Rich Nelson Posted September 16, 2013 Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 Number of gun murders in Canada last year 173 Number of gun murders in US last year 9146 Nope, the number of guns ( specifically handguns) in the US, and the ease of obtaining them has nothing to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehg Posted September 16, 2013 Report Share Posted September 16, 2013 Number of gun murders in Canada last year 173 Number of gun murders in US last year 9146 There is a huge difference here...... Gotta love Canadian culture! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirCranksalot Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 The ULTIMATE hot button topic!!! Americans and gun "control". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Razor Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Even when you compare population sizes to gun murders, the number is still astronomical when compared to Canadian gun murders. It's the simple fact that our high standard of living combined with strict gun laws have in essence weeded out most of the purveyors of gun crime. We still do have gun crime, but on such a smaller scale, it's almost a non issue for the majority of Canadians. In the United States however the despairity between classes, social and economic factors which drive certain aspects of Amercian culture, combined with easy access to guns (both illegal and leagal) are the 2 largest factors behind the amount of gun crimes that occur south of the 49th. Can it ever be fixed? Now that's a question with an even longer answer.... It just has to end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioFisherman Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 How do you fix a problem if some seem to constantly be search for a way around a law? http://money.cnn.com/2013/09/12/news/companies/slide-fire-gun/index.html?hpt=hp_t3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Numbers of gun related murders in the US vs. Canada are approximately 10 to 1, numbers of citizens also 10 to 1. So we aren't doing as well as most would think are we? If I remember correctly Michael Moorers documentary about the Columbine killings reported more guns are owned by Canadians by household than any other country in the world. This issue of gun ownership will not be settled by those sitting in The House of Commons, The Senate or House of Representatives, it won't be settled in my lifetime or yours. Do what you think best for your family and yourselves. Let the NRA, IRA, PTA or whomever scream until they turn blue in the face and they pass out and leave me and my political, religious and moral beliefs mine and mine alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioFisherman Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 " With less than 5% of the world's population, the United States is home to roughly 35–50 per cent of the world's civilian-owned guns, heavily skewing the global geography of firearms and any relative comparison So, given those caveats, we can see which countries have the highest ownership rates for firearms - and which have the highest gun murder rates. The key facts are: • The US has the highest gun ownership rate in the world - an average of 88 per 100 people. That puts it first in the world for gun ownership - and even the number two country, Yemen, has significantly fewer - 54.8 per 100 people " http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-ownership-world-list Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cram Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Numbers of gun related murders in the US vs. Canada are approximately 10 to 1, numbers of citizens also 10 to 1. So we aren't doing as well as most would think are we? If I remember correctly Michael Moorers documentary about the Columbine killings reported more guns are owned by Canadians by household than any other country in the world. This issue of gun ownership will not be settled by those sitting in The House of Commons, The Senate or House of Representatives, it won't be settled in my lifetime or yours. Do what you think best for your family and yourselves. Let the NRA, IRA, PTA or whomever scream until they turn blue in the face and they pass out and leave me and my political, religious and moral beliefs mine and mine alone. 10x by rate, maybe. In terms of actual #'s it's more like 100x. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 (edited) My numbers are wrong 173 of 30 million is less per population than 10000 per 300 million. I stand corrected. Ohio, I don't agree with the numbers quoted in that internet link. Then of course if it's on the internet it must be true. Let us not let this debate get in the way of praying and if you don't pray thinking about the victims and survivors of this terrible crime by a few spineless individuals. It seems we are having this debate far too many times, it seems to be with regularity now. Pierce Morgan doesn't finish with one mass murder before another is being reported. I was a kid in the early 60's when it seemed someone was being assassinated every year, this gives me the exact feeling of despair and déjà vu. Edited September 17, 2013 by Old Ironmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioFisherman Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Iron, I am a gun owner, I have nothing against hunting legally or with people owning guns legally. It just seems the madness has to stop at some point? The rational society here at times seems completely irrational to me, it seems like a civilian