cormorant

[carp-starter]

Here are some articles and PICS that I have kept over the years.

 

Carp-starter

 

 

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQ...2_5/ai_61555402

 

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/stor...cormorants.html

 

http://www.blueheronco.com/jrs/cormorants.htm

 

http://www.ofah.org/Cormorants/News.cfm?A=Grab&DocID=16

 

http://www.ofncommunity.com/forums/index.p...mp;hl=cormorant

from April 2007

 

http://forums.quintefishing.com/phpBB2/vie...11f73fa9d58ac7c

TRYING TO STOP A CULL

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770

Danbo’s PIC is here and other pics – swallowing a pike

 

http://network.bestfriends.org/canada/news/2493.html

and besides destroying the fish populations...what goes in must come out and pollute the water

 

http://www.fishingnj.org/artcormorant.htm

[BITEME]

Im a tree hugger always have been but I hunt and fish. I dont sit at home and read books all day, I dont have a university degree in biology or zoo ology but i do have a good feel for what is going on around me .I have watched them swallow every native fish in my area and wished i had a gun each time Im not sorry to say this .

I like animals and dont say that lightly the balance is off, having said that and grown up on the shores of the Big O I can tell you this the commorants need to be thinned out the population has exploded .Someone said they saw a bunch around Port credit well I can tell you that flock looked like an oil slick and by GPS was almost 1km by 1 km and they were feeding(picture locasts) they have now started hunting in the rivers people this is bad news. All these rivers are feeders for the stock of the lake.

All these bleeding hearts need to be dragged out to Toronto islands and dropped off for a day the devestation out there is phenominal words cannot explain you need to see it to believe it. The birds are out of control I dont need a degree to see this I really dont believe people at this moment in time are the reason for the decline in stocks the commorants are!

They need to be dealt with now in a very heavy handed way I dont think they should be wiped out but thinned out in a big way why does nobody want to listen to us but spend millions of dollars on expensive talent that takes years to write up something that is politically driven and dictated

TO ANYONE THAT IS LISTENING FROM THE MNR WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE WE HAVE A MAJOR PROBLEM [/b]it needs to be dealt with and yep there is going to be some very unhappy people but the eco system is in danger.

 

JM2C

[pike slayer]

totally agree with you biteme. they should be thinned out but not wipd off the face of this earth. cut them down to 1/10th. they are probably making great money off us buy charging ppl for killing them

[highdrifter]

They certainly are gawd aweful creatures.. Apparently they can unhinge their lower jaw to engulf larger fish, like that unfortunate pike.

 

While I'm all for taking them out with deadly force, napalm comes to mind, I don't agree that low fish stocks are a result of their population getting larger..

 

We've been seeing them for years at the Leslie Spit, and while they do tend to hunt locally, I attribute other factors like poor water quality, overfishing and habitat loss to getting skunked... I also think the fish are getting wiser. Our success rate in the harbour has dropped, big time, but I don't blame the cormorants... They've been here for years, and it's only recently that we're seeing less fish.

 

I'd like to see them culled, but for other reasons. They're displacing other species like Black Crested Night herons, their guano is toxic to plants and the stench is absolutely over powering, and let's face, they look like they were created from the depths of hell.

 

It's kinda like what the biologists are saying. Eventually, other factors like habitat loss(they're crapping themselves outta house and home) and disease will take it's toll. There's an asian flu strain just waiting to reak havoc on them. But that's another story altogether.

 

I've heard making noise greatly affects roosting (kinda like what they use at airports). Something like a small detonation, placed at regular time intervals, outta send them beasties packing!! Ya affect roosting and feeding, you directly affect the survival rate of the chicks.

 

Oiling eggs with mineral oil works very well also, but only ground nests are accessible... that leaves alota burds..

 

While I know that their hunger for fish can have an affect on fish stocks, I also know that there's millions of fish lake O, and actually, the smallie fishery is actually improving in our area. Go figure..

