JohnF

I would say that any guide who takes strangers to his very best spots deserves to lose them. If folks need a guide to show them the ropes then they aren't gonna know good from great. If someone becomes a repeat client then eventually the guide may feel comfortable with sharing knowing that he can trust them. Or maybe the guiding is to spots the guide has never worked before. I'd far sooner go to some far northern river with someone like Mike than with just some of my buddies. I expect he'd be better at reading the water and finding fish in strange water than most of us. JF

I'll take a shot at that as a potential guideeeee. Among the things I want to learn are to tie lures, bait my hooks properly, maintain my own gear, unhook my catch, clean my own fish, etc. I'd expect to be shown properly - once, then I'd want to practise those things knowing that the expert wasn't too far away in case I screw it up. I'm not talking about a deep sea fishing tour where there are deckhands to bait my hooks, chum the water, gaff the catch and even tell me when I have a fish on. I don't want someone to clean my fish at the end of the day. I want to learn to do it myself. I'm the kind of people I'd want to guide. The rest I'd turn down. JF

I can think of lots of hobbies that happily involve making money. Any of you who have ever raced motorized vehicles for fun know how important even little cash prizes are towards the costs of operation. There are those who would say professional hockey players are just grown up boys still playing their favourite game, albeit for millions of bux. All kinds of collectors sell off certain things to allow them to buy better collectibles. Athletes with aspirations to higher levels of attainment look for financial help to cover the cost of their efforts to excel. I know successful amateur golfers who sell off valuable prizes. And sometimes those who excel want to share their excellence, not hide it under a barrel, so why shouldn't they accept money from aspirants to that same level of excellence willing to pay to learn? The problem with excellence is generally it costs a lot to achieve. In the case of sportfishing it means probably not settling for my $50 - $100 rods and $100 - $150 reels or my $100 set of waders (felt soled boots included), rather going for the two and three hundred dollar spinning reels, the three to five hundred dollar baitcasters, and $500 - $1,000 centrepins, the thousand dollar rods (I once met a flyfisherman with what he claimed were two $2,000 rods in his car) and so on. It means spending a lot of money for multiple trips every year to faraway spots in Northern Ontario, or the American west in search of little bitty trout in drainage ditches, and even Alaska in some cases, eh, Mike? It means buying and discarding a variety of fishing lines until you find the one that's truly the best instead of letting economics rule and settling for the first or even second one you bought. Some serious fishermen wouldn't dream of getting more than one year out of their lines, even braids. Guys like me will run the line till it starts to break off. As for giving up one's hard-earned secrets, the fact is that only a small percentage of what the teacher imparts is retained so it would take as least as long as it took the teacher to learn the stuff to get a paying student to remember it. There's little danger of ever having your brain that thoroughly picked. And besides, even if the beneficiary of the collected wisdom absorbs, comprehends and retains it all the donor doesn't lose anything at all. It's all still squirreled away in his little fishing crazy brain. And in all likelihood a teacher would seldom come anywhere close to sharing all the secrets, only enough to impress the student. In fact the act of sharing probably does a lot to reinforce certain skills and knowledge in the teacher, not to mention the satisfaction taken from seeing someone proud of their own improvement. Access to good guiding and encouragement to the inexperienced fishermen to use it should produce not only a higher skill and knowledge level, but perhaps more importantly a higher ethical standard among fishermen. I don't believe all the bad things done in the name of fishing are anything more than a lack of understanding of how the fishery and the critters need to be protected. There will always be those who will transgress for their own reasons but if we could eliminate the unintentionally unethical fishermen from the scene it would sure help. And that brethren, is my sermon for this sunny Sunday morning. We will now pass the plates for your generous offerings. Bless you, my children. JF

Your point's well taken and in many cirumstances I'd probably be inclined to agree but it seems to me that sportfishing may be a little bit different. I'd probably agree that working riggers and rods on a charter boat trolling around a lake could cut into the pleasure quotient, but it isn't quite the same deal when you can use only one rod per person. At least half the benefit for clients on the river might well be seeing the guide actually fishing, watching how he casts, retrieves, finds and works spots, controls the line on a drift, etc. And there's a certain amount of encouragement in seeing the guide hauling in fish. At least you now know they're there and that you just have to do the right things to attract them. I know for sure that I've learned as much by just watching how Garry does things as listening to his explanations. In that case I pay attention to what kind of rod and reel he's using for the different kinds of baits, how he presents them, how he retrieves, etc. And I'm sure there's plenty to be learned by copying a human fishfinder like Mike on the river. I like the idea of getting out with someone who can tell me the best baits to use for the day, check the way my gear is rigged, show me the spots to fish and perhaps best of all take me to places I may never find on my own. JF