arms race here. Some one makes a post on a gun website that Obama is going to take there guns? and the stores that sell them and ammo are packed. We were founded on revolution and getting more revolting all the time? Look at all the secession petitions they had going here from different states. Why? because a black guy is president? Political fear mongering by the opposing party? It wasn't mentioned when the last guy was in office. If my neighbor has 10 guns, do I really need 20? It's crazy, but some seem to thrive on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angler management Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Number of gun murders in Canada last year 173 Number of gun murders in US last year 9146 Nope, the number of guns ( specifically handguns) in the US, and the ease of obtaining them has nothing to do with it. Canadas population= 30million Usa population=300million Its kind of hard to compare the statistics between the two unless ofcourse youre multiplying the numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehg Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Canadas population= 30million Usa population=300million Its kind of hard to compare the statistics between the two unless ofcourse youre multiplying the numbers. 300/30 = 10 9146/173 = 52.76 Seems like there is 5 times a higher murder rate by guns in U.S than Canada. Its simple and obvious. No use denying this simple obvious fact. C'mon..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosebunk Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Working nights and sleeping days I almost wish the news didn't get reported at OFC this day. Sad to see this kind of thing... and becoming so common too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinker Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 I almost wish the news didn't get reported at OFC this day. Sad to see this kind of thing... and becoming so common too. Same here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Ironmaker Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 (edited) 300/30 = 10 9146/173 = 52.76 Seems like there is 5 times a higher murder rate by guns in U.S than Canada. Its simple and obvious. No use denying this simple obvious fact. C'mon..... It's 173 murders divided by 30 million citizens that's .0000057% of the population killed by people using guns in Canada It's 9146 murders divided by 300 million people that works out to .0003 % of US citizens killed by people using guns in the USA. As if it really matters here. Edited September 17, 2013 by Old Ironmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike rousseau Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Guns aren't the problem.... I could take my pickup truck and plow down a lot of people before I'd be stopped.... Or a knife in a busy place... Or a home made bomb... Of burn down a building full of people... This is a tragedy... And I feel bad for all the families affected.... Guns don't kill people... People kill people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTHM Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 The same typewriter that wrote Mien Kampf could also be used to write To kill a Mockingbird. It is the operator of the tool, not the tool itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Live2fish85 Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Canada and The United States are more similar than we think, I do somewhat agree with your statement... However, when was the last time something like this happened in Canada? Also - How easy is it to obtain hand guns and automatic assault rifles in Canada? In some parts in the States, it's as easy as showing them a drivers licence. Although we are very similar in some cultural aspects, the differences in gun legislation is the key difference maker imo. It is very easy to get hand guns and assault rifles in Canada and all legit over the counter. As long as the assault rifle is Semi-Automatic. Not very hard to get at all. Just thought I would throw that out there for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lookinforwalleye Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 America has a well established culture of violence and guns, brother against brother. The American economy is based on the manufacture and distribution of guns...just look at some of the TV shows guns are a staple shoot em up blow em up seems to be common theme....buy a car get a free rifle...open a bank account get free handgun!!! Some one said earlier that Canadians and Americans are more similar than we think...I respectfully disagree. People kill people and they use guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grimsbylander Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Nothing as complex as this issue can be narrowed down to one or two reasons. The obvious differences in population numbers certainly play a part in the equation as does the firearms accessibility factor. To say one or the other does not contribute is silly. Determining the degree of responsibility is extremely difficult and in light of the fact it's people's lives we're discussing, it's simply semantics. I would guess that there are a hundred contributing factors that could be compiled as to why this kind of thing happens more in the US or at all. Culture? Exposure? Ethnicity? Military focus? Economic pressure? Man's inhumanity to man is nothing new. Only the techniques have changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Nelson Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Guns