kickingfrog Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) Anyone see Lawrie strike out 4 times on 12 breaking balls last night? I honestly wonder why Oakland wanted him. When I read that last night I figured you were exaggerating for effect. First headline I read this morning was the same thing. I can't even begin to think how hard it is to strike out 4 times on 12 pitches. Edited April 8, 2015 by kickingfrog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishing n autograph Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 They dont need to have cookie cutter builds, I didnt mention anything about his physical characteristics. But certain positions need to be complimented with certain areas of expertise. Lawrie's bat, speed and arm were best suited for a 2nd baseman. Thats where he will shine, but only he if he doesnt strike out as much as he does. Every position on the field has a predetermined set of skills needed to place the correct player in each spot. There are exceptions, but reserved for only the exceptional player. IMO, Lawrie should not be in the majors. He reminds me of a guy I played with when I was younger, Scott Thorman. Drafted number 1 by the Braves. A true Giant at his age, with pure talent. Unfortunately, the Braves brought him up too quickly because they invested so much money into him that they needed him to pay back on their investment, and in the end, he did not perform. He ended up playing in Pittsburgh, Taiwan and the Intercounty league where his attitude finally matured and he wasn't a prick. He's now coaching low A ball in the Kansas City Organization Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmonidstalker Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 my question is what does his bat have anything to do with what position he plays? all his bat does is determine where he bats in the lineup, he'll never be a top of the order batter, hes a 6-8 hitter, someone to turn the line up over. you had aaron hill, then goins/kawasaki, kelly johnson and izturis, none of which have the arm for third base, thing is, lawrie has a good arm for third 3rd base is a power hitting position, just like left field. For a 3rd baseman, I'll take a power hitter with an ok arm, good defence and moderate speed over the profile of Lawrie. It just doesn't make sense to have Lawrie at 3rd. And in his last days with the Jays they finally pushed him to 2nd base in an attempt to keep him on the roster. But he failed there too. Just way too many strikeouts. But if he actually could put 30-40HR and 80-100RBI on the board consistently, then his strikeout amounts would be acceptable. But enough of him, he's gone now which is a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 3rd base is a power hitting position, just like left field. For a 3rd baseman, I'll take a power hitter with an ok arm, good defence and moderate speed over the profile of Lawrie. It just doesn't make sense to have Lawrie at 3rd. And in his last days with the Jays they finally pushed him to 2nd base in an attempt to keep him on the roster. But he failed there too. Just way too many strikeouts. But if he actually could put 30-40HR and 80-100RBI on the board consistently, then his strikeout amounts would be acceptable. But enough of him, he's gone now which is a good thing. Ed Sprague was never a power hitter, and put up the same home run numbers Lawrie, with exception of 1996, where hit 36, but through his career, he 10-20 HR Pablo Sandoval, his best year he hit 25, other than that 10-20 HR seasons Wade Boggs had 2 seasons where he hit more than 10 homeruns. this idea that 3B has to be you power guy is just ludicris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netminder Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 It's nice to get some power out of your corner infielders since they aren't as physically demanding defensively. The positions up the middle are defense first, offense second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRISONER Posted April 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 No one is going to Miss Lawrie. The guy literally played in something ridiculous like 52% of the games that he should have technically been available for. Hes a bandaid and the jays got the best 3rd basemen in the MLB for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Keep in mind that teams will also move players to a possession that "suits" their batting ability. A catcher who really hits sometimes gets moved to 1st base, or the outfield, because catchers take such a beating that they play less games and have shorter careers. Lawrie had been moved around by both the Brewers and the Jays because he was very athletic (if somewhat raw) but really hasn't spent a lot of time in baseball terms learning a position. I like Lawrie, but i was also frustrated by his frequent bad at bats and injuries. On paper the Jays are better off now, in 5-7 years I guess we'll know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) Keep in mind that teams will also move players to a possession that "suits" their batting ability. A catcher who really hits sometimes gets moved to 1st base, or the outfield, because catchers take such a beating that they play less games and have shorter careers. Lawrie had been moved around by both the Brewers and the Jays because he was very athletic (if somewhat raw) but really hasn't spent a lot of time in baseball terms learning a position. I like Lawrie, but i was also frustrated by his frequent bad at bats and injuries. On paper the Jays are better off now, in 5-7 years I guess we'll know. I can only think of one player that this happened to, Carlos Delgado but again, a players batting ability rarely has anything to do with what position they play. i mean they were scouted, drafted, and groomed to play that position. say for instance your second baseman becomes your leading HR hitter, a team isn't going to say, oh, thats not a power hitting position, so we're going to move you. try telling Cal Ripkin or Mike Piazza, who are in the top 50 of all time HR leaders, they aren't going to play SS or catcher cause they hit too many HR's Edited April 8, 2015 by FloatnFly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishing n autograph Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) Mike Piazza, Mike Napoli, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Craig Biggio, victor Martinez Edited April 8, 2015 by FishnNAutographs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 It happens all the time. By the time most players are in the majors they've already been moved. Sometimes it goes the other way, guy can't hit at a certain level and they move him to another position. Used to be that 2nd, short or catcher was were good athletes that couldn't hit went. Dave Steib was an outfielder who really couldn't hit well enough to be a pro but had a strong arm and voila. Pitcher gets the yips, but can hit, he goes to the outfield. St' Louis had one that did that in the last 