OhioFisherman Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 http://www.canadaupdates.com/content/canadian-tourism-suffers-due-us-visa-restrictions and then there was this? I have seen some wack jobs here proclaim you can`t be a real American if you spend your vacation money outside the USA. Which seems to be code for we will make it harder for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigugli Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 Well, I figured this topic may become controvercial and have some negative feedback. I can understand why many people feel that no matter what we do it will not make a difference. The government does not have the best track record at times. The bottom line is, we are a special interest group, and not a small one. I feel that we are a large enough special interest group that lobbying the government can make a difference. Other special interest groups lobby the government successfully all the time. Even a bunch of small improvements for anglers annually can be a victory for us. We shouldn't expect everything to be solved overnight and be all better with a few letters. We are not asking the government to do the impossible, just continue to make improvements for anglers and let them hear our voice. We live in a democratic society that allows free speech and lobbying our government. Why not utilize the tools we were given to try and help make our passion in life even better. What do we really have to loose? A small amount of our time to send a few letters may put our sport in the spotlight in Ottawa a little more, create more awareness and add political pressure to make improvements. Remember the old saying "the squeeky wheel gets the greese"? I believe that we can help make a difference if we all work together. There is another old saying "united we stand tall, divided we fall". I don't want to just sit and watch further degradation of our great sport. I really love fishing in Ontario and would like to see improvements. Don't we all? Who knows, if there are improvements to fishing in Ontario and more public awareness, it just may get more people into our great pastime and grow. Growth for our sport would be a good thing. I can spend the time to draft a letter and post it here, but we need real support from anglers in order to make this work. One squeeky wheel 100 miles from Ottawa will not be heard. Aaron As I had stated previously, our opposition is very well organized. We could do to learn a few lessons from them. We need to take up memberships in sporting clubs and use those clubs as our lobbying force. The OFAH is one umbrella lobby organization, but it is not enough. Clubs also have to develop a positive public presence with lots of media attention. We like our quiet and isolation when fishing and that is good, but our public image must be loud and visible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Shirley Posted January 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 As I had stated previously, our opposition is very well organized. We could do to learn a few lessons from them. We need to take up memberships in sporting clubs and use those clubs as our lobbying force. The OFAH is one umbrella lobby organization, but it is not enough. Clubs also have to develop a positive public presence with lots of media attention. We like our quiet and isolation when fishing and that is good, but our public image must be loud and visible. I believe that organizations like OFAH is very important and do a good job of lobbying, as well as the smaller clubs. I'm not trying to take anything away from them. Getting involved with OFAH and/or local groups help. I think it would only help our cause to add additional lobbying from anglers here, as the unique visitors on this site is substantial and mostly from Ontario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest blairwelsh Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 (edited) *SMILES* Edited February 1, 2011 by SecretSpot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aplumma Posted January 13, 2011 Report Share Posted January 13, 2011 With calmer heads we can continue this discussion. Art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted January 13, 2011 Report Share Posted January 13, 2011 With calmer heads we can continue this discussion. Art Are you new??? Spouting our half baked crackpot ideas is all we've got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aplumma Posted January 13, 2011 Report Share Posted January 13, 2011 I feel on review I cheated Aaron of his chance to have the discussion he deserves. I am trying to repair a mistake I made. I hope it does not come back to bite me... Art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickingfrog Posted January 13, 2011 Report Share Posted January 13, 2011 mea culpa. While I was poking fun at you and me primarily, I didn't relise this had been locked (short term memory issues). Most of us feel strongly about this, where we differ is who, how and exactly what needs to be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walleyejigger Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) unfortunately i didnt allow enough time for fishing discussions with my local MP. He actually called the house last night (very weird) to talk about future elections and i didnt even give him another 2 seconds to talk, I informed our NDP rep. that the boondoggle of the gun registry threw all his credibility out the door and there was no need for further discussions as i could not trust anything he told me, i then hung up i had contacted his office 2 weeks before the registry vote and they told me his office was overwhelmed with calls, letters, and emails to squash the registry, and their party would be voting in that direction, yet at the last minute "he" changed "his" mind Edited January 14, 2011 by walleyejigger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerritt Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Thank you for the continued debate on this thread. G Edited January 14, 2011 by Spiel To keep it from derailing, again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ThisPlaceSucks Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 very fed up with the present government and our natural resources (wasn't impressed with mike harris either) http://ontora.ca/ the liberals are cutting off some of the finest fishing in the province and giving "remote" tourists exclusivity. nature for those who can afford it. the group i posted above is looking for donations as they are retaining a lawyer to challenge the mnr in court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ThisPlaceSucks Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 how about this "toronto-speak" from the minister... http://ontora.ca/mnr-minister-jeffrey-questioned-in-legislature/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimace Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) What