Greencoachdog Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Just a question, How would oil from a 4 stroke end up in the water if it is a circulated oil system like a car and not burned with the fuel like a 2 stroke? Unless you have an oil leak or somebody dumps their oil in the lake after they do an oil change. That is a very good question Express 168, and I was wondering about that myself... maybe Specktacklure would care to elaborate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 (edited) $40 fuel burn vs $135 Not in your dreams from the most fuel efficient injected engine ever built to the most miserably tuned/carburated POS ....when installed on the same boat. There is not a huge %age difference in lbs fuel burn/Hp in a combustion engine from WWII technology to present day fuel injection. Different boats..different burns. 2 strokes historically burned twice as much fuel as 4 strokes as they sucked fuel both on compression and exhaust strokes for cooling and their simple design. Todays fuel injected 2 strokes now of course shoot it in on the compression stroke only and why they are competing with the fuel burn of 4 strokes. But the $40 to $135 fuel burn comparision is...I'll be nice...specks opinion. Had same engine in a 26' fiberform that would take $150 to get to Honey harbour and back from Midland and a 26' Tempest that would make it to Manitoulin on the same fuel. All depends on how the boat rides or pushes water. Everyone has their favouries and opinions no different than Ford/Chevy/Dodge/Toyota. No need to insult those that have chosen a different manufacturer than your favourite... Just a question, How would oil from a 4 stroke end up in the water if it is a circulated oil system like a car and not burned with the fuel like a 2 stroke? Unless you have an oil leak or somebody dumps their oil in the lake after they do an oil change. Exactly Express...you'd have to be leaking or neglectful as very minimal is going out as blow by in the exhaust. Compared to a 2 stroke that is using oil in the fuel mix and like my 2003 115 Johnson (Everrude/Bombardia(sp)) that spits oil out the exhaust into the lake while idling Edited December 2, 2006 by irishfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike the Pike Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 well said Wayne .this was a question asking about 2 different technolgies.Not brand preference and name calling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jigatollah Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 wow...very interesting guys,i was checking and even on WFN..all the wal-mart,guys and all the big pros all use evenrude outboards. and the stats do stack -up i think that the evenrude is a better engine.....but there doesnt seem to be any around here i never see them at all and i do alot of hours...how come they are not around,where would you get them serviced ????lots of pros & cons for sure...... The circuits in the US will have a motor company as a sponsor and the majority of anglers who fish that particular circuit will be running those motors. If you look up here in Ontario, the circuits are mostly Mercury sponsored and that reflects back with what the anglers use. It's more of a Merc showing here. Prefernce is mostly on what the consumer thinks as every company will push out a lemon once in a while. I prefer the Opti because of it's track record in reliability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiel Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 ....I also ballked at the etec when I discovered the price of their oil is about $50 per gallon (and I've been an Evinrude/Johnson man all my life). Which for my boat added roughly $15-$20 more for every tank of fuel. I was also told that not using their oil would invalidate the warranty. And yes my 4 stroke oil is self contained, it's not in the lake. As for hole shots, well my 17', 91.5" beam gets on plane in about 2-3 seconds. Seems pretty good to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 you are right Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 I'd just finished a PM and stated exactly the same.... why all the "sponsored" guys are running Evinrudes in the US is because it's easier to get their sponsorship/cheap deals/ to try and sell their engines to the general public based on preception. "Pros" run the sheeet out of their engines and don't care about longevity...as they are someone elses problem next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecmilley Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 hmm brp can't seem to keep the engines in the ski-doos from coming apart, how they managed that with the e-tec engine? pretty much identicle technology. as for all the arguements, it won't be to many more years untill its all 4-stroke anyways maintenance costs will be similar and you won't be buying 50 a gallon synthetic 2 stroke oil. both engines have there advantages, 2 strokes seem to get out of the hole better and will have better top end, part throttle cruising will be to the advantage of 4 stroke engines,remeber 2 strokes have a 400 rpm power band while 4 strokes around 3000 rpm (the diiference between max torque and horspower). Generally for a bass boat i would select a 2 stroke, just because you are usually running and gunning. If I were going to but an outboard 2 stroke it would be a yammy with hdpi , most reliable and usually best resale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfish1965 Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 I think the ski doo is a rotax engine isn't it? Nothing like the E-Tec. Anyway..if you can give up the weight, go with a 4 stroke, but if you can't, go with a 2. My boat couldn't afford the weight difference, so I went with a 2 stroke. I would have loved to get an e-Tec, but the 25's weren't available yet. Any brand new 4 stroke and brand new 2 stroke with have similar efficiencies. Two stroke will always have a better whole shot by the nature of their firing twice as often as the 4 stroke. What I really want is for Mazda to make a rotory boat motor. 