10 years or so. With the emphases on power the last 20-25 years, defence and speed are selected for less now then they used to be. Teams are more willing to put up with a guy that hits 20 home runs but doesn't have as much defensive range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmonidstalker Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Ed Sprague was never a power hitter, and put up the same home run numbers Lawrie, with exception of 1996, where hit 36, but through his career, he 10-20 HR Pablo Sandoval, his best year he hit 25, other than that 10-20 HR seasons Wade Boggs had 2 seasons where he hit more than 10 homeruns. this idea that 3B has to be you power guy is just ludicris As I mentioned in a previous post, there are exceptions reserved for exceptional players. You've named 3 very good baseball players. There are player profiles, Its just the way it is. And there are few exceptions. Its no difference in any other sport. Positions call for specific player profiles. If you dont agree, thats ok, but thats the way teams are built. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishing n autograph Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 The depends on the position. Corner outfield and first yeah, but you need good hands and athletic ability for SS and 2b. 3b you need defensive skill and power. Most players who switch to pitching do it as a last resort Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bailey Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 First base? Find a guy who can do anything but throw, when does a first baseman ever need to do that? Probably less than anyone else on the team. But I want the other four skills in abundance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 First base is also the last bastion of left handed guys who can't run and/or throw well enough to play the outfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 (edited) First base? Find a guy who can do anything but throw, when does a first baseman ever need to do that? Probably less than anyone else on the team. But I want the other four skills in abundance. first base is your cutoff guy for a throw to the plate from centre or right and happens on a force at first and you need to throw over to third for a runner trying to advance Edited April 8, 2015 by FloatnFly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 If a guy can play the infield, is right handed and can throw he usually doesn't end up at first because there are plenty of guys who can't throw. If defence at first was a higher priority then every DH in the American league who gets traded to the National wouldn't end up there. Or it wouldn't be populated with so many 20 homerun, 200 strikeout guys with 1 step range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmonidstalker Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 first base is your cutoff guy for a throw to the plate from centre or right and happens on a force at first and you need to throw over to third for a runner trying to advance If the farthest a player (1st baseman in this case) is needed to throw, is no greater than across the infield, then your arm does not need to be good. The player profile of a 1st baseman does not include strong arm. Arms of strength are for the pitcher, catcher and outfielder(but more so for centre and right field). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) If the farthest a player (1st baseman in this case) is needed to throw, is no greater than across the infield, then your arm does not need to be good. The player profile of a 1st baseman does not include strong arm. Arms of strength are for the pitcher, catcher and outfielder(but more so for centre and right field). i never said they needed to have strong arm, but you can't have someone who can't throw, you need someone who can make a quick accurate throw Edited April 9, 2015 by FloatnFly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 Looks like Loup is struggling early, but lets just hope its was poor weather conditions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRIFTER_016 Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 Used to be a big baseball fan. Haven't watched a game since the last strike/lockout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitoubass2 Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 The season is just too long for me to stay entrigued. Last game I watched was on my grade 8 Toronto trip lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netminder Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 If there's anything at all to be read into after two games it's that the only guys worthwhile calling in from the bullpen are the 20-year-oldds! How about Osuna striking out A-Roid with the bases loaded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 (edited) If there's anything at all to be read into after two games it's that the only guys worthwhile calling in from the bullpen are the 20-year-oldds! How about Osuna striking out A-Roid with the bases loaded? they have a huge advantage for the first half, because no one knows anything about them. they're true test will come in the second half of the season when teams have lots of video on them mind you, still won't help them hit that wicked change up Edited April 9, 2015 by FloatnFly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRISONER Posted April 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 poor Dickey, I cant lie when i say that Toronto has forgotten about how good Dickey really can be when he is on. 2 years ago he was the talk of the town, now no one pays him any mind. Rightfully so, yes he has had to slow starts 2 years in a row, but no one talks about the fact that after July the guy went something ridiculous like 8-2? (cant find exact stats) There is no denying that Dickey can pitch, its just about piecing it all together. Also games like yesterday did Dickey no favors...pitches into the 8th with 1 run and a 4 run lead and doesnt get the win, thats garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatnFly Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 poor Dickey, I cant lie when i say that Toronto has forgotten about how good Dickey really can be when he is on. 2 years ago he was the talk of the town, now no one pays him any mind. Rightfully so, yes he has had to slow starts 2 years in a row, but no one talks about the fact that after July the guy went something ridiculous like 8-2? (cant find exact stats) There is no denying that Dickey can pitch, its just about piecing it all together. Also games like yesterday did Dickey no favors...pitches into the 8th with 1 run and a 4 run lead and doesnt get the win, thats garbage. he pitched very well considering the weather wasn't ideal for a knuckleball. but yea, take a 3 run lead into the 8th, and your setup man and closer should be able to lock it down no problem Loup and Cecil dropped the ball on that one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now