chrismarkz Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 Just giving all potential future customers a heads up..... I recently went to Dryland marine in Richmond hill (Oak Ridge's) to have a seal kit replaced on my Sea star hydraulic steering. While speaking with the owner Sal I got a good vibe off him, trusting he knew his stuff and was going to be fair with me on pricing. So going forward I mentioned if he could also do an oil and fuel filter change along with a lower unit oil change. A task I normally take on, but he seemed reasonable and I like to give businesses to small businesses if possible. Well I get a call from him 2 days later that he was going to replace the entire Sea Star because there is a small pit on the far side of the piston (Cost -$1200 plus labor). On the phone he is try to scare me into replacing the unit saying it was not safe to operate with my family. The worst case scenario would be me filling the line with more oil. I tell him I will be by on my way home for work to take a look at it. The pit on the piston is 1/2" from the left side, even if I cranked the wheel all the way to that side it was still an inch from touching the seals. I show this to Sal, the owner who is working on the project, and he is trying to backpedal his way out of the ordeal. Right there I should of backed my truck to the boat and got it out of there, but I didn't. We both agreed that a seal kit would be the best option. A week later I get a call to come pick up the boat and settle up. I take a look at the work order and the number at the bottom $1412.50 hst inc. I tasted puke in my mouth. He goes ahead and gives me a $225 break on labor because he said the Hydraulic steering didn't take as long as he thought. I then confront him and part pricing because I was going to take this project on myself but I didn't have the time. His response was that he didn't have the time to talk to me about this and told me to pay or he wasn't releasing the boat. I proceed to pay him $1158.25. This is the breakdown I put together as a result of doing a little research after the fact: Fourstroke Oil, Lube, filter, fuel filter & lower unit oil change labor include $240-$290 Many marine mechanic will charge this. Seal kit $120, Hydraulic oil $30 Retail prices (he would get a 20% discount on all parts). I would expect him to make money on parts so retail price plus 25%= $187.50 Labor for Sea Star say 2 hours even though I seen it done on you tube in 22 mins. 2 hours@$88=$176 So I would expect a bill for approximately $650 and it wouldn't be a steal but fair pricing. The money Dryland has into this project is $180 of parts & a realistic hour count of 3hours of general mechanic that he is paying $30 an hour. =$270 - $1225= $955 of profit. Maybe this is why his brother Joe is on Holidays for the past 2 weeks. I run a seasonal small business as well, and I am aware that everyone needs to make a dollar but to deceitfully make money by lying to your customer base about changing out parts that will still work and jacking up pricing without warrant is upsetting. I hope Joe and Sal enjoy their holidays because one day that junk yard they call a shop will be gone..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 tone z71 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 Shop rates around me range from 90-130 hr ..wanna play gotta pay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmer Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 I'll always do it myself and make the time to avoid this type of situation. Man, I feel for you, those stories give me nightmares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James77 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 Always assume the worst, even with mechanics anything I always ask for a full breakdown of pricing including labour before I okay a project. In the past I've been screwed by a marina. At our small business I always disclose and okay all costs with a customer, you'd hope that other businesses operated that way. Sorry to hear you were taken for a ride, but you do have some power with online reviews. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landry Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 North East Shank - that was an ignorant post. This guy obviously got ripped off. You obviously don't give a damn.Sorry to hear that - been there before. I deal with Bay City Marine now. They have always been fair and professional. I have places closer but it is worth the 45min drive for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misfish Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 Shop rates around me range from 90-130 hr ..wanna play gotta pay I'll always do it myself and make the time to avoid this type of situation. Man, I feel for you, those stories give me nightmares. Always assume the worst, even with mechanics anything I always ask for a full breakdown of pricing including labour before I okay a project. In the past I've been screwed by a marina. At our small business I always disclose and okay all costs with a customer, you'd hope that other businesses operated that way. Sorry to hear you were taken for a ride, but you do have some power with online reviews. James North East Shank - that was an ignorant post. This guy obviously got ripped off. You obviously don't give a damn. Sorry to hear that - been there before. I deal with Bay City Marine now. They have always been fair and professional. I have places closer but it is worth the 45min drive for me. I had to multy here as I have only one view/ opinion to this. When one dosent know, he relys on someone with the know how. You say yes, this sounds good, and allow the said work to be done. You have no idea about what needs to be done. You just think you know . You also think, you know what it costs to do such job, but you dont know how to do it. Some of us are lucky to be inclined to take care of most of our fixings, but most dont. The comment,,.wanna play gotta pay , has some merit. BUT, if those that want to play, dont know what the pay is going to be, makes it harder. Yes some will suck you right in. It,s been like that forever. I have had only two fellas work on the 6 boats I have own, besides myself. ( no longer own one now) . Lots of anglers know/ knew them both. They both were busy as hell all season long. One is gone due to death. The other is going strong still. If asked where to get fixed up, I always give them the name. Honesty and good work, will keep them coming. Posts like this will just sink ya. Yes we dont know the whole story from both sides, but I can say this,,,,,,,,,,,,, The www will kill ya or keep ya going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 tone z71 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 North East Shank - that was an ignorant post. This guy obviously got ripped off. You obviously don't give a damn. Sorry to hear that - been there before. I deal with Bay City Marine now. They have always been fair and professional. I have places closer but it is worth the 45min drive for me. ...naaa not ignorant realistic..I do all my own servicing and poster stated the same mostly..I don't walk into any marina and say change this change that ..service this ..check this ..so you think your boss pays you 30 hr and charges you out for 30 hr come on use some common sense..is the price high ...maybe ..maybe the hyd steering was a pain to re and re we don't know the whole story..besides I don't remember asking your opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misfish Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) ...naaa not ignorant realistic..I do all my own servicing and poster stated the same mostly..I don't walk into any marina