 

Good judgement outta be considered here. Anyone caught killing such an animal runs the risk of heavy fines, revoked fishing priviledges and having their equipment taken away. Nuts to that!!

 

All creatures, no matter how vile, have a right to be here. We only have ourselves to blame for any disruption in the natural world. The DDT ban may be what is bringing these birds back, but the warming of the planet is what's broadening their distribution.

 

JM2C.

 

HD

[tomO]

I've seen them down here on the ohio river the last few springs. I'm 3 hours south of lake erie'

[waterwolf]

if you can reach the nesting sites ,, destroy the eggs and nest!!! oiling ?? what's that? band-aids are pretty for the soft hearted .

shotguns get the job done in the hands of trained , licenced hunters.!!! spring fast approaches and so do the flocks of feathered

ECO-SHOP-VACS.

this rant was born between the gunnels of my sportspal canoe , in a beautiful back-bay , not a breeze ,,,gorgeous,,,,,,but what's this ,, a tree not in green foliage ,, but one taken over by a terminator ,, the BLACK DEATH!!

[ctdd2006]

nothing scarier (for me anyway) than seeing them circle a huge school of bait fish and watch them them do their thing! I've witnessed this a few times in Providence Bay on Manitoulin Island while salmon fishing! Unreal sight! We wonder why the salmon numbers are both down in size (pure fish girth/weight) and numbers. I say eradicate!

[BassAsin]

nothing scarier (for me anyway) than seeing them circle a huge school of bait fish and watch them them do their thing! I've witnessed this a few times in Providence Bay on Manitoulin Island while salmon fishing! Unreal sight! We wonder why the salmon numbers are both down in size (pure fish girth/weight) and numbers. I say eradicate!

i am originally from espanola and fish the island a fair amount and the sight of them around the manitou and blue jay creek in michaels bay in the spring taking down fingerling salmon is a hard sight to see. the only fair thing to do is have a culling system by hunters and fisherman (with licenses) of courses to take them down and report an approximate number of kills made then the goverment can open and close "the season" on these creatures as necesary to keep the population down to a minimun a few of these birds isnt a terrible thing but the numbers we are seeing is un real and needs to be taken care of and if u are a P3TA person so be it we as humans have the death penalty for certain crimes so why not for this black bird of DEATH? it is important to keep a balance but we all know how boring the teeter totter is when the other kid is twice yours size,!

[waterwolf]

what's really disturbing is that i've seen the video of the lead-in picture to this thread,, that cormorant actually eats the pike!!!

the tail hangs out of the birds? mouth 3-4 inches [lack of digestion track] not of this world i say!!

[kentooley]

I found this on another site.

 

Report Post to Administrator

Controversy over cormorant cull about to re-ignite

 

 

 

If you think that Scott Anderson's argument below ... to bring back the cormorant cull at Presquile, makes the most logical sense - then be sure to send an email to the contact at the end of this article before Dec 29/08.

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Controversy over cormorant cull about to re-ignite

The Community Press

December 16, 2008

Brighton –

 

The possible return of a cormorant cull at Presquile Provincial Park after a two-year absence has once again aroused strong emotions on both sides of the issue.

 

The Ministry of Natural Resources has given the public until Dec. 29 to respond to a proposed project that includes managing cormorant populations on Gull and High Bluff Islands in Presquile.

 

The ministry had a cormorant management plan in place until last year. Between 2003 and 2007, it reduced the bird’s numbers by oiling 91,760 eggs, and removing 13,020 nests. From 2004 to 2006, more than 10,800 cormorants were culled.

 

The ministry’s goal was to protect woodland habitat that is important to several species that are under threat throughout the Great Lakes, such as the monarch butterfly, the black-crowned night heron and the great egret.

 

Corina Brdar, a zone ecologist for the MNR, says Ontario Parks "scientifically assessed" the results of cormorant management in Presquile and found that it “was effective in decreasing the damage to woodland habitat,” and allowing the trees and shrubs to begin to recover.

