Jiffy auger help...

[Fisherpete]

Hey guys and gals... last March I picked up a Jiffy Stealth STX 10" 3hp auger. I only used it 4 times that March, and noticed that it was very difficult to start - like 20 or 25 pulls every time. Took it out yesterday and same story. It often stalls when running too. You can cut a hole or 2, then it stalls... have to keep priming it too just to get it running. I am thinking there might be some sort of fuel delivery problem? It has fresh gas, properly mixed to 40:1. It is still under warranty, and if all else fails, I will take it in for servicing, but does anyone have any suggestions for me to try? I don't want to have any down time once Lady Simcoe is ready!

[irishfield]

3HP should have a jet screw... turn it in fully (lightly.. no forcing) and count the turns to see how it was set.... and then back it out 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 turns and see how it goes.

[mbac31]

I always had that problem and i did what irishfield said but also ran seafoam or starbrite in the gas. ran like a charm. check their site for better tuning tips.

[Big Cliff]

If it is still under warranty, TAKE IT BACK! Depending on which carb is on it, YOU may not be able to adjust the jets yourself and if you do adjust the jets and set it too lean, you'll toast the motor in no time and that won't be covered under warranty. You are right, it could be a fuel problem, most likely with the choke from what you describe but until I hear it working and see for myself what it is doing, I wouldn't put any money on it. There are a lot of things that could make it hard to start and run badly. Faulty ignition coil, improperly set ignition coil, a bad spark plug.....

[discophish]

Check the gap on the plug too. Out of the box mine was over double what it should have been. Not sure what the STX model should be at. Check the site for specs, they will be posted. Good luck!

[richyb]

Also dont forget to open the air valve on the gas cap. My buddies would cut a hole or 2 then stall and he was forgetting to open it and it wouldnt suck gas.

[Fish Farmer]

Had the same problem years ago with my Jiffy 30, I did the same thing as Wayne (Irishfield) said, Problem fixed. Some times that screw vibrates out or may have got bumped.

Edited January 9, 2010 by Fish Farmer

[Dabluz]

It's the same age old problem with all tiny carburetors....they get clogged up real easy.

 

If you ever have a chance to get a good look at the gas you get at the pump, you will be surprised at how much junk you will find in gas. Tiny engins with tiny carbs and jets etc are real easy to mess up. Also.....everybody does the same thing when operating small engins. When they are finished using the thing....they turn it off. This is a "no-no". At the end of the day, you should let the engin run but you cut off the gas supply at the tank so that all the gas in the carb and gas line burns off. This way, the gas in these components will not evaporate and leave a gunky mess behind in the process.

 

What you will need to do is just take the carb bowl off the carb, clean everything in the bowl and then the needle valve that is operated by the float in the bowl. Then you clean the needle and main jet. Sounds complicated but takes only about 15 minutes if you take your time and if you are not a total donkey, you will not break anything.

 

I've done this procedure hundreds of times at home and in the bush for people who have trouble with their small engines. 1.2 h.p. Tanaka engines are the ones I see running bad all the time. I think it takes me about 3 minutes to do a clean up job on the carb on those engines. There are lots of those engines in my region because it is dotted with small brook trout lakes and everybody goes fishing with a canoe and tiny engine. Last spring, I cleaned a Tanaka carb at a nearby lake. It was hard to start and when it did, it would not run. They guy had just paid 50 dollars for a checkup. It was very obvious that nothing had been done. I even showed him how to do it by telling him what to do and letting him do it. He wanted to pay me....lol.

 

Make sure the gas is as clean as possible when filling the tank....use a good filter or use a filter when filling you plastic gas can. You can also add a little filter to the gas line between the tank and the carb. There are some tiny filters that will do a great job and install in 2 minutes.

 

I have picked up gas powered leaf blowers, grass cutters, water pumps, small outboards etc that people have thrown in the garbage and 90% of the time, it's just a dirty carb.

Edited January 9, 2010 by Dabluz

[Dabluz]

Oh yes....I forgot to say that a new spark plug is not a luxury. I've often seen where an apparently good looking spark plug was the problem.

[ld17]

Ah the story about the auger that won't run. Let me tell you I feel for you sir. I bought a jiffy at the end of 08 start of 09 and got it home and did everything the manual said and after many pulls I finally got my jiffy started. Took it fishing and for the life of me could not get it started. Finally and after many pulls I got it started and cut one hole and she died on me and would not start again. The next day I tried to start her again and nothing. I'm thinking the piece of junk is brand new and is this hard to start no way man and back to the store to return it I did. After searching many posts on the net about this, I came to the conclusion that you either get a lemon or you get a good one. I went out and bought another model jiffy and this one runs no problem right out of the box. I used it all last year and since the start of this year it runs and starts no problem. So for me it confirms the theory of you either get a good one or a bad one out of the box. I would bring it in for service or return and get another one. Hope this helps and I'm pretty sure you not alone on this one.

