Need some advice on buying new boat

[PERCHER]

I agree when it comes to boats bigger is better specaily on large bodies of water.But its not always the length of the boat to take into consideration.Its hull depth and beam.There is NO reason why a 16ft boat with a deep hull and wide beam cant be used on the Great lakes.I own a Lund Classic 16ft with an 84" beam and a 50hp 4 stroke .This boat is used on lake Ontario for Salmon.This boat handles Lake Ontario with no problem at all.And as well a 4 stroke outboard will get the same or better fuel economy than an i/o of the same horsepower.Most 4 stroke outboards are fuel injected where as most i/o are carb.Some other problems may arise from a larger boat such as storage ,towing and being a little large for some of the smaller lakes.Just some food for thought.Dan

[jedimaster]

Yah The depth and V angle play a big role on the rough water ability. Depending on the exact model of the alluminum it may be ok, but in generaly Alluminums are not that great on rougher water at slower speeds. EG a 21 foot bass boat at trolling speed in 2-3 foot waves and I will take a 17 foot bowrider any day of the week.

However at full speed a 21 foot bass boat will bridge the peaks and will run smoother on plane.

It all depends on your style of boating and the waves on the lake.

In general a 17 foot fiberglass bowrider will be better for a big lake than a 17 foot or less

alluminum. And for Sub 10 thousand dollars to find a 4 stroker ouboard on a good rough water boat will be difficult to impossible to find unless you go to yankee land.

 

In the end get the boat that you want to get, not the one that everyone else thinks you should get. Its your boat you gotta trailer and use it.

 

Deep V's for rough water, Longer the better for on plane performance, For trolling comfort get one that sits deep in the water, for mileage get a 4 stroke or IO, for performance get a 2 stroke.

[Fisherman]

Deep V's for rough water, Longer the better for on plane performance, For trolling comfort get one that sits deep in the water, for mileage get a 4 stroke or IO, for performance get a 2 stroke.

The only difference in performance between a 2/4 stroke may be a couple of seconds at best, like going from 0 to blast off in a second or two less, meanwhile for the remaining hours you're trolling around the "blue could from hell" follows you around and makes you sick.

[jedimaster]

ha ha yah, trolled with a friend in his bass boat for like 2 minutes and thats all I could take. I was like dude, give me my slow bowrider with an IO any day.

4 stroke is the way to go.

[icefisherman]

Waooo guys,

 

I really appreciate your discussion you've had today. Let me try tio clarify more my boat intentions based on what I've learned from your posts and PM's over the last few days.......

 

1) It does look more and more it'll be a fiberglas boat as I'll be using it more on the Great Lakes (Ontario and Erie) and as you know I need to be ready for 3-6' waves with it. Everyone said fiberglas is better in the waves on the Great Lakes then aluminium. Add to that I was told I drive it too hard and the picture is clear..... Besides I am too used to not a drop of water in my boat until now and am a bit concerned about having to run my bilge pump all day as many aluminium boats do.

 

2) I MUST stay between 17' and 18'. Hope closer to 18 if I could but I MUST be able to put it in my garage even if I have to pay extra to modify the tong in to foldable one. Someone told me Cabelas sells kits for $100 which is not bad. My garage is 20' long and about 8' wide. It is double car garage but with separate doors.

 

3) Based on your advices it'll probably be inboard - as I was told those are easier to take care especially with late season fishing I often do.

 

4) I must have two motors (main and kicker) or buy kicker later but I've decided not to go on the Big lakes with a single motor any more. It'll be nice both to be 4 strokes but if the main one is two stroke and the kicker is 4 stroke that works for me too.

 

5)Anyone knows of good US internet sites to see if I could find a boat there?

 

6) I gathered from your opinions decent and not super expensive boats will be Wilker, Grew and Starcraft in fiberglas, and Sylvan, Lowe, Starcraft and Alumacraft in Aluminium.

 

I guess those are some of my main points that have crystallized for me in the last few days.

 

Really enjoy and benefit from your discussion so please keep it going.

 

Cheers and thank you.

 

Ice Fisherman

[lookinforwalleye]

I agree when it comes to boats bigger is better specaily on large bodies of water.But its not always the length of the boat to take into consideration.Its hull depth and beam.There is NO reason why a 16ft boat with a deep hull and wide beam cant be used on the Great lakes.I own a Lund Classic 16ft with an 84" beam and a 50hp 4 stroke .This boat is used on lake Ontario for Salmon.This boat handles Lake Ontario with no problem at all.And as well a 4 stroke outboard will get the same or better fuel economy than an i/o of the same horsepower.Most 4 stroke outboards are fuel injected where as most i/o are carb.Some other problems may arise from a larger boat such as storage ,towing and being a little large for some of the smaller lakes.Just some food for thought.Dan

 

With all do respect I think you meant to say that your skinny little Lund can handle the big lake when it`s calm. I would not want to be on the big lake in a boat with an 84" beam when the wind picks up a bit but thats just me. I`am a confirmed chicken crap when it comes to big waves and a small boat they don`t mix.