 

However, in 2008, without any management plan in place, cormorant numbers increased and the birds “colonized new, live trees for nesting, many of which are in areas used as habitat by other species.”

 

The MNR says “an ecosystem-based implementation plan is needed for the Presquile Islands because the ecological integrity of the woodlands has been affected by both deer and cormorants,” Brdar said in a release. The proposal for cormorant management activities requires an environmental study report and public comment when the draft plan is released. A separate implementation plan for wildlife and vegetation management on the mainland will also be prepared and opportunity given for public to comment on it as well.

 

The ministry’s intention to reintroduce a management plan doesn’t sit well with some in the community but finds favor with others.

 

Doug McRae, a local naturalist, takes the view that the cormorants arrived in the area naturally and should be left alone.

 

“I’m of the belief that where there is a good argument for it, I can see managing cormorants, but I don’t believe there is a good argument for managing them at Presquile,” McRae said.

 

Populations of different bird species that have made their habitat in large numbers in Presquile, such as the common tern, have naturally decreased, he said.

 

“It’s not a static thing. In the 1950s Presquile had the largest common tern colony in North America but they faded by the 1970s and recently were replaced by ring-billed gulls, and at one point we had the largest population of ring-billed gulls nesting in the great lakes. These things are reflecting the environmental conditions that we live in.”

 

Many of the cormorants are dying of botulism, McRae said.

“My bet is that if we were to leave it alone cormorants would be uncommon in the future.”

 

Fred Helleiner, a bird watcher respected for his knowledge of bird habitat in Presquile, agrees with McRae that there is an aesthetic prejudice against the cormorant. The bird, referred to by early European settlers as the “crow duck,” is not considered attractive.

 

“If they were white like swans, which are actually a lot more damaging to the environment, they would love them, ” Helleiner said, referring to those who dislike the bird.

 

He said nature should be allowed to take care of itself.

“We don’t know enough to monkey around with individual elements in the system, without knowing how the whole system is going to respond,” Helleiner said, warning that the ecosystem is so complex that it could be disrupted by a cull.

 

Scott Anderson, a resident of Presquile Bay, supports reducing cormorant numbers, even though they’re “magnificent birds to watch” in pursuit their prey. There are just too many of them.

 

“They literally destroy all the vegetation. They leave a layer of guano, that’s crap to ordinary people. And in fresh water, it’s deadly. It’s just like if you had a sewage treatment plant and you never bothered processing stuff and shoving it right into the lake. Saltwater and oceans absorb a lot of this but fresh water can’t.”

 

He has no objection to 100 or 200 pairs in Presquile, but when their numbers reach the thousands they should be managed, he said.

 

“Don’t get me wrong. I love nature. I help nature every chance I get. I’ve planted thousands of trees in my time,” Anderson said. “The thing about these naturalists, they are very one-track-minded. They say you should leave everything and let it run its natural course. Well, if everything ran its natural course, guess what, we’d all be dead before we were 50. We cheat nature like you wouldn’t believe.”

 

McRae said cormorants shouldn’t be singled out as for their impact on the environment.

 

“Cormorants kill trees where they nest; they always have and they always will. They are colonial birds which means they nest in large groups. All colonial birds kill vegetation with their droppings,” McRae said.

 

The cormorants have made their home on Gull and High Bluff islands, a bird sanctuary, and they should be left alone, he said.

 

McRae doesn’t buy the argument that the cormorant is affecting the number of rare birds seen at Presquile. “The rare birds that are nesting in those trees started nesting in Presquile after the cormorant had killed the trees,” he said, referring specifically to the great egret and the great blue heron. “I believe the cormorants promote biodiversity rather than limit it.”

 

The method of culling also distresses McRae, which he finds cruel; in 2004, the peak of the cull, 6,030 were shot.

They were killed “with .22 caliber rifles fitted with four power scopes, using a .22 calibre hollow-point subsonic bullet,” the MNR stated in a report on its strategy assessment for 2003-2006.