[Dabluz]

Small gas engines are not complicated at all and almost invariably, the problem is small. However, in LD17 case, I would have done the same....unless I did not take certain steps to ensure that my auger would restart....such as to let it run until the carb is empty. You do this at the end of the day. The empty carb bowl ensures that the needle valve (the one actionned by the float in the bowl), will not stick in place. There is a bit of rubber on this valve and it will stick closed. This problem is reduced when there is less oil in the fuel mixture because as the gas evaporates, there is a bit less gunk left behind. However, I do add a bit more oil than the manufacturers recommendation. Yes, there is a tad more exhaust smoke and the plug gets dirtier faster but the engine does run a bit cooler but will last longer.

 

These tiny engines need to be run often. Look at how long a person can use a chainsaw, a grass cutter. These small engines also power a machine similar to a grass cutter but it has a blade to cut small trees. Guys use these machines for 10 to 12 hours a day almost non-stop from May to October.

 

I often see guys start up their auger and immediately cut a hole and then immediately turn off the engine and not use it again until the next outing. Do this to a car engine and it also will be hard to start after a while and when it does run, it will be a while before it runs good. Cut a couple of holes at a time...without shutting down the engine between holes. Be generous and cut a few holes for those who do not have an auger. You can even make money cutting holes for other fishermen. I know guys who make enough money to buy a new auger each year and still make a few dollars to pay for a few fishing items and tank their vehicule every once in a while. I know that some guys would give quite a bit to have a half dozen holes cut for them.

Edited January 10, 2010 by Dabluz

[Big Cliff]

Small gas engines are not complicated at all and almost invariably, the problem is small. However, in LD17 case, I would have done the same....unless I did not take certain steps to ensure that my auger would restart....such as to let it run until the carb is empty. You do this at the end of the day. The empty carb bowl ensures that the needle valve (the one actionned by the float in the bowl), will not stick in place. There is a bit of rubber on this valve and it will stick closed. This problem is reduced when there is less oil in the fuel mixture because as the gas evaporates, there is a bit less gunk left behind. However, I do add a bit more oil than the manufacturers recommendation. Yes, there is a tad more exhaust smoke and the plug gets dirtier faster but the engine does run a bit cooler but will last longer.

 

These tiny engines need to be run often. Look at how long a person can use a chainsaw, a grass cutter. These small engines also power a machine similar to a grass cutter but it has a blade to cut small trees. Guys use these machines for 10 to 12 hours a day almost non-stop from May to October.

 

I often see guys start up their auger and immediately cut a hole and then immediately turn off the engine and not use it again until the next outing. Do this to a car engine and it also will be hard to start after a while and when it does run, it will be a while before it runs good. Cut a couple of holes at a time...without shutting down the engine between holes. Be generous and cut a few holes for those who do not have an auger. You can even make money cutting holes for other fishermen. I know guys who make enough money to buy a new auger each year and still make a few dollars to pay for a few fishing items and tank their vehicule every once in a while. I know that some guys would give quite a bit to have a half dozen holes cut for them.

 

Those carbs don't use a "float" they use a metering diaphragm which is activated by changes in the crank case pressure and atmospheric pressure. The needle tip is neoprene with a graphite coating and shouldn't stick unless stale fuel is left in it and gums it up. Running them out of fuel all the time isn't always a good thing as the engine runs lean for a few seconds as the last of the fuel gets used up and the air fuel ratio changes, if you are going to run it out of fuel, let it idle until it quits. Running an engine out of fuel won't blow your engine up but it does cause it to run with a lack of proper lubrication and if you run it at full throttle it just causes the engine to go through more revolutions and causes more wear on the components and will shorten the life of the engine.

 

Use a good quality fuel stabilizer, the proper oil fuel mixture, a GOOD quality 2 cycle oil (yes, there is a big difference) and you will extend the life of your engine and enjoy better performance. If it isn't running properly, get it serviced by someone thet KNOWS what they are doing and has the tools to do it properly. A digital tachometer is one of the most importand pieces of equipment in my tool box. You'd be amazed at how many things come into our shop that someone has tried to tune up; "It was purring like a kitten then just quit and now it won't start"! You check the piston and cylinder and sure enough, scored all to heck, someone had run it too lean!