A couple of passing comments to Solopaddler on a current thread got me thinking about this guiding business. And I don't mean me, unless someone is unsure of their way in the wonderful world of real estate. But that's a perfect analogy. I've spent years learning more than the average realtor about the business, to the point where I now prostitute myself to teach real estate hopefuls preparing for their licenses and licensed realtors wanting to better themselves. I don't feel the least bit guilty about it. I worked hard to acquire that knowledge and I figure I deserve to be compensated for that effort. And I'm reasonably sure the people who take my classes feel they get their money's worth. So how come more accomplished fisherpersons like Mike (Solopaddler) aren't getting something back for the wealth of knowledge they share with the rest of us? I'm only using Mike as an example (hope you don't mind) because his name was mentioned in this regard. I know a few here are doing that, some to a greater degree than others, and no one seems to begrudge the full bore charter guys their due. In fact there's a lot of positive support and promotion for some of them right here on the group. I know of others, like Garry2rs, who use guiding to help pay for boat gas and some tackle, and the folks who do commission him get way more than their money's worth. I learned more on his boat in a few hours than I've learned by trial and error, even with the advantage of OFC as a resource, in several years of fishing alone. Having seen what one gets for the money I gotta say it's a bargain for anyone wanting to fish from a Ranger bassboat, learn an awful lot about fishing the Kawarthas, and be coached in the fundamentals of casting with a spinning reel or baitcaster. And I'm sure there are lots of other folks here just as accomplished and accommodating as Garry. But back to my question. Why aren't more people like Solopaddler selling their bodies and minds to fishermen? It's obvious from his reports that he has a wealth of knowledge about fishing. And he knows how to find fish. His steelheading reports recently are ample proof of that. Seems to me it would be bonus for tyro fishermen like me to feel comfortable about asking guys like Mike and Garry to squire me around for a day or more, teaching me to do it right, putting me on fish and making my fishing a lot more fun. And I'd feel comfortable in asking simply because I'd be prepared to pay for their time and expertise. The problem these guys always come up with is that they feel uncomfortable making a business out of their pleasure, and of charging someone who might become a friend, etc etc. That's actually wrong headed because it's exactly the same rationale I might apply for not asking for their help, because I don't want to be putting some near stranger on the spot to do me a favour. Why should he? As far as I'm concerned these guys like Garry & Mike owe it to themselves to put a fair price on this knowledge and skill they've acquired. They've spent far more time & money than the average angler trying and replacing equipment and tackle, travelling to the faraway spots, passing up overtime to go fishing, etc. Now they're in a position to share that wealth with those of us who didn't invest in the same way, so why not get compensated? Any thoughts? JF

Pretty neat to see all those old timers whose cards we used to collect and trade back in the 50's. JF

It was a very professional effort, although my cynical side wonders how much they paid professionals to orchestrate it. All the same, it came off very nicely. I'm pretty sure it had more than a little to do with Molsons taking over again and wanting to make a big splash. If a rich multinational was to buy the Leafs and wanted to make waves I'm pretty sure they could find people to do just as good a job, perhaps even the same promoters that did that show for the Molsons Habs. We won't get to find out though until they reach 100 years. We might be surprised at how much they throw into their show. After all, they've had the greatest fans in the history of hockey. Who else would stand by their team through all the slumps and dives Toronto has suffered? I saw George Gillette(sp?) in the stands. I couldn't help thinking that the money being spent on the production probably wasn't his. As for the Habbies being the greatest hockey team of all time (assuming there weren't any really good ones at the turn of the century - circa 1800-1900) perhaps I don't understand hockey. That much ballyhooed survey was apparently commissioned by the Habs and was pretty carefully designed to get the desired result. I heard that on a commentary so it may or may not be accurate. Surveys are unfortunately like statistics - you can make 'em say pretty much whatever you want 'em to say. If you rate a hockey organization by it's fans Toronto would have to be right up there. If you rate it by what they've done lately, well, that doesn't even need a reply. If you rate them on the most successful licensed product marketing organization I think a lot of people would say that Philly had the best machine for years and still stands as the high water mark in hockey market promo. If you are talking about the team with the greatest number of recognized player names over the years that would probably be Montreal, although that raises the question "So what?". They've had a lot more years than most teams to have the stars, but for star power they've been off the grid for years. The other 5 Big Six teams all had their moments with their share of greats at different times. Toronto hasn't really had the great players that other teams have had, but they've sure had some of the most beloved players of all time. There's no question the Habs have been a great organization in the past, but then so was England once upon a time. It's a brave new world filled with a bunch of kids playing hockey at an incredible skill level. They're retiring at the age most of the great old names were just hitting their stride years ago. Even Ken Dryden seemed to be suggesting that it was time for the Habs to stop living in the past and let the kids do their own thing. JF