 

The disturbance to the bird habitat and the estimate that one-in-three cormorants fly off the island wounded concerns McRae.

 

They sometimes flap around with a broken wing for days, he said. “Can you imagine if the deer cull was conducted in such a way that a deer was seen running through the park for days with a broken leg or a leg shot off?”

 

The naturalists have also expressed concern to the ministry about the dead cormorant carcasses left on the island after they were culled.

 

“The Ministry of Environment forced the park to go out at the end of the summer and clean up these huge piles of dead cormorants that they’d piled up on High Bluff Island,” Helleiner said. The composted material was transported from High Bluff island in autumn 2005 and deposited in the landfill site in Brighton,” the MNR reported.

 

One group that is in favor of the cull is the anglers and hunters.

 

They’ve told the Ministry of Environment that cormorants consume large, major sport fish such as lake trout and salmon as well as feed on the same prey fish that large predatory fish need for food. They also blame cormorants for depleting local supplies of pan fish, such as perch and bass.

 

The ministry counters that studies of cormorant diets in Lake Ontario show that less than two per cent of the prey found in cormorants is lake trout or salmon. Moreover, cormorants consume less than one per cent of the prey fish, “which is insignificant when compared to about 13 per cent taken by sport fish,” the MOE says on its website.

 

Not enough fish, too many birds – nature doesn’t balance things the way people would like it, Anderson said. “Everything in Mother Nature comes in twos, either too much or too little.”

 

Man should manage nature, he said. “It just blows my mind that people would allow wildlife to suddenly run amok. It’s like raccoons; there are more raccoons in North America than there were at the turn of the century because nobody’s hunting them,” Anderson said. “Human beings are managed very well, so why shouldn’t we do the same for wildlife.”

 

Brdnar, in reply to questions from The Community Press, explained in an e-mail that it is still “early in the planning stages for this project. However, we do know that the cost will be less than in previous years because our goal would be protection of specific treed habitat areas, rather than all treed areas of the islands as was done in the past. For this reason, any necessary culling would likely be on a smaller scale than in the past, and the need to cull would be determined each year based on monitoring results from previous years.”

 

The original management plan was for four years and was extended for another year. The one currently being developed can continue year after year for 10 years “once full public consultation has been completed.”

 

Initial comments regarding the project can be sent to Corina Brdar, Zone Ecologist, Ontario Parks, Southeast Zone, 51 Heakes Lane, Kingston, Ontario K7M 9B1 or by e-mail to [email protected]

[profisher25]

This picture is amazing!!!

[kemper]

If a flock of cormorants walked in front of my car, Id forget where the brakes were.

[Ramble]

I was pretty excited to see the cormorant cull at Presquile getting looked at again. I'm pretty sure the MNR has "the line drawn in the sand" for those islands and the habitat over there, tho i'm not sure why that is the chosen battle grounds. They also have the deer cull back on the list as a management tool as well.

 

I knew some of the wardens who conducted the cull their in years past, and you would believe the protesters that would show up. It's crazy.

 

I saw some stats not too long ago on cormorant population numbers, and it looks like the are near carrying capacity for the great lakes region, and will probably drop a little in a few years once the system has established their presence. They are still spreading however. We are seeing up North at Kesagami in the summer....64 miles south of James bay.

 

Some isn't in balance with the system while you look at their numbers...something is missing. Weather they are lacking a keystone predator or competition something is off. But of course when populaiton densities get too high nature sorts that out with disease. Cormorants are pretty tolerant to botulism and a few other diseases like that, so it'll be interesting to see what will balance the scales if we don't.

 

-R-

[holdfast]

And thats why I like Darrel Cron, hes been advocating this since I first seen his show. By the way I like his show.

[superdad]

Cormorant Cull _ Here's your Chance to Speak UP

 

This was posted on the Quinte Site - FYI

 

David aka Superdad

 

 

Controversy over cormorant cull about to re-ignite

The Community Press

December 16, 2008

Brighton –

 

The possible return of a cormorant cull at Presquile Provincial Park after a two-year absence has once again aroused strong emotions on both sides of the issue.