[PERCHER]

If you think 7 feet is skinny your wacked.And that boat will handle 4 FOOTERS PLUS>

[lookinforwalleye]

IMHO 84" is skinny for Lake O.

[Zamboni]

There are many deals on 'entry level' fiberglass boats around 16.5 because there are so many in market. Its first boat for a lot of people, then they get 2 footitis and want a bigger boat. Lots want more power for watersports-16.5 with 3 litre seems underpowered in a year for that purpose-even 4.3 gets outgrown by 'go-fast' crowd.

IMO you'll find best value for your dollars in 16.5 Glastrom/Bayliner etc about 3-4 years old. New about 16-18k, really check out engine and you should have no problems.

Might not be the traditional fishing machine but if your on the water in a safe reliable boat that's what matters. I'm running a jet boat with 190hp Sportjet....were always fishing. The boat actually rekindled my interest in fishing-its not perfect for fishing but it gets us on the water. Lake O when weather allows, Kawarthas on weekend....many weeknights to Scugog-boat in garage is great.

[Vanselena]

"2) I MUST stay between 17' and 18'. Hope closer to 18 if I could but I MUST be able to put it in my garage even if I have to pay extra to modify the tong in to foldable one. Someone told me Cabelas sells kits for $100 which is not bad. My garage is 20' long and about 8' wide. It is double car garage but with separate doors."

 

If your garage is 20' long then it's hard to imaging getting an 18' boat in there. If you consider the boat being 18' add 2' for the motor and 1' for the front of the trailer (even with a fold away tongue), you are already over 20'. someone else may want to clarify this.

 

If your garage is 8' wide then you will need to look at the trailer very carefully.

 

My suggestion would be to put in a laminated beam and join the two garage doors and buy one large single door. You could then angle a larger boat into the garage. My friend did this and has a 19' boat with a 100" beam in his garage. Yea it's aluminum and no he doesn't get spray nor bounce around when trolling.

 

Incidently I own a 16 1/2 foot aluminum boat and don't bounce around in rough water as long as I use my big motor, using the kicker motor in rough water is a little bouncy. I do get spray only when flying in rough water, on those hot days I appreciate the spray...lol

 

I've never had to run the bilge unless flying back in rough water, whoever told you that you would have to run a bilge all day with an aluminum boat, lied to you or their boat had a leak.

 

Generally aluminum boats ride the waves while fiberglass boats push through the waves. If you buy a glass boat then be carefull of the weight vs the weight of your pathfinder, you may need to consider trailer brakes.

Edited September 20, 2007 by Vanselena

[icefisherman]

My neighbour down the street has a new 2 year old Tracker in his garage. I went and measure his boat and garage tonight.

The boat (back of the boat to tip of the bow) is 16'8". His garage is 18'8" long. And his total package length is about the same 18'8". He has the boat on a slight angle (single garage door on a double car garage) and his tong if folded. Now ....simple arithmetic....if I get 18' long boat and it has approximately the same position on the trailer and it is with foldable tong everything in the above numbers should be increased by 1'4". This equals EXACTLY 20' total package length. I can always put the boat under slight angle or cut a bit from the drywall...much easier then to change the garage doors. Not to mention if I make the tong foldable myself I could make it even shorter then my neighbours by couple inches or so. Sure I'll have to be very careful and measure well the boat/trailer before buying it but I think I have very good fighting chance on fitting 18' boat inside....And it the boat is 17' or 17'6" it'll be much easier.

This is why I MUST stay with boat length not more then 18' no mater what. And it doesn't make sense to me if I am moving in size from 16' to move to less then 17'. So it has to be between 17 and 18' which I hope will make a big difference to what I am used to ride on the big lakes.

 

As far as the width it should be smaller problem as most boats I've seen in the 17'-18' range have width of 92" or less. Again my neighbour's boat has it's widest part on the boat's beam not on the trailer. So with 8' wide garage I should have no problems fitting it in.

 

It maybe tight but it is DOABLE I believe. Certainly much better then having to rent storage space for it.

 

Many people have told me if I run the boat hard in 3+ feet waves it is better to get fiberglas...hope I can find one for the right price.