aren't the problem.... I could take my pickup truck and plow down a lot of people before I'd be stopped.... Or a knife in a busy place... Or a home made bomb... Of burn down a building full of people... This is a tragedy... And I feel bad for all the families affected.... Guns don't kill people... People kill people... To say guns arent a major part of the problem is completely dilusional. If they werent the problem, then the knifes, bombs etc. should each be responsible for around the same number of deaths each year. All of the others combined dont even come close to gun murders, so open your eyes. Yes, people kill people ( mostly with guns if you look at facts) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarg Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 America has a well established culture of violence and guns, brother against brother. The American economy is based on the manufacture and distribution of guns...just look at some of the TV shows guns are a staple shoot em up blow em up seems to be common theme....buy a car get a free rifle...open a bank account get free handgun!!! Some one said earlier that Canadians and Americans are more similar than we think...I respectfully disagree. People kill people and they use guns. The american economy is not based upon the manufacture of guns, you don't seriously believe that do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarg Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 To say guns arent a major part of the problem is completely dilusional. If they werent the problem, then the knifes, bombs etc. should each be responsible for around the same number of deaths each year. All of the others combined dont even come close to gun murders, so open your eyes. Yes, people kill people ( mostly with guns if you look at facts) In Canada in recent years more people have been stabbed, and if i remember corectly, 2 of the last 3 years more people were stabbed to death than shot to death. So whats your solution, ban more guns? Which ones? Is there a sliding scale of mass murder efficiency that we can look to, no ar15's but semi 12 guages are ok? Because you certainly couldnt kill 12 people with one of those, or actually you could, easily. So maybe we ban those too, pump actions? Well gee, idk, but they seem like they could be pretty deadly, cant have em, single shots, well ok, but be careful because if we could ban those and it only saves one life it could be worth it. Rifles of any kind are another story, they are all basically sniper of potentially fully automatic baby killing machines so, their gone too. The vast majority of all of those murders you mentioned were by hand gun, but no one has even talked about banning them, and they wont be, instead people who hold your attitude are trying to ban firearms that are the weapon of choice less often than hands or feet. You can make an argument to ban any gun if your belief is that they are inherently bad and it could save a life, but then there are a lot of other things that we could ban for similar reasons, or we could accept living in a free society with the risks that come with it, which includes getting shot by a mad man, the good news is that gun violence and violent crime in general has been decreasing there and here, so your odds of being shot are less, but you wouldnt know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blarg Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 It is very easy to get hand guns and assault rifles in Canada and all legit over the counter. As long as the assault rifle is Semi-Automatic. Not very hard to get at all. Just thought I would throw that out there for you. O come now, it couldnt be the people in the country and the cultural differences between us that matter, if people can buy a semi auto, scary looking black rifle, they will use it to kill people, even if it functions and fires the same amunition as a non restricted non scary looking rifle, how dare you attempt to inject rational thought and facts into a debate like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch312 Posted September 17, 2013 Report Share Posted September 17, 2013 Sorry, but you are sadly misinformed. Yes, gun crimes happen with stolen guns, this is 100% true, also gun crimes happen with legally bought guns, 100% true as well. I'm not talking about hunting rifles, this is totally different - I'm talking about hand guns and assault rifles that are easily accessible and available in the USA in different states. You don’t have crimes like this happening in Canada due to the types of guns we can access with the proper licensing, however the criminals will always find a way to access whatever they want. Sorry, but it's people like you who rely on the media for your "facts" and you are the one who is sadly misinformed. This doesn't happen in Canada because of the firearms we can or cannot access? The shotgun he used to kill is 100 % accessible by anyone in Canada with a firearms license. The AR-15 he took from the murdered guard is 100 % accessible by anyone in Canada who chooses to write the restricted firearms exam. No, this is NOT totally different than hunting firearms we're permitted to use here. Know why? Because the AR-15 he used is NO DIFFERENT than ANY semi automatic firearm that Canadians use for hunting, including semi auto's many of our grandfathers used. I'm not sure if you're aware of this or not, but handguns are easily accessible here in Canada too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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