glue joints after years of constant heat. I have a carbon monoxide detector next to the tank and soap it for leaks occasionally. If replacing I am going to an on demand tank unless I can rent the next tank. Spider webs and wasp nests in the vent line has been a problem. I just remove the line and clean it out like I did a few weeks ago. I did have to change a bad control valve 5 years ago with nice $400.00 bill from the HVAC company here. That hurt. Gas vs. elec is a no brainer at all. edit, the only reason I would go to on demand is the space savings, we are in a small cottage and the tank is in the loft now. I will save much space as I can bring it downstairs and put it on the wall in the smallish laundry room. Worth the initial cost to us. Happy wife and thus happy fishing and golf. Edited August 9, 2015 by Old Ironmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raf Posted August 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 Can the exhaust vent be shared between the furnace and heater provided it is white pvc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 I'm pretty sure. No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 The power vent can go out the basement wall which makes it easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 (edited) No you will require an independent vent line if you do not have a common chimney. The most common vent is out a chimney, then you have direct vent that vents out the wall to the outside, then there is a power vent that has a fan on it and blows the waste gas (carbon monoxide) to the exterior of the home. Power vent is the safest in my opinion because a few more things must happen on a power vent to happen before the control valve for the gas supply opens, fan on and a minimum flow, this ensures no CO enters the home, simple really. But it is not a big deal to vent it to the outside. NG vs. electrical even with the installation is still less, very much less expensive when it comes to pay the utility bills. We have NG stove and HW heater. In the summer the bill is around $25.00 a month. You seem to be shying away from NG for some reason, why Raf? Edited August 9, 2015 by Old Ironmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raf Posted August 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 Thanks gentlemen, looks like I need to get someone in here and have a look. I'm reading that direct vent may be more desireable vs power vent because of lower cost and the fact that it will still give hot water in the event of a power outage -- not a huge deal but it'd be a nice to-have given we already have a gas stove & wood burner for heat -- we can go without power for days. Whereas as with power vent, you have an electric fan pushing the exhaust out and no power = no hot water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raf Posted August 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 No I am not shying away at all, I would prefer to switch to NG but I want to make sure it makes sense $$$ - wise from an initial cost standpoint vs long term savings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 You will save money with NG hot water. I know people that only wished they had NG out here in the boonies. If you can get away with a direct vent or vent to a common chimney go with that because yes, a power vent has to have Hydro for the fan to work. One advantage of power vent besides safety is that it will produce HW faster and it can be used to supply in floor hydronic heating, at least that was what is was in 2000 when I installed ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leaf4 Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 In terms of the hookup, if there are spares already roughed in, its a walk in the park Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 Lucas knows what he is talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.mech Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 (edited) I think there may be some confusion in terminology regarding venting types in this thread. There are three basic types: Gravity vent: draws air from the house for combustion & vents naturally outside through a metal vent tube (no power required) Power vent: similar to above but adds a blower on the exhaust flue (usually plastic) for more positive venting (power required) Direct vent: sealed combustion unit with a blower that draws air from outside, forces feeds the combustion chamber, & pushes the gas out through a separate vent line (both in and out are plastic). (power required) Only a gravity vent unit will run without 110V power but unfortunately, it's the most inefficient and least positive ventilated unit. Here is a link with more detail: http://www.home-water-heater.com/venting.html Edited August 9, 2015 by G.mech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeeter99 Posted August 10, 2015 Report Share Posted August 10, 2015 gas water heaters are great during power blackouts. as are gas stoves lol why would it make a difference they are electronic ignition so no hot water when power is out, or at least till you run out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leaf4 Posted August 10, 2015 Report Share Posted August 10, 2015 lol why would it make a difference they are electronic ignition so no hot water when power is out, or at least till you run out If there's a standing pilot, no issues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenboater Posted August 10, 2015 Report Share Posted August 10, 2015 lol why would it make a difference they are electronic ignition so no hot water when power is out, or at least till you run out my latest tank has a standing light but can also be lit manually I believe. main thing is it holds water so if you're judicious with usage, good for a few showers. gas stove heats water as well if needed. last blackout we had (christmas blackout), went a week without power but hot showers by candlelight were great while not the most efficient in terms of gas use, no way am I going with on demand unless I have a Generac backup and you don't see many of those in the big cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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