and say change this change that ..service this ..check this ..so you think your boss pays you 30 hr and charges you out for 30 hr come on use some common sense..is the price high ...maybe ..maybe the hyd steering was a pain to re and re we don't know the whole story Like I said Some of us are lucky to be inclined to take care of most of our fixings, but most dont. Some have no idea and will be taken. Edited July 31, 2015 by Brian B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freshtrax Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 At least he wasn't wearing a pink shirt... Then you will see ignorant posts from north east. ...this time however I agree with him ... If you don't fix it your self you have to pay someone for their knowledge ...I've never had service at a marina but I'm sure it is in the 100/hour range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecmilley Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 yup without a estimate to begin with your kinda at there mercy. what is the breakdown on the bill? by law it has to be itemized, and even the marine industry has a labour guide and remember it's just a guide nothing set in stone, typical marina pricing in kawartha area from $80-$120 hr. parts pricing usuallly run 40-55% margins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 TRhat sure doesn't sound fair. But I am surprised you didn't get a quote first. If I don't like the quote I take my money elsewhere and I will pay 1/2 hour labour for the time to give a quote. I think that is more than fair if the quote is done in the office not by taking things apart and putting them back together. Then I make it clear before hand what a quote will cost me. Usually no charge. I would never order a steak and at the end of the meal ask "how much"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWhite Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 (edited) ...naaa not ignorant realistic..I do all my own servicing and poster stated the same mostly..I don't walk into any marina and say change this change that ..service this ..check this ..so you think your boss pays you 30 hr and charges you out for 30 hr come on use some common sense..is the price high ...maybe ..maybe the hyd steering was a pain to re and re we don't know the whole story..besides I don't remember asking your opinionPretty sure he weighed in the labour cost at $88. Not sure you really read the story OP thanks for the heads up on that place. Posts like this are exactly what community forums are for. I for one do not want to get bamboozled by going somewhere with "low overhead"? Lol Edited August 1, 2015 by SirWhite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismarkz Posted August 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 Just to give a heads up, Sal did give me a quote over the phone I was in my car at the time so I asked him to email it to me, he told me the his girl wasn't in the office and he wasn't computer savvy. He gave me a parts pricing over the phone and said a couple hours on install. He made it seem like it wasn't that big of a deal and it was a in and out job. On the phone he did tell me that the seal kit was $199 I did let him know that I found it for $120, he responded with he will look in to it for me. He ended up charging me for individual pieces that were included in the kit and told me his kit was aftermarket and didn't come with the same pieces. I currently own a retail store and before owned a landscape construction company, I know what mark ups are all about. I also know that getting a $1400 bill down to the $600 - $700 mark is unrealistic. Sal gave me a bill for $1400 and then thought he would drop $225 to seem like he was giving me a deal. "Plaid coat sales tactic 101" As for the responses of higher per hour charge.... what's the difference if it is $88/hour or $120/hour when he doubles or triples the hours spent on the project??? I would call myself mechanically incline. This project may of taken me 3-4 hours and most of the time would of been set up. Like I said it was on youtube and it was timed in at 22 mins. At no point did I think he would bill me for 22 mins, I figured it would have been a 2-3 hour how it was presented to me. I know I won't get any money back from any of these messages, but if it could save other members from getting hosed by a dishonest mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismarkz Posted August 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 "naaa not ignorant realistic..I do all my own servicing and poster stated the same mostly..I don't walk into any marina and say change this change that ..service this ..check this ..so you think your boss pays you 30 hr and charges you out for 30 hr come on use some common sense..is the price high ...maybe ..maybe the hyd steering was a pain to re and re we don't know the whole story" Clearly north east shark reads and only takes in the information that he wants to take in.... not once did I mention charging the client the same hourly as you pay..... Common on North East Shark clean it up.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeybacala Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 I've been to this place a couple of times when I was trying to price a boat. Both times I felt that they didn't have time for me to discuss anything about what I was looking for. Simply handed me a brochure suggested I look at it and call for pricing. Great customer service. Anyway sorry to hear that this occurred to you and thanks for posting this only to confirm my gut feelings about this place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 You would know consumer protection law in Ontario Chris as a business dealing directly with consumers. I know that it used to be that an automotive repair shop "required" you be given a written quote by law and they could not deviate from it more than 10% up or down. I don't know if that still holds true and my question would be does Marine(a) repair facilities have to abide by it also or do they have to do business under their own consumer protection laws? I'm sure there are laws this is Ontario. I would look into for sure. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillM Posted August 1, 2015 Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 What's the break down of the actual bill? The only breakdown we've got is the OP's estimate of what the job should have cost... Some facts would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismarkz Posted August 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 As much as I would like to file a complaint with the consumer protection act, I know that these thing take a lot of time and normally don't amount to much at the end. To me it looks like this issue happens quite often at this particular shop and can be rectified by just not giving this place any more of my business and informing others of my issues so they could make a decision if they want to partake in these shenanigans. As for a bill of sale I left it on his front desk and told him he could stick it in his @55. I wish I grabbed it so I could of post it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrismarkz Posted August 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2015 The maintenance (oil, lube, oil filter, fuel filter, and lower unit oil change) came in at $340 parts and labour. The sea star seal kit and oil came in at $390ish and the remaining $510 (discount from $775) was labour. (Kit is sold for $220 retail includes tool) I would like to say only one thing was inflated but everything was inflated equally… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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