I have a problem with is the fact that the Mnr had stated that certain lakes are legal to fish yet illegal to access via logging roads. Edited January 14, 2011 by Grimace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 ... Politics ... Scrap fishing licenses and gun registry because anyone with 1/4 of a brain can see both are counter productive to the outdoorsman right now and even less productive to the MNR! CO's are checking fishing licenses, handing out fines, but that money isn't going to their budget? ONTARIO IN A NUTSHELL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 Great thread Aron and you are absolutely right in what you're trying to say. The fisheries in Ontario have never been in worst shape in history under the current government,I'm 49yrs old and I worked for the MNR for 9yrs in the 80's and I thought things were bad then, but to be honest I never thought our fishery would end like this. Not only is our great lakes fishery privatly responsible for raising and stocking our streams the MNR is now putting a stop on our pen rearing releases. The fisherman of Lake Ontario raise and stock the salmon going into our lake, we want to pen the fish, the MNR has steped in and refused anymore Pens untill further study, which means screwed up no more pens.Even if we go on our own to improve our fisheries the MNR will put a cease order on it, you can't win, giving them more $$$ is not the answer they have to much power and not enough knowledge now . As to DrS,s is post you hit the nail on the head the current minister is out for a few tourist opertators, she's not the minister of natural resources but the minister of thanks for the $$$$$$$$$$, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 very fed up with the present government and our natural resources (wasn't impressed with mike harris either) http://ontora.ca/ the liberals are cutting off some of the finest fishing in the province and giving "remote" tourists exclusivity. nature for those who can afford it. the group i posted above is looking for donations as they are retaining a lawyer to challenge the mnr in court. great post dude I never knew this was going on, I'm sorry your leaving the MNR, as a graduate of Sir Sandrord Fleming/82 and working contracts for 8yrs I feel your hurt, the MNR feels like a dead end street and in fact it is unless your willing to change and move around. Being newly married and such it may be time to change your perspective, I hope you still keep your love for the outdoors the problem you have now your old job and working outdoors is going to haunt you always, I hope you come to grips with it, you'll never be happy again untill your working for the resources.Good luck welding......money good , life crap...keep trying your passion money crap.. life great and that really is what it's all about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chessy Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 when ofah has a pay out of over 2 million dollars in employees and one person there makes between 166 000 -199 999 and there office expensis are almost 1.1 millon they dont care about fishing or hunting just lining there pockets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 when ofah has a pay out of over 2 million dollars in employees and one person there makes between 166 000 -199 999 and there office expensis are almost 1.1 millon they dont care about fishing or hunting just lining there pockets I completly agree they take millions of dollars and lobby for nothing they have turned into the biggest scam in Ontario history. They in fact lobbied for the fishing licsense to enhance our fishery, once it was made it our fishery suffered. The OFAH is one of the biggest scams in the province, there a profit organisation, that has done little to nothing to improve fisheries.They say there the voice of the Ontario angler but I wonder at 2 million a year our voice is not heard. It's a scam they prey on our disgruntlness(new word maybe)but never do anything.....unless they get a government kickback. They sleep with the enemy the OFAH is a scam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Posted January 14, 2011 Report Share Posted January 14, 2011 MHO is that OFAH is the only voice (of any consequence) that Ontario anglers and hunters have. If you cut them down, you'll be shooting yourself in the foot. Maybe work with them to bring positive ideas and results to the table? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chessy Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 i have tried that roy. and if it does not profit them they dont want it .. for instance this case is not fishing but hunting . the northumberland county forest was doing update on activities to be held on the land . one mayor ask the ofah to attend . the ofah said they would participate and there suggestion was that ever hunter have a ofah membership to hunt there . the commitee voted that down . then at the end the mayors of the county asked for a meeting and the ofah said they would be there , You guessed it no one showed . the mayor said if ofah could not show up than hunting must not be a big deal and we lost hunting in certain areas. The mayor had emails from the ofah saying they would come . when they did not i asked why and they said they did not know about the meeting . when the documents were presented they said oh that meeting and said there was a family emergency . i could see that but not one other person could not show..... this is just one of many situations i have been involved with . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 MHO is that OFAH is the only voice (of any consequence) that Ontario anglers and hunters have. If you cut them down, you'll be shooting yourself in the foot. Maybe work with them to bring positive ideas and results to the table? The OFAH has lobbied the fishing & hunting comunity into think there the only voice we have, they have created a monopoly and such have used the ontario, hunters& fishers to line there pockets with $$$$$$$$.I do in fact relise the need for a voice but we should not keep fund a corupt organisation. The voice is not being herd although the OFAH says they are doing there best it's a scam. The OFAH lays down with government and other organisations continually they do not fight for the hunter's and fishers of the province, if a win for us takes place they take full credit when it's ussually a local club or organisation that made it happen.The OFAH is a freaking money grubbing scam they have nothing to lobby legislation in Ontario government,roll over on ontario tax payer legislation. As far as local legislation there no where to be seen, it's up to our local clubs to change minds, however if we do get a win the OFAH is all over it. There a scam and should be gone or in need of an overhall, I think GONE!