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2019-2020 Hockey Thread

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11 hours ago, Oggie said:

I wonder if clearing out Gardiner provides some cap relief to sign Marner?  I hope I don't hear these kids complaining about pressure from fans to perform.  With the money they're demanding along will come huge expectations. 

Gardiner wasn't on our books already, Cody Ceci took his spot.

 

We essentially traded Nikita zaitsev with his remaining contract of 4+ seasons for a single one of Cody Ceci.

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can we get a title change to this thread? camp opens soon.

Leafs D core looking much much stronger than last year. Really hoping Ceci can take a step forward playing on riellys wing. I think Dermott is going to quickly beat him out of his spot though.

 

That muzzin barrie combo is gonna be nice. 

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The big thing with Marner is term.  If he was offered 11mil over 4 years we wouldn't be talking about Marner right now.

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48 minutes ago, BillM said:

The big thing with Marner is term.  If he was offered 11mil over 4 years we wouldn't be talking about Marner right now.

And instead everyone would be screaming "WE JUST OVERPAID". Marner needs to slot in below Matthews in the food chain.

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This whole RFA process is getting out of hand.  What a world! Player's expectations are way too high.  How does a business remain sustainable when those kind of figures get thrown around.  Most fans can't even relate to this level of demands. I love watching hockey, but starting to question my choice to to do so.  GM's can be their own worst enemies when they are desperate, then all of them suffer the consequences. The CAP isn't working with these kind of player demands.

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Further to Jimmers point, we are now fully seeing the absolute worst implications of the NHL's cap as it is currently structured. This to me is a total PR gaff by the NHL and the players union.

Lets be totally clear here, the NHL is doing better financially than it ever has in the history of the league. The cap keeps increasing because the league is making more and more money, and the owners are also making more and more money as well.

The total screw up in all of this is that the NHL, its teams and players are a product/commodity. The owners job is to sell his players and franchise to its fans. Jerseys, tickets, merchandise etc etc.

Now you tell me...How many hockey fans are out right now buying Brayden Point, Brady Tkachuk or Marner jerseys?

Furthermore, what is the average leaf fans opinion of William Nylander right now? What about Marner?

This whole vilifying exercise of the leagues shining stars and young talent is a bloody disaster. At no time should fans be concerning themselves with the amount of money that star talent is asking for. Thats 100% between the owner/team and the players. Look at every other major sports league and how they handle star player contracts. Do you think a single Dallas cowboy fan is pissed off at Zeek for the contract he just got? Not a chance. Are clippers fans mad at Kawhi for making his max deal...absolutely friggin not, we were begging him to take more money and stay in Toronto!

If the league needs to have a hard cap, you absolutely 100% have to stop penalizing teams for doing an incredible job at drafting and developing young talent. Furthermore you absolutely 10000% need to offer some form of incentive/break for teams that do exactly what the league is trying to impose by implementing said cap. My solution to the problem is simple, you offer a cap discount (whatever you determine to be reasonable) for singing UFA's coming off of entry level contracts. What this means is that the teams that draft and develop good young talent gain a monetary advantage against the "imaginary monetary cap" for signing their developed players coming off of their entry level contracts. Its then the job of owners and GM's to ensure that young players coming off of entry level deals dont take advantage of the system and say "hey, you are getting a discount, and im a 10 million per year player, so now I want 15 million because its only 10 million against the cap" 

Ill admit right now, that I am pissed off at marner, the leafs IMO already offered him far too much if they actually offered him 11 over 7. The fact that he said no to becoming the highest paid winger in the entire NHL is even more mind boggling to me. Hell hes not even the best UFA coming off entry level, never mind the best winger in the NHL. If marner is worth 11, does that mean brayden point is worth 13? and if marner thinks hes worth 13, point is worth 15? give me a friggin break. 

I now firmly believe that marner is going to pull a nylander and sign way into october for the 11 he was offered. Like an idiot, he could have taken it back in June but now hes going to sit and wait for the same offer again. Heck part of me says he just may not even get that offer ever again, Im pretty sure the leafs only have 10.5 to offer him now anyways?

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1 hour ago, Ronzo said:

And instead everyone would be screaming "WE JUST OVERPAID". Marner needs to slot in below Matthews in the food chain.

Once he's signed no one will care.  Not my money and the cap goes up every year.  

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3 hours ago, Ronzo said:

And instead everyone would be screaming "WE JUST OVERPAID". Marner needs to slot in below Matthews in the food chain.

I hear a good number of sports analysts saying that Marner is actually more valuable than Mathews. He plays in all situations, scored more points and makes other players around him better.

 

Cheers

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1 hour ago, smitty55 said:

I hear a good number of sports analysts saying that Marner is actually more valuable than Mathews. He plays in all situations, scored more points and makes other players around him better.

 

Cheers

It's a great way to get people talking and drum up the drama, isn't it? Matthews plays C and scores more goals. Wingers have really never been considered to be more valuable than comparable centers, but when it's the Leafs, and there's drama to be created, YOU BET the winger is suddenly more valuable.

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2 hours ago, BillM said:

Once he's signed no one will care.  Not my money and the cap goes up every year.  

If you are a fan of the team, you probably should care, because the price of Marner directly impacts the $ left to round out a cup contending team.