 

The Ministry of Natural Resources has given the public until Dec. 29 to respond to a proposed project that includes managing cormorant populations on Gull and High Bluff Islands in Presquile.

 

The ministry had a cormorant management plan in place until last year. Between 2003 and 2007, it reduced the bird’s numbers by oiling 91,760 eggs, and removing 13,020 nests. From 2004 to 2006, more than 10,800 cormorants were culled.

 

The ministry’s goal was to protect woodland habitat that is important to several species that are under threat throughout the Great Lakes, such as the monarch butterfly, the black-crowned night heron and the great egret.

 

Corina Brdar, a zone ecologist for the MNR, says Ontario Parks "scientifically assessed" the results of cormorant management in Presquile and found that it “was effective in decreasing the damage to woodland habitat,” and allowing the trees and shrubs to begin to recover.

 

However, in 2008, without any management plan in place, cormorant numbers increased and the birds “colonized new, live trees for nesting, many of which are in areas used as habitat by other species.”

 

The MNR says “an ecosystem-based implementation plan is needed for the Presquile Islands because the ecological integrity of the woodlands has been affected by both deer and cormorants,” Brdar said in a release. The proposal for cormorant management activities requires an environmental study report and public comment when the draft plan is released. A separate implementation plan for wildlife and vegetation management on the mainland will also be prepared and opportunity given for public to comment on it as well.

 

The ministry’s intention to reintroduce a management plan doesn’t sit well with some in the community but finds favor with others.

 

Doug McRae, a local naturalist, takes the view that the cormorants arrived in the area naturally and should be left alone.

 

“I’m of the belief that where there is a good argument for it, I can see managing cormorants, but I don’t believe there is a good argument for managing them at Presquile,” McRae said.

 

Populations of different bird species that have made their habitat in large numbers in Presquile, such as the common tern, have naturally decreased, he said.

 

“It’s not a static thing. In the 1950s Presquile had the largest common tern colony in North America but they faded by the 1970s and recently were replaced by ring-billed gulls, and at one point we had the largest population of ring-billed gulls nesting in the great lakes. These things are reflecting the environmental conditions that we live in.”

 

Many of the cormorants are dying of botulism, McRae said.

“My bet is that if we were to leave it alone cormorants would be uncommon in the future.”

 

Fred Helleiner, a bird watcher respected for his knowledge of bird habitat in Presquile, agrees with McRae that there is an aesthetic prejudice against the cormorant. The bird, referred to by early European settlers as the “crow duck,” is not considered attractive.

 

“If they were white like swans, which are actually a lot more damaging to the environment, they would love them, ” Helleiner said, referring to those who dislike the bird.

 

He said nature should be allowed to take care of itself.

“We don’t know enough to monkey around with individual elements in the system, without knowing how the whole system is going to respond,” Helleiner said, warning that the ecosystem is so complex that it could be disrupted by a cull.

 

Scott Anderson, a resident of Presquile Bay, supports reducing cormorant numbers, even though they’re “magnificent birds to watch” in pursuit their prey. There are just too many of them.

 

“They literally destroy all the vegetation. They leave a layer of guano, that’s crap to ordinary people. And in fresh water, it’s deadly. It’s just like if you had a sewage treatment plant and you never bothered processing stuff and shoving it right into the lake. Saltwater and oceans absorb a lot of this but fresh water can’t.”

 

He has no objection to 100 or 200 pairs in Presquile, but when their numbers reach the thousands they should be managed, he said.

 

“Don’t get me wrong. I love nature. I help nature every chance I get. I’ve planted thousands of trees in my time,” Anderson said. “The thing about these naturalists, they are very one-track-minded. They say you should leave everything and let it run its natural course. Well, if everything ran its natural course, guess what, we’d all be dead before we were 50. We cheat nature like you wouldn’t believe.”

