The thread on DSC radios(some answers to ques/comm

[BITEME]

comments are bold and underlined

 

So, as someone who just got into big lake fishing last year when I picked up my 16fter, I figured getting a VHF radio would be a good idea, and the DSC calling feature seemed to be a really good idea. Spring fishing show - radioworld special. Ask for some details and advice, end up with a Standard Horizon Eclipse DSC GX 1000S. about $100.00 bucks then I buy an antenna (actually 2, cause after trying the 8 ft on my boat it was just not going to work -see classifieds section). Another $100+. Then I drop $80.00 on the license to operate the radio (ROM-C) that you can only get through your Power Squadron. The radio course spends a fair bit of time discussing the DCS features and mentions the difference between SC 101 versus the D and makes it sound like a very viable option for us pleasure boaters and anglers who want to be safe and economical. At no point was there any discussion regarding some recent changes with regards to the SC 101 type of radio

Well, I just came across this little piece of information from another website:(from the US Coast Guard)

DSC-Equipped Marine Radios Must Meet More Rigorous Technical Standards Beginning March 25, 2011 ***

 

Beginning on March 25th, 2011, the Federal Communications Commission will prohibit the manufacture, importation, sale and installation of fixed mounted (non-portable) digital selective calling (DSC) equipped marine radios that do not meet the requirements of International Telecommunications Union (ITU-R) Recommendation M.493-11 or higher, and in the case of Class D VHF DSC equipment only, International Electrotechnical Commission (IEC) International Standard 62238. Therefore, after March 25, 2011, radios built to RTCM Standard SC-101 can no longer be manufactured, imported, sold or installed; however, previously-installed radios meeting the older standard may continue to be used. See the Official Announcement

It was the USA that implemented SC101 ( a subset of class ‘D’), I’m not aware that any other global jurisdiction did. Canada did follow suit with allowing SC101 to be sold. SC101 were probably cheaper to make in the earlier days of introducing DSC to the non-commercial marine user. Commercial vessels were not allowed to use SC101.

For the pleasure craft owner who already has an SC101 DSC radio installed there's no problem, he has a radio that functions in the marine band plus has the ability to receive and transmit distress calls and this won’t change in the future, what the radio lacks is a dedicated internal receiver that monitors channel 70, the SC101 merely automatically switches back and forth monitoring the channel the radio currently tuned to and channel 70 a number of times a second.So while I was on the website, I happened ot notice this little ditty:

 

 

*** Special Notice Regarding U.S. Coast Guard MARINE SAFETY ALERT - AUTOMATIC CHANNEL

SWITCHING ON DSC-EQUIPPED RADIOS. ***

 

Certain models of Digital Selective Calling (DSC) equipped VHF maritime radios will automatically switch from a working channel to Channel 16 upon receipt of a DSC distress alert, distress alert acknowledgment and other DSC calls in which a channel number has been designated. A navigation safety hazard may consequently occur if the radio is being used to maintain a listening watch or to communicate on the designated bridge-to-bridge radiotelephone or vessel traffic services (VTS) monitoring channel. believed to be affected by this Safety Alert. You may manufacturers affected by this announcement here: List

I understand the issue with automatic switching when you may be communicating bridge-to-bridge but don’t understand why someone would be maintaining a listening watch on other than the distress and hailing frequency of channel 16.

If a vessel has to maintain a watch on VTS surely prudence and good seamanship would suggest a second VHF tuned to channel 16 would be on board as well? Is there anywhere in the US where a non-commercial vessel has to maintain a watch on the VTS frequency? I don’t know of a requirement for a Canadian non-commercial vessel in Canadian waters to do so.

The St. Lawrence Seaway states that pleasure craft must not use frequencies reserved for seaway use with the exception of the Welland Canal where channel 14 is to be used. I would suggest though that because everyone using the Welland Canal should be tuned to channel 14 then this common channel could also be looked upon as a distress channel also if the need arose, the vessel would go back to channel 16 when out of the canal.

And of course, my radio just happens to have this feature, and no ability to (that I have discovered yet) to inactivate it.

 

Now this isn't to say buying an sc-101 is a waste of money (and they should be really cheap now as the US market is now closed to them) - but had I known, I might have dropped an additonal 50 or 75 for a class D.

