Musky or Specks Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 (edited) Ok, got my answer - "The ROM survey (1990/91) identified brookies and the MNR lake (1958) survey id'ed lakers. She apparently was stocked with artic char a few years after that (of course the artic char are long gone). She may be fished out, small enough for it to happen." What's your source for the lack of fish today? As stated, from researching your map this summer I decided to call up the bio in the park(Whitney) as Kathlyn looked like an interesting lake to try. The bio explained to me the history of the lake and also the ecology of Sa Sa Je Wan Lake which is only a seasonal lake with virtually no water in the summer.(Which makes it impassable to canoes) Its brook trout population would only exist as fish that migrate into and out of it from the Madawaska River during early spring. Your sources actually jive prretty much with what he said. They tried for years to establish a population but for whatever reason they just don't take. Edited February 5, 2013 by Musky or Specks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceCfisher86 Posted February 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Nice to see you over here Jeffrey! Pat what kind of Fishing are you looking to do, and what time of year? It makes a difference but for the record... Jeffreys map is a great info source on picking your species for sure. Pick your taget species, combine that with the right time of year and set up properly...bobs your unlce. A buddy and I are heading the first week of May for brookies! Hopefully the ice is out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffreym Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Lack of fish as in a lack of Brook Trout? Lack of brook + lake trout Nice to see you over here Jeffrey! Pat what kind of Fishing are you looking to do, and what time of year? It makes a difference but for the record... Jeffreys map is a great info source on picking your species for sure. Pick your taget species, combine that with the right time of year and set up properly...bobs your unlce. You too Cookslav! As stated, from researching your map this summer I decided to call up the bio in the park(Whitney) as Kathlyn looked like an interesting lake to try. The bio explained to me the history of the lake and also the ecology of Sa Sa Je Wan Lake which is only a seasonal lake with virtually no water in the summer.(Which makes it impassable to canoes) Its brook trout population would only exist as fish that migrate into and out of it from the Madawaska River during early spring. Your sources actually jive prretty much with what he said. They tried for years to establish a population but for whatever reason they just don't take. Oh sorry, my misunderstanding. I hadn't realized what you meant when you said 'the AP bio'. I'm really curious about Sasajewun being seasonal since it's dammed. There must be awfully little water coming down the North Madawaska if that's the case. Hopefully I'll get a chance to check it out in the summer . If I do I'll report back. A buddy and I are heading the first week of May for brookies! Hopefully the ice is out! Fingers crossed. Wouldn't that be a change from last year eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oggie Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Great resource Jeff. I worked for the MNR surveying lakes in the area below highway 60 (Louisa, Welcome, Harry, Rence etc) in the 1970s and up on the east side near Achray. To determine species present we used gill nets. The MNR survey in Grand Lake from 1968 has smallmouth bass present. Not so! I think they miss identified rock bass for smallmouth and they assumed because it was right beside the railroad (the source of most smallmouth stocking) it would have bass in it. I see campers every year casting the surface in the summer. Dan O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffreym Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Very good to know! Thanks Here's what one of the fisheries guys I talked to said: "Fascinating. I've never caught a smallmouth in Grand Lake, or in St. Andrews or Stratton L for that matter, despite them being identified as a species in each (and having fished Grand and St. Andrews). I'd remove SB from those 3 lakes. We surveyed Grand L in 1990 using gill nets and seines and didn't catch any smallmouth and I too have seen people fishing for them using jitterbugs and such. Never seen anyone catch any either but I just continued to assume they were there. Grand, Stratton and St. Andrews do have rock bass. Ironic that smallies wouldn't be there with all the traffic, easy access and size of her." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garfisher Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Lack of Brook Trout is pretty simple to explain. Almost any Algonquin lake that has Smallmouth in it will not have Brook Trout, due to competition with Smallmouth as they are usually more aggressive feeders (I think there are a few lakes that do have both in them still). I know in Smoke Lake there is a good population of Lakers present, as well as plenty of Smallmouths (the largest we netted last fall was around 2lbs or so, however there are probably much larger ones around). