Fuel Separation

[bigbuck]

On the weekend I popped by to see a friend that runs one of the local marinas in Honey Harbour. He showed me a bottle of fuel that had separated in one of his customer's boats. It was pretty much 1/2 and 1/2 fuel and water/alcohol in the bottle. You could shake it up and after a minute or two, the fuel would float back up to the top and the water/alcohol would sink to the bottom. It was in a boat that doesn't get much use and was filled up with gas station gasoline with 10% ethanol. After draining the fuel tank, cleaning the fuel tank, replacing the fuel filter and fuel lines and rebuilding the carb the boat was good to go. Almost $1k later. That said, if your boat is going to sit for any length of time on the driveway or in the water, put some fuel stabilizer in it OR run non-ethanol gas (proper marine fuel - which is getting harder to find BTW) OR run it on Premium which has no ethanol in it.

I know there has been much heated debate on this topic but having seen fuel that did separate with my own eyes only reaffirmed my belief that you should drop some STABIL or whatever other stabilizing agent you wish in your gasoline. Many marinas out there are starting to use ethanol blended gas but are not openly letting their customers know that. If in any doubt, ask, if you don't get a satisfactory answer, get your fuel somewhere else. I've been buying Premium fuel at the gas station and filling the boat that way, it's cheaper than marine regular and I know what is going in the boat.

[Fisherman]

OR run it on Premium which has no ethanol in it.

I

 

You might want to do a bit of research before making a blanket statement about no ethanol premium, Shell is one of the very few that has no ethanol premium and even there, as far as I know, in some areas even the Shell premium is mixed.

[glen]

It might be worth while to use stabilizer all the time. I am thinking about it. Right now i don't use it in the summer but i do in damp spring or fall conditions.

[pigless]

I've also heard that Petro-Canada/Sunoco has ethanol free premium as well but haven't been able to confirm that.

[bigbuck]

Lovely, from my understanding, Premium fuel contains NO Ethanol. I'm going to have to do some more homework on this. I think a little slug of Stabil Marine Formula will go along with my fuel from now on. I figure it'll be cheap insurance.

[Raf]

sunoco (which is now petro-can too) was one of the 1st to jump on the ethanol bandwagon. all their fuel contains up to 10%

 

ethanol is actually an octane booster. which means they can get away with using a cheaper grade of gas and boost the octane via ethanol to meet the octane requirements of vehicles.

[irishfield]

Carry a peanut butter jar with a marked inch of water in it. Fill jar with fuel.. if the "water" grows above the line there is alcohol/ethanol in the gas. One of the easiest substance to check for in gas.

Edited June 23, 2010 by irishfield

[Jigger]

I've been using a stabilizer for years now. Had my outboard go manic while out on the Bog during the Carp die off. Took it to a local guy who showed me the fuel which had separated after agitation. Not a good thing. He suggested the Stabilizer and mid-grade fuel. I haven't had a problem since. Recommended to all. And it didn't cost that much, thankfully!

[esoxansteel]

There is a product called one 4 all by well-worth products which is a 4 season fuel treatment and conditioner which is formulated to clean and lubricate injectors and pumps and carbs etc eliminate water and prevent fuel separation from ethanol based fuels one 8 oz bottle treats 250 gallons of gas and I believe it was 10.00 it will say on the bottle that its for diesel engines, but its great on gasoline engines as well. www.wellworthproducts.com is their website, the rep from the company came to a muskies canada chapter meeting to answer concerns re fuel separation, the higher octane the fuel the less percentage of ethanol in the fuel

[glen]

For some reason i would like to think that if i buy a product i would like it to work.

So i buy gas and to get it to work i have to put other stuff into it. Good job.

[NANUK]

I have been using Stabill, I now use Stabil Marine in every tank, I have never had fuel related problems with any of my gas engines, its is important to use a gas stabilizer in the summer because of evaporation caused by hot tempratures IMO.

Seafoam is another excellent product.

As far as I know Shell premium is the only gas without ethenol. I never buy gas from marinas so don't know about any ethenol free marine gas.

[bigbuck]

When you buy fuel from a marina, assume that there is ethanol in the fuel UNLESS there is a sticker on the pump indicating that it is ethanol free fuel from the fuel supplier.

[dannyboy]

If the fuel was 10% ethanol and the sample was 1/2 water/alcohol and 1/2 fuel; something happened other than fuel separation.