I'm sure some people will tell me I should have known, or I live under a rock if I wasn't aware - but really - if the vendor doesnt tell you when you ask for recommendations (heck he coudl have sold me a more expensive radio!), and the place that has the exclusive authority from the federal government to train, decuate and issue the license doesnt tell you, and you are new to this stuff, how you meant to know?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Posted 23 April 2011 - 10:22 AM

 

You bought a radio from a Canadian retailer, for user in Canada, took a course for certification in Canada. American regs do not apply in Canadian waters.

Same reason a camouflage pattern Mustang suit is not approved in Canada. Different regulations.

Unless you are boating primarily in the U.S. I don't see the problem.

I don’t see a problem even if you are in US waters, the radio is still legal there if it was installed before March 25 2011.

This post has been edited by bigugli: 23 April 2011 - 10:23 AM

 

Posted 23 April 2011 - 11:40 AM

 

Well, a few reasons:

1 there is obviously a safety reason why the US Coast Guard banned the radios, and I bought the radio primarily for safety purposes, although finding out whats working on any gioven day maybe a bit of a bonus too. So, IMO, it would be nice to have those limitations explained to me up front , especially by the authority that licenses individuals to operate them;

2 - the DSC system is a global satelite safety system, and the satelites that support it are owned, partly, by the US. So if the largest US safety overseer, which is an arm of the US government bans theses specific radios, it does beg a question or two about their future viability, opening the possibility that other jurisdictions will follow suit, especially the one which shares the largest amount of border with it food for thought for those considering a purchase in the near future...

They are getting mixed up a bit. DSC is part of the GMDSS system (Global Maritime Distress & Safety System). While GMDSS is in part satellite based, DSC is not, it is purely terrestrial radio based.

3 - this implies that in the not too distant future we can also expect difficulty in getting support for parts and warranty - if the radios aren't made or sold anymore, they become disposable, not repairable.

Possible, although vhf radios are so cheap in comparison to those sold just a few years ago it’s debatable whether the cost of repairing any radio outweighs the cost of a new one.

4 - In several locations the difference between the US and Canada is insignificant distance wise - so for instance, lets say you fish the Niagara River, have a NY fishing permit and you buy a radio which is legal in Canada and want to be able to fish off the bar or in the US side drifts. You may not be able to get a US licence for your SC 101 radio, especially if you are apllying for your first licence, after the March 2011 date. Ditto the Detroit river, and those who hop over the bridge(s) to fish. So now what do you do with the radio? Leave it in and fish anyway, opening yourself up to possible fines and legal ramifications? Take it out when you fish these areas?

I’m not sure I understand this argument. Surely reciprocal regulations for boating allow Canda/US boaters to enter each others waters for up to so many days a year and not having to be adhere to each others regs provided they are legal and registered/licenced in each others jurisdictions.

Like the rivers we fish, the implications run deeper than the surface appearance. The point of my rant was the fact that at no point was I notified of this.

 

 

 

 

 

Posted Yesterday, 01:33 PM

 

I don't believe the DSC feature is working on the Great Lakes as yet. It's supposed to come along some time. I've had my VHF with DSC for five years. You must register your boatname and get a MMSC(i think) number.

DSC is definately working on the Great Lakes.

It's been five years sonce the radio course and things do change and things to work somethime. The DSC feature is agood emergency situation assist.

Agreed

Hope the Great Lakes get hooked up soon.

 

Just a comment

 

David aka Superdad

[irishfield]

Thanks for taking the time Peter !!

[spincast]

I gotta tell ya -- it did get me going that I had just purchased everything, installed it, got my certificate and not 3 days later read this. However, I had my wee rant, and felt much better, and now am back on a even keel (for me, whatever that is - what was that saying back in my bar hopping days- " I used to be a werewolf, but I'm alright noooooooooooooow?) - but seriously Peter - thanks taking the time to investigate and post - I really appreciate that the clarification.

[BITEME]

[ " I used to be a werewolf, but I'm alright noooooooooooooow?) - no problemo

 

 

hey you sure your not from Bronte

[spincast]

[ " I used to be a werewolf, but I'm alright noooooooooooooow?) - no problemo

 

 

hey you sure your not from Bronte

 

 

Boy - I hope not (no insult to the fine residents of Bronte intended) - but if so..... I got some real explainin' to do to this family in Paris I keep visiting everyday?

[BITEME]

Boy - I hope not (no insult to the fine residents of Bronte intended) - but if so..... I got some real explainin' to do to this family in Paris I keep visiting everyday?

 

 

it struck me as funny there was a trade school one time here called general wolf nothing against the school lots of my friends went there but we used to poke fun at them same idea as your line except it was I use to go to wolf but im ok noooooooooww anyway where is that from