 

McRae said cormorants shouldn’t be singled out as for their impact on the environment.

 

“Cormorants kill trees where they nest; they always have and they always will. They are colonial birds which means they nest in large groups. All colonial birds kill vegetation with their droppings,” McRae said.

 

The cormorants have made their home on Gull and High Bluff islands, a bird sanctuary, and they should be left alone, he said.

 

McRae doesn’t buy the argument that the cormorant is affecting the number of rare birds seen at Presquile. “The rare birds that are nesting in those trees started nesting in Presquile after the cormorant had killed the trees,” he said, referring specifically to the great egret and the great blue heron. “I believe the cormorants promote biodiversity rather than limit it.”

 

The method of culling also distresses McRae, which he finds cruel; in 2004, the peak of the cull, 6,030 were shot.

They were killed “with .22 caliber rifles fitted with four power scopes, using a .22 calibre hollow-point subsonic bullet,” the MNR stated in a report on its strategy assessment for 2003-2006.

 

The disturbance to the bird habitat and the estimate that one-in-three cormorants fly off the island wounded concerns McRae.

 

They sometimes flap around with a broken wing for days, he said. “Can you imagine if the deer cull was conducted in such a way that a deer was seen running through the park for days with a broken leg or a leg shot off?”

 

The naturalists have also expressed concern to the ministry about the dead cormorant carcasses left on the island after they were culled.

 

“The Ministry of Environment forced the park to go out at the end of the summer and clean up these huge piles of dead cormorants that they’d piled up on High Bluff Island,” Helleiner said. The composted material was transported from High Bluff island in autumn 2005 and deposited in the landfill site in Brighton,” the MNR reported.

 

One group that is in favor of the cull is the anglers and hunters.

 

They’ve told the Ministry of Environment that cormorants consume large, major sport fish such as lake trout and salmon as well as feed on the same prey fish that large predatory fish need for food. They also blame cormorants for depleting local supplies of pan fish, such as perch and bass.

 

The ministry counters that studies of cormorant diets in Lake Ontario show that less than two per cent of the prey found in cormorants is lake trout or salmon. Moreover, cormorants consume less than one per cent of the prey fish, “which is insignificant when compared to about 13 per cent taken by sport fish,” the MOE says on its website.

 

Not enough fish, too many birds – nature doesn’t balance things the way people would like it, Anderson said. “Everything in Mother Nature comes in twos, either too much or too little.”

 

Man should manage nature, he said. “It just blows my mind that people would allow wildlife to suddenly run amok. It’s like raccoons; there are more raccoons in North America than there were at the turn of the century because nobody’s hunting them,” Anderson said. “Human beings are managed very well, so why shouldn’t we do the same for wildlife.”

 

Brdnar, in reply to questions from The Community Press, explained in an e-mail that it is still “early in the planning stages for this project. However, we do know that the cost will be less than in previous years because our goal would be protection of specific treed habitat areas, rather than all treed areas of the islands as was done in the past. For this reason, any necessary culling would likely be on a smaller scale than in the past, and the need to cull would be determined each year based on monitoring results from previous years.”

 

The original management plan was for four years and was extended for another year. The one currently being developed can continue year after year for 10 years “once full public consultation has been completed.”

 

Initial comments regarding the project can be sent to Corina Brdar, Zone Ecologist, Ontario Parks, Southeast Zone, 51 Heakes Lane, Kingston, Ontario K7M 9B1 or by e-mail to [email protected]

_________________

[kentooley]

Hey All!!!!

 

Still time to get those emails out! (Before Dec 29/08)

 

The original management plan was for four years and was extended for another year. The one currently being developed can continue year after year for 10 years “once full public consultation has been completed.”

 

Initial comments regarding the project can be sent to Corina Brdar, Zone Ecologist, Ontario Parks, Southeast Zone, 51 Heakes Lane, Kingston, Ontario K7M 9B1 or by e-mail to [email protected]

 

Cheers

 

Chris

Edited December 22, 2008 by verminator