Either the sample was taken from the bottom of the sump or there is water being introduced into the fuel system some other way.

 

Dan

[smally21]

stabilizer as cheap insurence great idea. this bad gas story going around kind of gets to me. the fear mongers that spout this gas seperating or going bad would have you believe it goes bad on the way home from the pump. gas takes a loooong time to go off to the point of causing a no start. ive started engines that have sat for years with the gas in them. no stabilizer in the snowblower, lawnmower, stored motorcycle ever.(just the boat). how about the new car that sits on the lot for months before it gets sold? does the dealership change out the fuel or add stabilizer? do they remove the batteries and store them on a trickle charger? of course not. "probably bad gas" to me translates to "i have no idea what is wrong with your boat - but i want to sound smart by repeating something i heard some oldtimer say at the bait shop" not sure what the post was about or what im talking about, just heard way too much about bad gas lately...

[lookinforwalleye]

stabilizer as cheap insurence great idea. this bad gas story going around kind of gets to me. the fear mongers that spout this gas seperating or going bad would have you believe it goes bad on the way home from the pump. gas takes a loooong time to go off to the point of causing a no start. ive started engines that have sat for years with the gas in them. no stabilizer in the snowblower, lawnmower, stored motorcycle ever.(just the boat). how about the new car that sits on the lot for months before it gets sold? does the dealership change out the fuel or add stabilizer? do they remove the batteries and store them on a trickle charger? of course not. "probably bad gas" to me translates to "i have no idea what is wrong with your boat - but i want to sound smart by repeating something i heard some oldtimer say at the bait shop" not sure what the post was about or what im talking about, just heard way too much about bad gas lately...

 

LoL so true but I just bought some marine Stabil just in case!!!

[Jigger]

Not trying to monger any fear, smally. My problem happened after maybe 1/2hr of cycling the engine. Had just filled a full tank of gas in town. There were no other problems after the fuel issue was diagnosed.

[IndySKS]

You don't suppose the gas station in town had water in their tanks? and thats where the water came from?

[bigbuck]

Another point to remember, when you see the big tanker in front of a gas station, go fill up at the next station you see. Everything in the bottom of the tank gets stirred up including any condensation (ie water). The sample I saw was from the bottom of the boat's fuel tank that was stored over the winter without fuel stabilizer. The owner of the boat was too cheap to spring for a proper winterization and just had the water drained from his engine. I'm not fear mongering, just stating some facts and observations. If you spend $10k+ on a boat, I think $20 for some Marine Stabil is just good insurance against having an expensive problem to fix. For me, I burn at least a tank (27 gallons) at least once a month so my fuel is usually quite fresh in the tank and I still pour some in, it keeps the fuel system and carb clean and it makes me feel better.

[DanD]

Another point to remember, when you see the big tanker in front of a gas station, go fill up at the next station you see. Everything in the bottom of the tank gets stirred up including any condensation (ie water).

 

That was a concern before ethanol but not so much since.

I ran a gas station before and during the introduction of ethanol.

The pumps & dispensers were maintained by the oil company and they were one of the few companies that had spin on fuel filters (looked like a car’s oil filter) on the sides of the dispensers.

These filters had to be replaced every two or three months because of the sediment being churned up when the underground tanks were filled.

When ethanol was first introduced these filter would plug up almost every week for the first few months and then slowing began lasting longer and longer. To the point that they were only changed once a year, just out of maintenance sake not because they were plugged.

One of the company’s engineers said that strait gasoline has a neutral magnetic charge and that the dirt would settle to the bottom of the tanks; but ethanol has a positive magnetic charge and would hold the dirt in suspension and that was why the filters were plugging up so often, until all that sediment was cleaned (pumped) out.

Water is still a bit of an issue because ethanol absorbs it and it will settle to the bottom once the ethanol becomes saturated with it. But the pumps which are submersible pumps inside the 40, 50, 60 thousand liter tanks are positioned approx 1 or 2 centimeters from the bottom. So if there’s any water in there it’ll be pumped out well before it can collect in any great amount; not enough to cause any running issues in vehicles anyway. I’m also talking about water that has collected by moisture in the air not water due to a tank leak or some other form.

I know for sure the pumps were that far down inside the tanks because when I dipped the tanks, they would quit pumping at about a centimeter.

 

Dan.