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12 minutes ago, Ronzo said:

It's a great way to get people talking and drum up the drama, isn't it? Matthews plays C and scores more goals. Wingers have really never been considered to be more valuable than comparable centers, but when it's the Leafs, and there's drama to be created, YOU BET the winger is suddenly more valuable.

I believe that the media creates most of the problems for teams, they blow stuff out of their mouths that should be coming out the other end.  Brian Burke is the perfect example, going on about Matthews not going to re-sign once is 5 years are up right after the player signed his contract. What a goof, how the heck would he know what's going to happen in 5 years?

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5 hours ago, BillM said:

The big thing with Marner is term.  If he was offered 11mil over 4 years we wouldn't be talking about Marner right now.

didn't the leafs offer 11 at 3 yrs?

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3 hours ago, AKRISONER said:

Further to Jimmers point, we are now fully seeing the absolute worst implications of the NHL's cap as it is currently structured. This to me is a total PR gaff by the NHL and the players union.

Lets be totally clear here, the NHL is doing better financially than it ever has in the history of the league. The cap keeps increasing because the league is making more and more money, and the owners are also making more and more money as well.

The total screw up in all of this is that the NHL, its teams and players are a product/commodity. The owners job is to sell his players and franchise to its fans. Jerseys, tickets, merchandise etc etc.

Now you tell me...How many hockey fans are out right now buying Brayden Point, Brady Tkachuk or Marner jerseys?

Furthermore, what is the average leaf fans opinion of William Nylander right now? What about Marner?

This whole vilifying exercise of the leagues shining stars and young talent is a bloody disaster. At no time should fans be concerning themselves with the amount of money that star talent is asking for. Thats 100% between the owner/team and the players. Look at every other major sports league and how they handle star player contracts. Do you think a single Dallas cowboy fan is pissed off at Zeek for the contract he just got? Not a chance. Are clippers fans mad at Kawhi for making his max deal...absolutely friggin not, we were begging him to take more money and stay in Toronto!

If the league needs to have a hard cap, you absolutely 100% have to stop penalizing teams for doing an incredible job at drafting and developing young talent. Furthermore you absolutely 10000% need to offer some form of incentive/break for teams that do exactly what the league is trying to impose by implementing said cap. My solution to the problem is simple, you offer a cap discount (whatever you determine to be reasonable) for singing UFA's coming off of entry level contracts. What this means is that the teams that draft and develop good young talent gain a monetary advantage against the "imaginary monetary cap" for signing their developed players coming off of their entry level contracts. Its then the job of owners and GM's to ensure that young players coming off of entry level deals dont take advantage of the system and say "hey, you are getting a discount, and im a 10 million per year player, so now I want 15 million because its only 10 million against the cap" 

Ill admit right now, that I am pissed off at marner, the leafs IMO already offered him far too much if they actually offered him 11 over 7. The fact that he said no to becoming the highest paid winger in the entire NHL is even more mind boggling to me. Hell hes not even the best UFA coming off entry level, never mind the best winger in the NHL. If marner is worth 11, does that mean brayden point is worth 13? and if marner thinks hes worth 13, point is worth 15? give me a friggin break. 

I now firmly believe that marner is going to pull a nylander and sign way into october for the 11 he was offered. Like an idiot, he could have taken it back in June but now hes going to sit and wait for the same offer again. Heck part of me says he just may not even get that offer ever again, Im pretty sure the leafs only have 10.5 to offer him now anyways?

The fans will boo him when he comes on the ice for the first home game.

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38 minutes ago, Squid said:

didn't the leafs offer 11 at 3 yrs?

Pretty sure it was 11 @ 8 if I'm not mistaken.   I'm guessing he would have jumped on that 3 year term, that's exactly what he wants.

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The fans will boo him if he sits out games for sure. If he’s signed before October 2nd then it’s water under the bridge.

it was 3 at 8.5

 

he wants 3 at 10 I believe, which is absolutely ridiculous. At some point the leafs are going to start thinking about trade possibilities, there’s some teams out there that would pay marner 12+ you just need to get a decent return for him.

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Can't be mad at him for turning down 8.5 @ 3.  He's worth more then that.  Whatever he does, I just hope this is over and done with soon.  I don't want him to turn into another Nylander that fans hate.

Edited by BillM

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16 minutes ago, BillM said:

Can't be mad at him for turning down 8.5 @ 3.  He's worth more then that.

:dunno:

 

Play the 3, play well/great, then he can demand. This hold out crap has to stop. IMO, it makes the player look bad,ignorant, not a team player.

 

ME ME ME ME ME ME

No "ME" in team.

Edited by misfish

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Don’t lose sight of the fact that the difference between 10 and 8 mill is literally 2 million dollars....that’s a hell of a lot of money lol 2 million dollars buys a lot of stuff

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4 minutes ago, AKRISONER said:

Don’t lose sight of the fact that the difference between 10 and 8 mill is literally 2 million dollars....that’s a hell of a lot of money lol 2 million dollars buys a lot of stuff

20, fully loaded bass boats. 🤣

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1 hour ago, AKRISONER said:

Don’t lose sight of the fact that the difference between 10 and 8 mill is literally 2 million dollars....that’s a hell of a lot of money lol 2 million dollars buys a lot of stuff

Early retirement!!!  😎

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