8,000 RPM's baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greencoachdog Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 What I really want is for Mazda to make a rotory boat motor. 8,000 RPM's baby. ... but you wouldn't want to feed that thing Rick (10mpg). A friend of mine had a rotary RX7, said he loved the performance... but hated the fuel consumption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike the Pike Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 Ok hookset after all these opinions let us know what you purchase.Pay now or pay later! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Farmer Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 It will work out in the end, resale. You'll get more for a 4 stroke package. It's going to be 4 strokes in the long run. But I have a few friends that have an Etec and there very happy, as for the oil price for them it is expensive, but you don't use as much as the old 2 stroke tec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookset Posted December 4, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Hey Guys thanks very much for all the input. As usual the members on here blew me away. As for what I want for power it's gotta be a Merc. For one it's a package so I have to pick a Merc, but it was a Merc that I want to run anyway. I know that E-Tecs are reportedly good motors but I still have issues with O.M.C. from previous motors I have owned and I just don't have faith in them even though they are Bombardier now. On the package that I want to buy I get a "power back saving" if I run an Optimax. To run a 4 stroke is close to $3 grand more. If the price was closer it would be 4 stroke but it looks like a shakey old 2 stroke is what I'm gonna run. But as I type this I gotta admit A 4 stroke sure would be sweet. In other words I don't have a clue. Yet.... Thanks again for all the help, Hookset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Leave the LCX110C off for now and go 4 stroke ! LOL Like I said early $3000 +/- was the difference to go Verado on any of the Lunds I had quoted compared to the Optimax. Different Merc Smart gauges etc all taken into consideration. Tough choices and nobody can make the final call but yourself. Good luck with 'er. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fang Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 $3000 more for a 115 4 stroke How much $ for a 135 Optimax or even 150 Spend the extra on horsepower man!!!! (grinning from ear to ear) Doesn't that Nitro take up to a 150 Thats 40-45MPH to 55MPH upgrade. Go with speed I wish I had been able to max out the HP on my crestliner but it was a new to me and came with the 115. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishfield Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 With Paul now reminding me of HP...$3000+/- was the difference when talking 225 and 250 engines. Don't think there should be that much spread on a 115. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NBR Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Based on the size of your boat I would guess it is rated for 150HP or more. I'd go with a 150 Optimax. You will run at lower rpm at the same speed and use less fuel. In the boat reviews I have read the new generation 2 strokes are darn near as fuel efficient as the 4 strokes plus you have the advantage of lighter weight to push and the reliability of many years of improvements in the 2 strokes. In a big motor used mainly for speed I wouldn't even think of a 4 stroke. A 75 hp or less would be a different issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 (edited) "a shakey old 2 stroke " You won't see that on an Optimax Hookset, they are as smooth as a 4 stroke. As to fuel efficiency, several mags have run tests that show quite clearly that the new DFI's are as efficient or even better than 4 strokes. Frankly, I see no benefit to owing a 4 stroke in this HP range. As to statement that 2 strokes will disappear and that all outboards will be 4 strokes ..... ain't gonna happen in my lifetime. Old carburated 2 strokes, yes I'll agree, but that won't happen with the DFIs' because they are as clean. If memory serves me correctly (there' no guaranty on that), I recall reading an artcile in Bass and Walleye Boats magazine that claimed the DFIs' are cleaner than the 4 strokes; I think it was because the DFI's have a more complete fuel burn, if that makes any sense. I'll try to dig it up. A few guys have the Verados on the bass circuit ( a supercharged 4 stroke) and they all report that are less fuel efficient than the Optis' at WOT. Edited December 5, 2006 by Gerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookset Posted December 5, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 "Shakey" old 2 stroke was just a humerous response to an earlier post. The Optimax has been at the top of my list since I started looking at new boats. All your points on the Opti were bang on. The 4 stroke would have needed to be far superior for me to choose it. As for the difference in price of 3 grand that I stated, it is accurate due to the "power up" savings that were offered on the Optimax. Basically it works out to the same price as a 90 Opti. I'm choosing the 115 hp because it allows me to fish in certain circuits that are limited to 115 hp. And at around 50 mph I would be happy and not too far outclassed on the bigger circuits. Thanks again. Hookset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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