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musky or Specks Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Jeff that Research station on Sasajewan is actually a wetland Research station to study flora and amphibians according to what the bio was telling me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffreym Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Lack of Brook Trout is pretty simple to explain. Almost any Algonquin lake that has Smallmouth in it will not have Brook Trout, due to competition with Smallmouth as they are usually more aggressive feeders (I think there are a few lakes that do have both in them still). I know in Smoke Lake there is a good population of Lakers present, as well as plenty of Smallmouths (the largest we netted last fall was around 2lbs or so, however there are probably much larger ones around). Kathlyn L doesn't have Smallmouth in it - otherwise I'd agree Jeff that Research station on Sasajewan is actually a wetland Research station to study flora and amphibians according to what the bio was telling me. The Sasajewun research station is for wildlife - that I'm certain. I'm not sure if that covers amphibians or not, but I'd expect it'd only cover flora in the context of wildlife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceCfisher86 Posted February 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) Lack of brook + lake trout You too Cookslav! Oh sorry, my misunderstanding. I hadn't realized what you meant when you said 'the AP bio'. I'm really curious about Sasajewun being seasonal since it's dammed. There must be awfully little water coming down the North Madawaska if that's the case. Hopefully I'll get a chance to check it out in the summer . If I do I'll report back. Fingers crossed. Wouldn't that be a change from last year eh? This is my first time spring fishing in the park! Were most the lakes still froze over beginning to mid of May last year? Edited February 6, 2013 by Pat C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffreym Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 This is my first time spring fishing in the park! Were most the lakes still froze over beginning to mid of May last year? Nope. Last year was a record breaker - March 26th. That's not normal though. http://www.canoelake.ca/iceout/historical-ice-out-dates.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookslav Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Hey Pat, Just a heads up that historically Smoke lake can be bit finicky for the opener...being a bigger lake it "can" be late thawing. That and its a surprisingly large lake that tends to blow up in hurry which when heavily loaded for a trip...can be dangerous in that fridgid water. Hopefully your experienced in a canoe or in a group? Either way I'd exersise caution...I've been on Smoke and set sail in what looked like easy chop, but it quickly became more then chop LOL... Just bare that in mind when planning is all I'm say'n If your confident in your ability, or have a group for added safety your probobly golden but incase of nasty weather or late Ice....Make some Back up plans. The porcupine route is a nice one for early trout BTW. Its not what I would call a "banner" route for specs but it should satisfy your needs for a laker or chance spec. Don't be afraid to explore some of the smaller lakes and creeks around. Lotta folks stay on the well beaten path and those lesser traveled area's sometimes hold some gems Lack of Brook Trout is pretty simple to explain. Almost any Algonquin lake that has Smallmouth in it will not have Brook Trout, due to competition with Smallmouth Normally I would agree, but in truth...I've caught some of my biggest specs in Lakes with high populations of Bass. The tricky part is in these Algonquin lakes the Spec habbitat in the spring tends to be same areas Bass are spawning in. I find Spring I can still locate them in the mouths of creeks, Boulders, shoals and fallen lumber as you would think but come the summer months in those bass lakes its like they all but disapear. I wonder if they are feeding on the Bass roe, or fry inbetween the hatch???? Actually now that I'm thinking about it....the Saugeen is similar? I've caught many an incidental Bass over the years while spring Spec fishing in the spring. mmm....food for thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceCfisher86 Posted February 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Nope. Last year was a record breaker - March 26th. That's not normal though. http://www.canoelake.ca/iceout/historical-ice-out-dates.html That sure is early! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceCfisher86 Posted February 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Hey Pat, Just a heads up that historically Smoke lake can be bit finicky for the opener...being a bigger lake it "can" be late thawing. That and its a surprisingly large lake that tends to blow up in hurry which when heavily loaded for a trip...can be dangerous in that fridgid water. Hopefully your experienced in a canoe or in a group? Either way I'd exersise caution...I've been on Smoke and set sail in what looked like easy chop, but it quickly became more then chop LOL... Just bare that in mind when planning is all I'm say'n If your confident in your ability, or have a group for added safety your probobly golden but incase of nasty weather or late Ice....Make some Back up plans. The porcupine route is a nice one for early trout BTW. Its not what I would call a "banner" route for specs but it should satisfy your needs for a laker or chance spec. Don't be afraid to explore some of the smaller lakes and creeks around. Lotta folks stay on the well beaten path and those lesser traveled area's sometimes hold some gems Normally I would agree, but in truth...I've caught some of my biggest specs in Lakes with high populations of Bass. The tricky part is in these Algonquin lakes the Spec habbitat in the spring tends to be same areas Bass are spawning in. I find Spring I can still locate them in the mouths of creeks, Boulders, shoals and fallen lumber as you would think but come the summer months in those bass lakes its like they all but disapear. I wonder if they are feeding on the Bass roe, or fry inbetween the hatch???? Actually now that I'm thinking about it....the Saugeen is similar? I've caught many an incidental Bass over the years while spring Spec fishing in the spring. mmm....food for thought Thanks for the info,I'm not that experienced in a canoe, in Algonquin that is, so I'll definatly keep that in mind! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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