My PATHFINDER is rated for 5500 lbs towing capacity and can tow two boats of that size easily. So it should have no problems what so ever with 17-18' boat no matter aluminium of fiberglas with or without trailer brakes. 17’ or 18’ aluminium boat will probably weight LESS then my 16’ fibreglass. And 17’-18’ fibreglass should not be that much heavier then my 16’ fibreglass therefore my Pathfinder should be laughing at it ;-)).

I am sure fiberglas will feel heavier towing it but I'll feel better as it'll not leak(riveted aluminium) or crack (welded aluminium) as I was warned by many more knowledgeable boater here.

 

Something like Markus' fiberglas boat listed here should fit perfectly in my garage and serve me very well on the Big lakes with its 17.5'.

Well only if he drops his price a bit ;-))

 

 

Things are slowly crystallizing here and that’s great. I do love this forum and am grateful for all the good advice given.

 

 

Cheers,

Ice Fisherman

Edited September 20, 2007 by icefisherman

[Zamboni]

3) Based on your advices it'll probably be inboard - as I was told those are easier to take care especially with late season fishing I often do.

 

Late season an outboard 2 stroke is much easier-once there is a chance of freezing the basic 4 stroke inboard must be winterized. As for easier to care for-its hard to do a tune up or necessary oil change on many IO's-especially first time. Same for winterizing, its not extremely dificult but more involved than with a 2 stroke outboard.

 

I think basic fish/ski I/O entry level boat is your best bet-just wanted to clear up the late season freeze danger. Larger boat the older it'll be for same dollars-its a trade-off in that area you really need to weigh pros & cons of. I had a small sideline business working on marine engines (until neighbours/city/gov't showed me the errors of my ways) and have seen many POS engines on recently purchased used boats-money/time spent inspecting PRE-purchase is wisely invested.

[John]

As far as the width it should be smaller problem as most boats I've seen in the 17'-18' range have width of 92" or less. Again my neighbour's boat has it's widest part on the boat's beam not on the trailer. So with 8' wide garage I should have no problems fitting it in.

 

It maybe tight but it is DOABLE I believe. Certainly much better then having to rent storage space for it.

 

 

Cheers,

Ice Fisherman

 

Don't underestimate the challenge of getting 92" of boat through 96" of garage door frame. Especially if you are at the max length and need to turn it slightly.

[Zamboni]

Don't underestimate the challenge of getting 92" of boat through 96" of garage door frame. Especially if you are at the max length and need to turn it slightly.

 

Saw guy back straight in on right bay of 2 car garage, trailer wheels butted up against board screwed to garage floor. He then blocked out left trailer wheel and placed a board about a 6 " forward and inside of R trailer wheel. Lowered the wheel at tongue of trailer-unhooked from hitch and trailer boat/swiveled to left with a seemingly effortless pull.

Trailer hitch was about 1 foot out garage door, when he moved it left to centre of garage it was few inches inside.

 

Seems safer than angling boat into garage with vehicle-may be dificult if your garage has steep incline or if your set-up is "tongue heavy" Its suprising how much you gain by pivoting the tongue to centre of garage-try it with tape measure. Key is your left wheel must be blocked well-he had a rubber chock.

[jedimaster]

Thats how I do mine. Back it in straight, put one wheel block on . unhook it and move it by hand.

 

an IO needs to be winterized earlier than an outboard as the block will not drain unless you have a 95(I think) or newer mercruiser, They have a T handle that you turn and it will drain the block completly.

For 10,000 you can find a kick ass boat in the US that would suit your needs. I still say go for an IO(3.0 mercruiser reliable and great on gas, in a 17 foot bowrider. Most every 10,000 dollar fish n ski model is designed off of a bass boat hull and will be too shallow of a draft for what your looking for. You will need to go with an All out bowrider and modify it to meet your fishing needs.

 

Four Winn's, Rinker and Glastron are the best Hulls. Glastron's to my experience are the fastest. Four Winn's have the most bell's and whistles, Rinkers are a decent middle ground.

 

I wouldn't buy a Wilker Grew or a Starcraft, they are cheap and thin hulls. I was in a 95 grew and it felt like paper compared to my much older glastron, I was in a brand new 18 foot Rinker and it was really nice but was slower than mine(Same motor 3.0 mercruiser)

 

Check out www.boattraderonline.com for Boats in the US as well as www.iboats.com

I have someone comming to look at my boat tonight, hopefully it sells, then I will be going down to pick up my new boat.

 

I am about 95 percent sure I will be getting a 1995 ProCraft Fish n Ski.

 

Just be sure of motor and Hull condition before buying in the US and don't buy one that was run in Saltwater. Especially an IO that was run in saltwater.