The Habbies don't exactly suck tonite, huh? Nice way to bounce back. JF

Ken Dryden's comment in the interview with Roy et Lafluer was interesting - about laying off dwelling on past successes and letting the new players find their own identity. He says it puts unfair pressure on today's team. JF

Man, if the young guys don't skate their asses off tonight, there's nothing'll ever get them going. Nice ceremony. JF

Jeez. They drafted Gordie Howe. JF

Think of it as scouting for next Thursday's game. Somebody's gotta be the sacrificial lamb. Might just as well be the Habbies as a winner. JF

Ya never heard of disinformation, or do you know something the rest of us didn't? JF

They're forecasting a tsunami for tomorrow on that river. Ya might wanna think twice. JF

I've been sitting here trying to think of something appropriate to say, but you've already said it better. JF

I think they're called steelheads when they're all shiny like that. JF

And the Leafs look like they should be a lot better statistically, don't they? A few breaks in shootouts and one or two less career games by goaltenders and they'd look heaps better. And I'm sure knowing they're the greatest team in the history of the game (or whatever that poll was) the Habbies will grind out some more wins somewhere down the road and respond to the blind faith their fans have in them. Sorry, it's the Leaf fans with the blind faith. Habs fans are the rational ones who just know their team's the best, and they'll tear down their own town if anyone proves them wrong. JF

It's been too long since latin class, but does that mean "When all else fails, die" or "When snafued, there's always tomorrow."? Duck & cover? Seriously, today I suspect he'd stay home to do chores. I could change, but then I'd be less a man. That should be translated into latin and hung above my door. A real man isn't afraid to be seen giving in to his wife. The abuse we take from the lads is nothing compared to the heat SWMBO can rain down on our submissive heads. Of course a real man is seldom seen fishing but he also doesn't spend the better part of his life walking around with his hands cupped lovingly over "the boys". Bravely cowering JF

It's not easy for a hockey team to attract this much love. The Leafs are gonna get jealous and bench Kessel, Blake, Stajan, Hagman, McDonald, etc. That should be nuf with Mitchell & Gunnarsson hors de combat. They'll get the horns back from Montreal fer sure, maybe. JF

Yeah. So what's yer point? JF

I hope so too. For this trip though you'll have to be the one laughing at Mike. I'll be home taking care of all the little bits 'n pieces. JF

I'm not concerned about begging forgiveness, it's regenerating cojones that worries me. JF

Dickhead! I just mentioned this to my wife. Her response - "Sure. why not?" - but after all these years of marital bliss I have learned to pay close attention to the subtle nuances of inflection and intonation underlying her most benign responses. The words unsaid were something like "Sure, go fishing, if you care nothing for the family jewels." She might have inflected & intoned "cojones" in deference to the upcoming winter sojourn but it all means the same thing, and it makes me squirm even thinking about it. Besides, you'll have yer hands full keeping BillM out of trouble. JF

Toronto fans are just more refined. Anyone who grew up in Leafs country knows there's no shortage of passion, it's just the stable kind. We'll know they've achieved Habs fan kind of superiority when they start rioting in the streets. Here's a little history that's fun to read - if yer a leafs fan. http://hubpages.com/hub/Toronto-Maples-Leafs-Part-2 JF

Trust me, if Mike was to call today and suggest a trip to the river I'd jump thru hoops to make it happen. My problem is I have a wife and business associates who will all be looking to neuter me if I drop the ball any time before next Friday am. The scariest is my wife. The rest are just executives and politicians, no one really threatening. JF