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 (edited) i have tried that roy. and if it does not profit them they dont want it .. for instance this case is not fishing but hunting . the northumberland county forest was doing update on activities to be held on the land . one mayor ask the ofah to attend . the ofah said they would participate and there suggestion was that ever hunter have a ofah membership to hunt there . the commitee voted that down . then at the end the mayors of the county asked for a meeting and the ofah said they would be there , You guessed it no one showed . the mayor said if ofah could not show up than hunting must not be a big deal and we lost hunting in certain areas. The mayor had emails from the ofah saying they would come . when they did not i asked why and they said they did not know about the meeting . when the documents were presented they said oh that meeting and said there was a family emergency . i could see that but not one other person could not show..... this is just one of many situations i have been involved with . EXACTLY....but they come to collect the $$$$$ the OFAH never misses the $$$$$$$ Edited January 15, 2011 by canadadude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 This is somthing that may open your eyes, When the ontario fishing licsence was lobbied for by the OFAH the intent was to enhance our fishery not to pay for the entire fishery. The MNR at the time relied on monies from the big pot, they were given a budget, well the OFAH said lets have a licsence to give more $$$$ to the fishery, hence the fishing liscence was established with the agreement the extra revenue would enhance the fishery. Since that big stupid mistake the government decided the MNR will be funded by liscence fees and no monies from the big pot will be given to the MNR. So instead of enhancing our fishery& hunting oportunities with province we in such shot our selves in the foot, we lost $$$ the fishing liscence was ment to enhance the province but they used the extra to fit the whole bill we lost big time. In fact we still loose because any hatchery of use to the province is privatly done by volunteers and local persons. Now then my problem with the OFAH is they know as much as I do how the provinces fishery has been stollen from us anglers, they were in fact the one's who lobbied for the provincial fishing liscence. Yet since then they have never in fact riased a voice when the monies were taken from the budget, not a peep, they knew we were getting screwed from the start but still loobied for a liscence.They were a big player in getting a provincial liscence , they got the angler aproval at the time but they lied and scewed the us, and to this day they still use there monopoply for being a voice to screw the anglers/hunters of ontario.They sleep with enemy for $$$$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 This is somthing that may open your eyes, When the ontario fishing licsence was lobbied for by the OFAH the intent was to enhance our fishery not to pay for the entire fishery. The MNR at the time relied on monies from the big pot, they were given a budget, well the OFAH said lets have a licsence to give more $$$$ to the fishery, hence the fishing liscence was established with the agreement the extra revenue would enhance the fishery. Since that big stupid mistake the government decided the MNR will be funded by liscence fees and no monies from the big pot will be given to the MNR. So instead of enhancing our fishery& hunting oportunities with province we in such shot our selves in the foot, we lost $$$ the fishing liscence was ment to enhance the province but they used the extra to fit the whole bill we lost big time. In fact we still loose because any hatchery of use to the province is privatly done by volunteers and local persons. Now then my problem with the OFAH is they know as much as I do how the provinces fishery has been stollen from us anglers, they were in fact the one's who lobbied for the provincial fishing liscence. Yet since then they have never in fact riased a voice when the monies were taken from the budget, not a peep, they knew we were getting screwed from the start but still loobied for a liscence.They were a big player in getting a provincial liscence , they got the angler aproval at the time but they lied and scewed the us, and to this day they still use there monopoply for being a voice to screw the anglers/hunters of ontario.They sleep with enemy for $$$$$$ What a load of dung dude. They throw that in the governments face every chance they get. That and the bear hunt. They call the government out on the broken promise because the government promised to match the funding raised by anglers dollar for dollar. The government reneged and the OFAH will not only never let them forget it but they lobby constantly for the province to restore funding and honour their side of that deal. This isn't the only scenario where the government has done this to us. Think about where the licence plate sticker was supposed to go. Right back into the roads. Do you think all of our licence fees go back into the roads or the general pot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadadude Posted January 15, 2011 Report Share Posted January 15, 2011 What a load of dung dude. They throw that in the governments face every chance they get. That and the bear hunt. They call the government out on the broken promise because the government promised to match the funding raised by anglers dollar for dollar. The government reneged and the OFAH will not only never let them forget it but they lobby constantly for the province to restore funding and honour their side of that deal. This isn't the only scenario where the government has done this to us. Think about where the licence plate sticker was supposed to go. Right back into the roads. Do you think all of our licence fees go back into the roads or the general pot? Come on Dan, it's not a load of dung, they fall over to the government consistantly, they lost on the fishing liscence, again on the spring bear hunt, when are you going to relise the OFAH is just out for your $$$$$, they clain to lobby for the angler/hunter but give me a break they win the odd local battle just enough to keep it legitatment. There a scam they fund each other for guided deer hunts and phesent shooting on Pele island, not to mention there sweet camps up north. At one time the OFAH was a force they lost it when the provincial fishing liscence was established. They were bought out then and it's been a scam on every OFAH member since,they have not sucessully lobbied for anything since and in fact they have gave more of our rights to the government then they have protected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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