 

Dabluz, you may not think they are complicated but the technology required to meet the EPA regulations has made the setup and fine tuning of these engines critical; stratified engines are desigined to run with very precice air fuel ratios and the engines are desigined to produce maximum torque at specific RPMs.

 

Lastly, almost every one of those carbs have limiter caps on the adjusting screws because of EPA regulations. The penilty for removing those limiters and not re insatlling them is $25,000.00 for each offence. That is a lot of fishing gear!

[irishfield]

You turned those screws yet Pete ???

[Fisherpete]

No... no time yet to try any adjustments yet... this week I am off from Wednesday to Saturday, and will be hitting the ice at least twice on those days. I think I will just see how she does this week and then take it in for warranty service after that if it does not get any better. All the discussion of damaging cylinders, running it too lean, voiding warranties etc. has me worried about tinkering with it myself...

[irishfield]

[Big Cliff]

No... no time yet to try any adjustments yet... this week I am off from Wednesday to Saturday, and will be hitting the ice at least twice on those days. I think I will just see how she does this week and then take it in for warranty service after that if it does not get any better. All the discussion of damaging cylinders, running it too lean, voiding warranties etc. has me worried about tinkering with it myself...

 

If you are coming up my way let me know, I can do it for you under warranty, otherwise call the Mfg. and find out where your closest warranty depot is and take it into them.

[Dabluz]

Those carbs don't use a "float" they use a metering diaphragm which is activated by changes in the crank case pressure and atmospheric pressure. The needle tip is neoprene with a graphite coating and shouldn't stick unless stale fuel is left in it and gums it up. Running them out of fuel all the time isn't always a good thing as the engine runs lean for a few seconds as the last of the fuel gets used up and the air fuel ratio changes, if you are going to run it out of fuel, let it idle until it quits. Running an engine out of fuel won't blow your engine up but it does cause it to run with a lack of proper lubrication and if you run it at full throttle it just causes the engine to go through more revolutions and causes more wear on the components and will shorten the life of the engine.

 

Use a good quality fuel stabilizer, the proper oil fuel mixture, a GOOD quality 2 cycle oil (yes, there is a big difference) and you will extend the life of your engine and enjoy better performance. If it isn't running properly, get it serviced by someone thet KNOWS what they are doing and has the tools to do it properly. A digital tachometer is one of the most importand pieces of equipment in my tool box. You'd be amazed at how many things come into our shop that someone has tried to tune up; "It was purring like a kitten then just quit and now it won't start"! You check the piston and cylinder and sure enough, scored all to heck, someone had run it too lean!

 

Dabluz, you may not think they are complicated but the technology required to meet the EPA regulations has made the setup and fine tuning of these engines critical; stratified engines are desigined to run with very precice air fuel ratios and the engines are desigined to produce maximum torque at specific RPMs.

 

Lastly, almost every one of those carbs have limiter caps on the adjusting screws because of EPA regulations. The penilty for removing those limiters and not re insatlling them is $25,000.00 for each offence. That is a lot of fishing gear!

 

Thanks for the heads up. I'm familiar with old engines. Yes...I do mean letting the motor idle until it runs out of gas.

 

I was just talking to a buddy and he just bought a 2 h.p. Jiffy auger and is disappointed. It is harder to start than the Eskimo. It also has much more plastic and only a single blade. He regrets not buying an Eskimo. I'll have to get a close look at the carb setup on these newer machines.

 

I still use an 8 inch manual auger....I like the exercise. More often than not, I just use a homemade ice ice chisel (spud) when I want to make holes. It may not be as fast but it keeps me moving and warm when it's very cold...lol. I'm old, diabetic, heart problems, wearing a pace maker/defibrillator and I still prefer to remove snow from my 10 car sized driveway manually and cut my ice manually. I also do some icefishing in remote lakes so snowshoeing 1/2 to 1 mile with a gas auger is not much fun. I even made a spud that I can attach to a small tree trimmed of it's branches and not having to tow a sled behind me.

[irishfield]

Not sure what his issue is Dabluz... I can't keep my 2 HP Jiffy Legend 9" away from the guys. Single scraper blade that rips through 3 feet of ice...light weight over a shoulder and drills hole after hole !!

 

I did notice this year that the entire thing is plastic though.. not sure how long that's gonna last.

 

As for Pete... I think he's happy now.. tomorrow on the ice will tell..